News coming out of Pre Season training !

[BeeEmmAre]

Originally posted by Pekay
Early deadline was agreed to by the Jets and the league,and was also made to keep the draw stable-we dropped pretty close to the season start last year,sending the Div 1 draw into chaos.So we agreed to do it early A.for other clubs,and B.for the admin at Jets.I wasnt prepared to put two teams in without MASSIVE PLAYER RECRUITMENT.Everyone used to love playing Hawkesbury or early NorWest because it was easy points,most of the time the magoos and ones were the very same team-and after years of 50 goal hidings,its extremely hard to retain players.So those days are behind us,and werent prepared to re-visit them,for the sake of making the draw look pretty.On the other hand,it gave me no opportunity to hit the UWS campuses out here,or any potential RAAF blokes,who were all on holidays,even after the deadline passed.But we need another year to consolidate our position, get some much needed funds and cash in the coffers,before we do anything.

I see exactly where you're coming from Pekay, I just thought you could have been given some more time if the draw makers weren't specifically waiting for you, that's all.

Originally posted by Pekay
BMR-i was out with the girl on sunday,thats why i couldnt respond to your call-sorry bro.

Don't apologise mate, just tell 'the girl' she cost you a free ticket to the cricket.

[Pekay]

Originally posted by BeeEmmAre
I see exactly where you're coming from Pekay, I just thought you could have been given some more time if the draw makers weren't specifically waiting for you, that's all. i agree 100%



Don't apologise mate, just tell 'the girl' she cost you a free ticket to the cricket.

She's not imaginary mate,you've met her.Was way too smashed after saturday night to do anything.Good to see a bit of unity between bitter rivals on the paddock.We all have to work hard to bring all levels of sydney footy up to scratch.And a hell of alot more support from the powers that be.

[tara]

Originally posted by Pekay
She's not imaginary mate,you've met her.Was way too smashed after saturday night to do anything.Good to see a bit of unity between bitter rivals on the paddock.We all have to work hard to bring all levels of sydney footy up to scratch.And a hell of alot more support from the powers that be.

I can confirm she does exist. She came along on my bucks nite .

Be interesting to see if the AFL reply to questions raised of them arrising from the Unofficial Presidents meeeting.

[DLH]

Originally posted by swansrock4eva
Any word yet?

And I personally found the councillor with the large chip on his shoulder too.. Right old p***k that one!

No luck I'm afraid.

We did our best, personally lobbied individual Councillors and were afforded a five minute speech to the Council meeting but all to no avail. The best we could do was get an amendment moved by the minority Liberal Councillors for a report to be tabled re the upgrading of the Greygums surface. They also moved a motion that the relocation be delayed pending further negotiations, however, the right old so and so you refer to made it clear that he was dead against it, and his Labor colleagues who form the majority went ahead and killed it.

Perhaps there's some good news for you though, there's a possiblity that the 18's might change back to Tues/Thurs training along with the seniors, whilst the junior club revert to Mon/Wed.

Very disappointing performance from Council but especially the AFL who are supposed to be on our side! They'll be hearing from us very soon when we express our displeasure more formally

[tara]

Originally posted by DLH
No luck I'm afraid.

We did our best, personally lobbied individual Councillors and were afforded a five minute speech to the Council meeting but all to no avail. The best we could do was get an amendment moved by the minority Liberal Councillors for a report to be tabled re the upgrading of the Greygums surface. They also moved a motion that the relocation be delayed pending further negotiations, however, the right old so and so you refer to made it clear that he was dead against it, and his Labor colleagues who form the majority went ahead and killed it.

Perhaps there's some good news for you though, there's a possiblity that the 18's might change back to Tues/Thurs training along with the seniors, whilst the junior club revert to Mon/Wed.

Very disappointing performance from Council but especially the AFL who are supposed to be on our side! They'll be hearing from us very soon when we express our displeasure more formally

Bad luck. Im not looking forward to playing there again. Now I wish I had sued them (didnt at the time becuase I wanted to keep playing and didnt want to have to sue anyone but the council), they have a duty of care to ensure that the surface is in reasonable condition. Keep reminding them on those words Duty of Care, they seem to listen more intently when they know litagation could eventuate from their neglect.

Let us know when the AFL gets back to you if they ever do.

