State League Player Permit Trial from 2014

[Mug Punter]

Hmmmm.......not sure what glasses you were wearing when you read that article Bigshow.

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Extract below:
The fringe players often felt on the outer, never more so than when the Lions invited only a select group of 18 senior players to embark on altitude training in Arizona last year.

For his part, Longer said he found it frustrating to play in the Lions' seconds team, which dominated the weak North Eastern AFL competition. Brisbane won every NEAFL match in which he played in 2012, by an average margin of 10 goals.

The lack of communication and player development helps to explain why so many young Lions wanted out at the end of this season.

"Myself and the other guys (on the fringe) became really tight because we were young and spending a lot of time together,'' Longer said.

"We obviously spoke about it, and in the end players wanted to leave for different reasons. For some it was purely the go-home factor, for others it was a lack of opportunity, for some it was about not really fitting in. It wasn't just one reason for all of us. It was personal and it was different reasons for different guys.''

Mmmmm, not sure what part of "weak North Eastern AFL competition" you can't see. And the Northern NEAFL is the stronger of the two.

I can't imagine the Swans and Bogans are too happy about the NEAFL. Sure it's better than playing in the SFL but it can't really meet their needs. Sooner the four NEAFL AFL reserve teams play in a 14 team SANFL along with Port Adelaide and Adelaide the better for everyone.

[Tim Freedman]

Mmmmm, not sure what part of "weak North Eastern AFL competition" you can't see. And the Northern NEAFL is the stronger of the two.

I can't imagine the Swans and Bogans are too happy about the NEAFL. Sure it's better than playing in the SFL but it can't really meet their needs. Sooner the four NEAFL AFL reserve teams play in a 14 team SANFL along with Port Adelaide and Adelaide the better for everyone.

Mug Punter, your constant bagging of the NEAFL has finally made me see the light. Your strong arguments of "its not fair" "its too hard" "they will never win" has convinced me that we should just pack up the bat and ball and go home.

We need to simply go back to allowing the majority of the best talent in Metro NSW to move interstate (or ACT) to play a higher standard of football than what the SFL offers. Alternatively they can be used as cannon fodder by the Swans & GWS when they need top ups and be called toppies because no one wants to know their name.

Your argument makes absolute perfect sense to me now and I can't believe it took me so long to jump on board

[justabaraker]

Mug Punter, your constant bagging of the NEAFL has finally made me see the light. Your strong arguments of "its not fair" "its too hard" "they will never win" has convinced me that we should just pack up the bat and ball and go home.

We need to simply go back to allowing the majority of the best talent in Metro NSW to move interstate (or ACT) to play a higher standard of football than what the SFL offers. Alternatively they can be used as cannon fodder by the Swans & GWS when they need top ups and be called toppies because no one wants to know their name.

Your argument makes absolute perfect sense to me now and I can't believe it took me so long to jump on board

TimF, who needs an AFL flunkie like Tom Harley when we have quality thinkers like this, available on our doorstep.
Mug Punter for the next CEO of NSW footy I reckon !

[justabaraker]

Noodle, I'm wondering how your club is viewing its involvement in the NEAFL, two years down the track.

What does SydUni hope to gain from mixing it with the big guys like this ? Someone drafted to an AFL club ? Prestige ? When it was first outlined, I thought NEAFL was a top idea but, two years along the way, it does seem a mighty drain on the club's volunteers and finances, and the time requirements on the coaches and players. A lot of people are sacrificing big chunks of their weekday evenings and weekends. And for what gain ?

On the other hand, I look at the "traditional clubs in Sydney who have stood still for too long and are being overtaken", and I see clubs living within their means, requiring committments that are do-able with study and work requirements, and supported by crowds that might be small but they are bigger than the ones that get out to SydUni matches...Sydney footy as it has been for the 20-odd years since I moved here from interstate.

TimF, here are some questions that I asked a SydUni fan about their involvement in NEAFL two years on - I thought his answers were top.
How are the Eagles travelling, two years down the track ? It's cost a lot of money, stretched the volunteers hard, and the main SAFL teams are not travelling well. The NEAFL team has not done well this season.
Has it been worth it ?

[Noodle]

As I understand it Bigshow, the Lions reserves have been playing int the QAFL for a significant period of time prior to the NEAFL and have not always been the best side.
Conversely, I can't imagine that at this point Sydney Uni are yet of a quality to prepare young footballers for AFL Footy, in 2012 we came up against Mike Pyke and Jesse White in tandem in the ruck, when I talked to our bloke at training about playing aginst them he described it as "emasculating". Our blokes just aren't on the same scale.
The AFL reserves sides now play more fixtures against each other, we played GWS and the Swans once each last year SHE four times I think. As I said earlier whether it works or it doesn't is yet to be seen but at the moment it is here and that is framework we deal within. If they were go for interstate travel ie, the SANFL they would have simply remained n the VFL obviously the AFL aren't up for it.
As for Longer, my life observation is this, most humans use reverse logic, they do what they want to do then find excuses to justify there original decision. You get a bit of that on this forum, this is what is best for us and this is why it is the right thing.

