Protecting the Ball Carrier,

[NMWBloods]

Originally posted by Snowy
Well I watch a lot of shepherds being made which are probably good as a disciplined measure but in reality don't actually achieve a lot. I'm not saying they shouldn't happen and they create good habits but I think if a bloke is legitimately shepherding within a contest it gets counted regardless of its effectiveness, just like a lot of the tackles laid at stoppages simply effect another ball-up but are not crunching tackles. That is why some of the likes of Hayes, Kirk and Obree get credited with so many because they are often the last bloke to lay the tackle before the whistle goes.

Yep - they get a lot of tackles, but the stats also record 'effective tackles' which go beyond the problem you allude to. I believe that shepherding stats are similar in that they look for effectiveness not just effort.

[DST]

While we don't get many plaudits from the Melbourne Media Mafia the one that is consistently bought up is that we play the most disciplined, well drilled brand of football in the compertition.

When talking about shepherding it is a fundemental part of the game and I would assume that if the coaching panel wanted more protection of the ball carrier we as a disciplined, well drilled team it would be carried out in spades.

So therefore I tend to agree with others that it is not an area of concern for the coaching staff and in fact may be a planned style of play at present.

DST

[NMWBloods]

I'd be curious to understand the rationale behind that then as I can't see in what way it couldn't benefit us when running forward or when contesting loose balls.

Interestingly though, there is talk about how we are so disciplined yet earlier in the season when our game plan was being caned, Roos said that it was not our game plan. Therefore the players were not following it, hence raises questions about just how discipline we are relative to any team. It always seems like one of those throw-away comments, such as Walls makes - elements of truth to it, but not significantly different to other top sides.

[giant]

Originally posted by Go Swannies

The lack of sherpherding frustrates me too - and I'd like to understand why we don't. I bet Paul Roos won't tell us, either.

ROK Lobster Responds thread.

Actually, I suspect it must be part of the game plan (or at least absent from the game plan) but I can't think why off the top of my head.

[Rizzo]

You can see the effect the shepherds have on the style of play. The 'Aints and Weagles always seem to have plenty of time to make that hand ball or kick and as such appear to make better decisions.

Anyone feel like doing some correlation of shepherds vs clangers?

[dread and might]

^^
I refuse to believe that footballers or coaches could possibly know more than 'net addicts

[connolly]

Originally posted by NMWBloods
Are you sure? Most of those 1%ers are effective stats not just attempts I believe.

As a comparison, Adelaide like to run the ball through their midfield. They also often follow up a handball with a shepherd, thus giving the receiver a second to compose himself. We rarely do this, which might be why we fling the ball around with a flurry of handballs or kick the ball quickly without spotting up a target, as we are known to do.

And before someone says 'yes, but look at where on the ladder we are', think about that we're 4th and we might be even higher if our running game was even more effective.

Shepherding is a facet of the game going the way of the place kick and ankle boots. The rule prohibiting bumping and blocking an opposition player when the opposition players is 5 metres from the ball has something to do with that [15.4.5(e)]. Also the Swans style is for the non-possessors to run to space when we are in possession not to the ball carrier. This tactic was developed some years ago and discussed in the standard coaching manual
Awake, O sword, against my shepherd, and against the man [that is] my fellow, saith the LORD of hosts: smite the shepherd, and the sheep shall be scattered: and I will turn mine hand upon the little ones. Zechariah 13

[Go Swannies]

Originally posted by jimmyconnolly
This tactic was developed some years ago and discussed in the standard coaching manual
Awake, O sword, against my shepherd, and against the man [that is] my fellow, saith the LORD of hosts: smite the shepherd, and the sheep shall be scattered: and I will turn mine hand upon the little ones. Zechariah 13

And thus it came to pass.

Exactly how old is your standard caching manual??

And wouldn't you give away 50m if you smite the shepherd? And tell Zechariah to leave Bucky and Schneids alone!

[NMWBloods]

Originally posted by jimmyconnolly
Shepherding is a facet of the game going the way of the place kick and ankle boots. The rule prohibiting bumping and blocking an opposition player when the opposition players is 5 metres from the ball has something to do with that [15.4.5(e)]. Also the Swans style is for the non-possessors to run to space when we are in possession not to the ball carrier. This tactic was developed some years ago and discussed in the standard coaching manual
Awake, O sword, against my shepherd, and against the man [that is] my fellow, saith the LORD of hosts: smite the shepherd, and the sheep shall be scattered: and I will turn mine hand upon the little ones. Zechariah 13

Interesting that other teams are still using it to good effect...

Shepherding and our running game are not mutually exclusive despite some claims to the contrary here.

[connolly]

It would be interesting to see someone (LRT perhaps?) try to shepherd for Leaping when he goes on one of his existential runs out of defence. Be a bit like asking Fred Astair to partner a break dancer. As they say - I'd like to see that

[Go Swannies]

Originally posted by NMWBloods
Interesting that other teams are still using it to good effect...

Shepherding and our running game are not mutually exclusive despite some claims to the contrary here.

I don't think it's a "claim" that the Swans don't shepherd much - it's a fact. Aren't we just trying to work out why?

[NMWBloods]

Originally posted by Go Swannies
I don't think it's a "claim" that the Swans don't shepherd much - it's a fact. Aren't we just trying to work out why?

I can see why there are so many disagreement with this reading comprehension.

It's been a claim that we don't shepherd because of our running game - I don't think that is a good reason for not doing so.

[dimelb]

Originally posted by jimmyconnolly

Awake, O sword, against my shepherd, and against the man [that is] my fellow, saith the LORD of hosts: smite the shepherd, and the sheep shall be scattered: and I will turn mine hand upon the little ones. Zechariah 13

I suspect it's a matter of punctuation.
The Lord is. My shepherd I shall not want.

[Go Swannies]

Originally posted by dimelb
I suspect it's a matter of punctuation.
The Lord is. My shepherd I shall not want.

Particularly if he maketh me lie down in green pastures.