[DLH]

Originally posted by tara
Bad luck. Im not looking forward to playing there again. Now I wish I had sued them (didnt at the time becuase I wanted to keep playing and didnt want to have to sue anyone but the council), they have a duty of care to ensure that the surface is in reasonable condition. Keep reminding them on those words Duty of Care, they seem to listen more intently when they know litagation could eventuate from their neglect.

Let us know when the AFL gets back to you if they ever do.

I wish you had have sued them as well! Believe me, we also have examples of players requiring knee reconstructions and badly damaging ankles due to the state of that place.

The safety issue was the main theme that we pushed as we knew this was one of the few things that might get their interest. The term "duty of care" was certainly bandied about. This is how we managed to get the amendment up in regards to a further report being done on the surface.

A meeting is taking place this afternoon between Council, the Rams and the AFL (they're happy to get involved now it's a done deal!!) to thrash out these issues.

The whole thing is a sad indictment on the ability of this country's number one football code to wield any influence in Sydney at local level. Sod all assistance from the governing body doesn't help either.

[Treefrog]

It's disappointing, not to mention ridiculous that a game invented to keep cricketers fit during winter ON A CRICKET GROUND is not allowed to be played on one.

Someone I was speaking to today mentioned that a cricket pitch is in better nick after footy is played on it, as it gets muddy and helps bond together better when the summer comes around.

They also mentioned another place in Penrith they wanted to get permission to play at but the cricketers said no and Panthers agreed...bit too close to Panther Stadium... don't want to see a better sport so close to them!!

What a waste.
Maybe if everyone who has been injured could write a submission as to why it's a bad decision and how broke council will be if they get sued.... but I'm sure you guys have already tried everything you could.

[swansrock4eva]

Ok here's a copy of the email I put through to the council last night - basically going with the safety theme. It's a tad long, and I do apologise, but after the response from one particular councillor to this, believe me when I say, if you guys want reports etc into injury occurences, costs etc, and in relation to surfaces and conditions, let me know! Either PM me, or email me.

"Dear Penrith City Council, and its Councillors,



I am writing this email after learning of the contention regarding the use of Dukes Oval, Emu Plains, as an Australian Rules Football venue during the winter months. I am a long-time supporter of Aussie Rules, and although not a constituent of Penrith City Council, I currently work with a club in your own municipality, the Greater Western Power Under 18s. I write both from the viewpoint of a supporter, and also from a professional viewpoint, as an Exercise Physiologist, as well as a Level Two Sports Trainer with Sports Medicine Australia and a qualified Senior Coach in Australian Rules.



That this is even an issue causes me great concern. As a long-time supporter of Aussie Rules, I have seen first-hand the struggle to ensure our players, right across Sydney have venues that are safe for them to utilise in order to play their chosen sport. For every athlete of every age and ability level, a safe and well-tended environment is not a privilege but a right. By the phrase ?safe,? I refer to not only the condition of the surface itself, but also to the way in which surfaces are utilised, and the ways in which they are maintained. Injury data, even from the highest levels of sport, clearly indicate that a sound playing surface contributes to decreased rate of injury occurrence, as well as a decrease in the severity of injury and the amount of training and playing time missed due to injury. This, in turn, can help relieve costs associated with injuries, including to our health system, and even to your own municipality, by way of decreasing insurance premiums and reducing a council?s public liability in the event of injury. Dukes Oval is by far the best playing surface for Australian Rules Football in your area. Compared to the likes of Greygums Oval, Cook Park and Lukes Lane Reserve, Dukes Oval is well lit, a smooth and well-tended playing surface in a good location with easy access. Having spent a season with the Power at Greygums, although the general understanding for local clubs is to take what ground you can get, from a professional viewpoint, the surface at Greygums is hardly satisfactory, with exposed sprinkler heads, a rough, unkempt surface and, in some places, very little, if any, grass at all. Footage from matches there last year shows players running through dust rather than the green grass they should be entitled to, and the drought is hardly a good enough excuse for a ground to be in that poor a condition. Cook Park, while a good ground, is unlit and therefore unsuitable for night training sessions, and Lukes Lane Reserve is very much in the same vein as Greygums, however without even suitable lighting, leaving it not only a safety risk for players in terms of being able to see what they are doing, but also as a risk to children who often train there in the late afternoon or early evening during the height of winter.



