Father Son

[sharp9]

Are there any father son possibilities coming up for the Swan's in the next couple of years?

I note that there has beena change to the rules rushed through in time to affect theis year's draft

Teams can now have TWO F/S's in one year. (for a 3rd and a 2nd rnd pick)

I wonder who would benefit from that...Now let me see

IN 2003 COLLINGWOOD WILL UTILISE THE NEW RULE TO PICK TWO MORE SHAW BOYS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The AFL has promised in a press release to create a committee specifically charged with the task of creating new ways to ensure Collingwood always gets the easiest deal in every situation known to mankind.

[Angelic Upstart]

Didn't Luke Ball's dad used to play for South in the seventies? He'd be a handy pick up.

[liz]

I have no problem with the change to the rule - but I am relieved they have stood firm on giving up a second round (and then first round) pick for subsequent F&S selections. I can't believe that clubs (esp Geelong) are bleating about this. It's one thing to be given the option to secure these players but they seem to want to be able to get them for nothing. From what I've read the two Shaw boys, Blake and Ablett III (if he wants to be drafted) are highly rated prospects who would probably be taken with 1st or 2nd round picks in the normal course of events. So they're hardly being dudded by the rules.

[sharp9]

NO,NO,NO,NO,NO,NO,NO!!!

It's a third and then a second. Nice. And a first if you want a third one.

[sydnophile]

More to the point, I reckon ALL the drafting rules are crap.
A player should be able to play for whoever THEY WANT to.

The salary cap ALREADY provides a safeguard that one club can't overspend on players compared to any other club.

Provided that a player is not currently under contract to any other club, I can't see why it isn't their LEGAL RIGHT to sell their services for what they can get to whichever Club wants their services the most.

These ridiculous rules are a restriction of trade and should've been "thrown out of court" years ago. (In fact they have been many times, but the AFL chooses to ignore that.)

[sharp9]

Surely you are joking. There is no restraint of trade because after two years you can name your price and conditions before the pre season draft.

Who's trade has been restrained? Buckley, Nick Davis, Chris Judd?

I don't know if you are new to football as well as being ignorant of American sport, but prior to the draft and the cap (League has one of those too) musch less than half the competition was capable of fielding a decent team and nearly all the decent players were pilfered by Carlton, Essendon, Hawthorn and the Magpies.

Gee, I bet you wish we could go back to that system! The whole bloody competition run by crooks with fat cheque books (actually now that I think about it that would be appropriate for an Australian competition )

If there were any legality whatsoever to your claims then the American system (Basketball and Football) would have fallen over a million years ago. And don't be an idiot and say something pathetic like "But American laws are different."

Or maybe you'd prefer things the way it is with the soccer in Europe where Beckham, Figo, Ronaldo, Raul and Zidane are IN ONE TEAM!!!

Gee, I bet Zaragoza is champing at the bit to produce it's next young champion who might play 7 games for his team before getting offered a salary equivilant to the whole squad. That sure makes for a riveting, even competition.

Funny thing how people keep saying what an even, open ladder we have this year. Gee......I wonder why that is? (and this despite Collingwood continually attempting to rort the system - and usually succeeding)

[sydnophile]

Originally posted by sharp9
Who's trade has been restrained? Buckley, Nick Davis, Chris Judd?

Yes them. Thanks for reminding me.
Did Buckley WANT to play for the Bears?
If Collingwood hadn't AGREED to let Nick Davis go where would he be now? At Collingwood.

Anyway, just because you think you named a handful of players that (you claim) aren't or haven't been restricted doesn't mean that there aren't any. That's a false argument.

.. prior to the draft and the cap [snip] less than half the competition was capable of fielding a decent team and nearly all the decent players were pilfered by Carlton, Essendon, Hawthorn and the Magpies.

That situation would have been solved by the salary cap, assuming there was a salary imbalance. But neither you or I have the figures to prove that, or to demonstrate the extent of the alleged imbalance.

Gee, I bet you wish we could go back to that system! The whole bloody competition run by crooks with fat cheque books

Oh yeah. Bring on the crooks with fat cheque books.
I'm suggesting that footballers shouldn't be traded like cattle. Does that bother you?

Funny thing how people keep saying what an even, open ladder we have this year. Gee......I wonder why that is?

But it's not so funny when people start to think the comp is a farce made up of a bunch of totally interchangable talent being TOLD where to play - all in the name of "even-ing up the competition".

(and this despite Collingwood continually attempting to rort the system - and usually succeeding)

Let me see...
Essendon HAVE BEEN fined for rorting the salary cap.
Melbourne HAVE BEEN fined for rorting the salary cap.
Carlton HAVE BEEN fined for rorting the salary cap.

IF THERE'S SOME SECRET you're hiding about Collingwood then you are DUTY BOUND to tell it to the AFL.

[aflconvert]

Originally posted by sydnophile
More to the point, I reckon ALL the drafting rules are crap.
A player should be able to play for whoever THEY WANT to.

The salary cap ALREADY provides a safeguard that one club can't overspend on players compared to any other club.

Provided that a player is not currently under contract to any other club, I can't see why it isn't their LEGAL RIGHT to sell their services for what they can get to whichever Club wants their services the most.

These ridiculous rules are a restriction of trade and should've been "thrown out of court" years ago. (In fact they have been many times, but the AFL chooses to ignore that.)

I dont agree with Sydnophile on this one .. I think the draft is a good thing but he is right on one thing .. it could be thrown out of court. it's just a matter of someone challenging the system.
As my name suggests I'm a convert from Rubgy League and I can
well remember when the then ARL tried to bring in a draft.

Terry Hill didnt want to go where he was drafted ; he sat the season out while the rule was challenged .. and it got thrown out

One day somebody/some club will challenge the rule just hope its not for a while yet

[barry]

Originally posted by aflconvert
I dont agree with Sydnophile on this one .. I think the draft is a good thing but he is right on one thing .. it could be thrown out of court. it's just a matter of someone challenging the system.
As my name suggests I'm a convert from Rubgy League and I can
well remember when the then ARL tried to bring in a draft.

Terry Hill didnt want to go where he was drafted ; he sat the season out while the rule was challenged .. and it got thrown out

One day somebody/some club will challenge the rule just hope its not for a while yet

The RL draft was a lot different to our one. And our one has been refined over time to exclude any legal loopholes.
Its hard legally to initially bring in a draft because you have existing players, but once its been in for a while it becomes watertight because as of now every AFL player signed a contract when he first entered the AFL containing draft clauses.

AFL has the great benefit of being the only aussie rules comp where you can make a living. The NRL always had England as an alternative. Now the NRL spans two countries (NZ), so their chances of ever getting a draft has just about gone.

[GoBloods]

father/son

yes luke ball's father , ray ball played for the swans but under old father/son laws, ray hadn't played 50 premiership matches for the swans. so the swans couldn't select him.
young morrison at brisbane is the son of 70's swans player peter morrison . peter played approx.90 games for swans , so don't know why we didn't go for him.
hilton kotzur early 80's player, his son is now playing for nsw/act rams u/18s , but like the ball situation , hilton hadn't played required number of games( which i think now has been increased to 100) to qualify his son under f/s rule