As you may be aware, the decision to ban Aussie Rules football from Dukes Oval has impacted, not only on the Penrith Rams seniors and the Penrith Swans juniors, but also on virtually every other club in the area (and by this I speak not just of your council?s geographical area, but also the Blue Mountains, the Hawkesbury, Blacktown and even the outer Hills District). For example, given that they are a First Division Senior team, the Rams take priority, and therefore have chosen the second-best field in the area on which to train, and most likely play ? Greygums Oval. The Swans have followed suit, and are also training at this ground. Between them, they have successfully displaced the Greater Western Power from the ground on Tuesday and Thursday evenings, leaving them only Monday and Wednesday to conduct training, which places these athletes at risk in terms of match preparation and recovery anyway. Additionally, the scheduling nightmare between Cook Park and Greygums Oval to ensure that matches for the Rams, Swans, Power and Crows are all correctly scheduled and conducted is also going to put enormous strain on the grounds themselves ? think of the number of matches, the number of studded football boots, the number of movements in the areas and then multiply that by the 20-odd weeks of the football calendar, as there would conceivably be a bare minimum of two matches per week per venue between seniors, Under 18s and juniors. Add in the use of the grounds for other activities such as Auskick clinics, umpire training and clinics, coaching clinics and carnival matches, as well as school sports and general recreational use by residents then if there is concern over the state of Dukes Oval currently, perhaps concern should soon be redirected, as these grounds will NOT be able to facilitate such a variety of use over such a sustained period of time.



Further to this, as the condition of these surfaces degenerates, the risk of serious injury increases and so does your own council?s responsibility, not just to the athletes at the ?home? clubs, but also to every visiting athlete and their families, coming from possibly as far away as places such as Wollongong. Although I understand the concerns of the cricket club, surely the risk of reducing the number of available football fields far outweighs the risk of one field requiring more upkeep to maintain its current condition, or the increase in costs to maintain the upkeep at another two fields? Right around Sydney, it can be seen that cricket clubs and Australian Football clubs work together to help maintain surfaces and to help ensure that both their needs can be met with minimal disruption. Part of this bond comes from the fact that cricket, by definition is a summer sport, while Aussie Rules, by definition is a winter sport, but even when cross-over periods exist towards the end of the cricket season (or the Aussie Rules pre-season if you will), there are ways and means to ensure the ground?s condition remains good, while also ensuring both teams can train well enough to ensure quality performances in their respective competitions. Having completed work with the University of New South Wales/Eastern Suburbs Bulldogs Australian Football team, I have seen the competition for surface use first-hand, and have seen the ways in which it has been resolved, by agreements regarding the use of spikes or football boots in certain periods of the year, and by cordoning off the centre-square area containing the pitch and the tender field area surrounding it. While both clubs have been respectively inconvenienced by such arrangements, neither has been inconvenienced to the point of requiring the other to vacate completely, except in situations where the University itself requires time to recondition the pitch, an event which occurs very rarely.



Bearing in mind the significant risks posed by the removal of Dukes Oval as a footballing venue, I strongly believe that an alternative that addresses all parties' concerns can be found. "

[Treefrog]

*applauds*

Very well written.
I would have supported it!

[swansrock4eva]

Keep supporting it - just cos the *person* won this round, doesn't mean they'll win again. Even though I'm not a Penrith local myself, I want to fight for footy in the West because there is just as much right to play out there as there is anywhere in the country, and just because one particular person believes they are right, and that they have the right to be as rude and self-serving as he is, doesn't mean he knows how to fight properly for something, with appropriate evidence. If he does, he certainly didn't show it - I can't post his response to that email here, but believe me when I say it was like waving a red rag at a bull - if I wasn't fired up before, I sure as hell am now, and have already let him know! I do have the access to the right information to prove the situation, and I plan to use it.

[BeeEmmAre]

Originally posted by Pekay
She's not imaginary mate,you've met her.Was way too smashed after saturday night to do anything.Good to see a bit of unity between bitter rivals on the paddock.We all have to work hard to bring all levels of sydney footy up to scratch.And a hell of alot more support from the powers that be.

That's not what the inverted commas meant.
I not only know who you are talking about and believe you, I think she is a very nice girl and you are extremely lucky.
It was an inference to you not using her name, and me just trying to be funny.
Sometimes, however, my jokes get easily missed.
No issues sir???

By the way, still no response regarding the Premier League (ECE) part of my original question.

[Oscar]

Brendan,

ECE using Alan Davidson last year was always a "stop gap measure" when Roger Sheeran Oval at Mac Uni became unavailable.

Whilst we knew that we would also need accommodation in 2006 as well, it was never any guarantee that Alan Davidson would be home.

Most readers would know that East Coast have been nomads now for the last six years, after leaving Charles MacLaughlin Reserve in Baulkham Hills because of its size. Absolutely no other reason ...

They would also know that we have now finalised arrangements with the Council for our own purpose built AFL complex at Kellyville on Withers Rd. The efforts which have gone into these negotiations have been lengthy and mammoth. And with cooperation from all parties including the NSWAFL, Cricket NSW and the Council, 2007 will see the Eagles playing on their own ground for the first ever time in their 12 year history. All AFL Clubs in Sydney should be pretty happy to have a game scheduled at Withers Road in the future.

Indeed, negotiations are now proceeding with Council to further upgrade the already impressive plans agreed upon.

For 2006 the League asked us to play out of Kelso, owing to the UNSW/ES need for a ground because of the upgrade happening at the Village Green. Whilst we would have preferred to stay at Alan Davidson, we looked at the bigger picture and in the spirit of cooperation, we accepted the Kelso offer. As it turns out we only have four home games scheduled there, with the rest at Henson Park. A position we are very comfortable with.

Whilst we hope that 2006 will be a good year for us on the field, we can't wait to settle into long term rights from 2007 on ...

[DLH]

Originally posted by swansrock4eva
Keep supporting it - just cos the *person* won this round, doesn't mean they'll win again. Even though I'm not a Penrith local myself, I want to fight for footy in the West because there is just as much right to play out there as there is anywhere in the country, and just because one particular person believes they are right, and that they have the right to be as rude and self-serving as he is, doesn't mean he knows how to fight properly for something, with appropriate evidence. If he does, he certainly didn't show it - I can't post his response to that email here, but believe me when I say it was like waving a red rag at a bull - if I wasn't fired up before, I sure as hell am now, and have already let him know! I do have the access to the right information to prove the situation, and I plan to use it.

Well done for adding a supportive voice. I'd be disappointed but not completely surprised if you got an aggressive response. Certainly the reaction we received before the Council meeting by the cricket official concerned was at best, "colourful". What goes around comes around though hopefully.

The crux of the issue is that the local cricket administration have pledged to spend $12,000 on the centre wicket area before next cricket season, and they refuse to do so if we're still in residence as their assertion is that the money they spend will go down the drain because we'll ruin it.

An effective management plan would negate this issue to a large extent (the juniors are still able to play there without being affected, apparently this use is OK!) As I said, there's a personal vendetta there that I won't go into, and when you've got time on your hands to constantly harrass Councillors they eventually get sick of you and you get your way.

[tara]

Originally posted by DLH
Well done for adding a supportive voice. I'd be disappointed but not completely surprised if you got an aggressive response. Certainly the reaction we received before the Council meeting by the cricket official concerned was at best, "colourful". What goes around comes around though hopefully.

The crux of the issue is that the local cricket administration have pledged to spend $12,000 on the centre wicket area before next cricket season, and they refuse to do so if we're still in residence as their assertion is that the money they spend will go down the drain because we'll ruin it.

An effective management plan would negate this issue to a large extent (the juniors are still able to play there without being affected, apparently this use is OK!) As I said, there's a personal vendetta there that I won't go into, and when you've got time on your hands to constantly harrass Councillors they eventually get sick of you and you get your way.

Playing on Rosedale Oval we know all about how precious the cricketers are about their pitch. Suprisingly however at training last night I discovered there is a new currator their and the ground is in pretty good shape and soft. This bloke actually likes the fact that football is played on the wicket during the winter. Apparently the mess made of the pitch by football actually helps bond it together better for a better pitch in the cricket season. Now im not an expert but given its the grounds currator that said it and it sounds reasonable so im prepared to believe it.

So in short maybe talk to a few indepentant currators and find out their opinions and present them to the cricket association. Given Rosedale has first grade cricket played there, its currator could be a good place to start.

[tara]

Also we respect that training there during preseason in boots will rip the surface up and therefore only train in runners and we never enter the pitch area until after seasons end (expect to retrieve stray footys).