[Seagull]

So if I've got this right...a club that doesn't join the NEAFL is expected to prop up those that do, at the expense of their own form and player development?

Very few clubs have cash to throw around on recruitment yet the expectation is their best player might have to play for another club...ridiculous!

This all sounds like an after-thought to a faulty system.

Surely if a club decides it can handle the NEAFL then it must allow for depth before entering the fray? This isn't a 'pathway', this is a band-aid measure!

If a kid is good enough for an AFL career, he'll be noticed no matter where he plays in this town.

[Mug Punter]

So if I've got this right...a club that doesn't join the NEAFL is expected to prop up those that do, at the expense of their own form and player development?

Very few clubs have cash to throw around on recruitment yet the expectation is their best player might have to play for another club...ridiculous!

This all sounds like an after-thought to a faulty system.

Surely if a club decides it can handle the NEAFL then it must allow for depth before entering the fray? This isn't a 'pathway', this is a band-aid measure!

If a kid is good enough for an AFL career, he'll be noticed no matter where he plays in this town.

Spot on.

The Student and others will bleat on with their sense of entitlement of how great they are for the game (just because they happened to be strong at the end of the 2011 season) but your post sums the issue up concisely and correctly.

All future posts re the flawed NEAFL should refer back to Seagull's post.

Play the Swans, GWS, Lions and Suns in an 14 team SANFL. Let Baulko and Sydney Uni play where they belong, in the SFL.

[Norris Lurker]

Seagull's post has summed it up well, especially the last sentence. The likes of Dane Rampe and Brandon Jack have shown the pathway is there - playing Sydney AFL, with the odd NEAFL game as a top-up for the Swans reserves.

[chatovadafloor]

agreed there

Seagull's post has summed it up well, especially the last sentence. The likes of Dane Rampe and Brandon Jack have shown the pathway is there - playing Sydney AFL, with the odd NEAFL game as a top-up for the Swans reserves.

[Steiger]

A proper AFL reserves comp would be the ideal solution.

Let the state leagues be state leagues.

[justabaraker]

So if I've got this right...a club that doesn't join the NEAFL is expected to prop up those that do, at the expense of their own form and player development?

Apart from the learned debate on this thread, the only actual mention about this new NEAFL trial was on the Eagles website.
So you'd better let us all know what you know about "EXPECTED TO" and "PROP UP" and "AT THE EXPENSE OF THEIR OWN PLAYER DEVELOPMENT"...it must be all covered somewhere that the rest of us haven't gotten to read so far.

All I know is that players will be invited to try out in NEAFL - and that's got to be good for their development doesn't it ?

[Coastal Boy]

The fact that both SHEagles and SydUni receive an AFL grant to help finance their NEAFL venture is probably widely accepted as necessary.
But to allow them access to other clubs players takes things too far. I can only assume both clubs approached the NSWAFL crying they had a lack a talent in their ranks....or worse, the NEAFL complained they needed to improve their list.
If they cannot recruit a competitive list without assistance then maybe they have bitten off more than they can chew and they ought to reconsider their position.
Young footballers would consider it an honour to play for GWS or Swans reserves. Due to player number constraints for these clubs it is necessary. But SHEagles and SU both have lower grades which they can draw on so they ought to leave everyone else alone.
I feel sorry for the budding reserve grader who has busted his butt over the off season to be overlooked by the fly by night imports from other clubs.
Young players assist the Swans and GWS with the hope they may get discovered. But I assume SHEagles and SU are not permitted to offer any temporary player a permanent offer for the next year or there really will be a club riot. So what's the point? Once again....this whole thing is ridiculous.

[Tim Freedman]

TimF, here are some questions that I asked a SydUni fan about their involvement in NEAFL two years on - I thought his answers were top.
How are the Eagles travelling, two years down the track ? It's cost a lot of money, stretched the volunteers hard, and the main SAFL teams are not travelling well. The NEAFL team has not done well this season.
Has it been worth it ?

Justa, I'll start off by saying I don't represent the views of the club and the views I hold are my own.

To be honest, IMHO it's still too early to completely assess the Eagles entry into the NEAFL.

Facts:
NEAFL - Finals in our first year winning 10 games. 1st week exit. - Our Prem Div also won 5-6 games and Under 18s won a flag

NEAFL - Won 7 games in our second season missing the finals by 3 games +%. - Our prem div won 1 game. NEAFL in all honesty should have won a few more games but we were a long way off the top so its irrelevant. Prem div suffered from a few player losses and NEAFL having a horrendous run with injury.

We haven't broken the bank attracting new talent to the club AND from what I know (which isn't much) they haven't exceeded their player payment budgets which everyone sees at the AGM. The AFL have been very supportive of both the Eagles & Uni and they are committed to making it work for both sides.

Volunteers at the club have been stretched since the Sydney AFL introduced its current and ridiculous structure. IMO, and I know many on here don't agree, the Sydney AFL have tried to satisfy the few rather than the many by turning it into a team competition rather than a club competition. On any given weekend we can have all of our sides playing at different venues. There is not one club in Sydney at the moment who wouldn't agree that volunteers are stretched. BUT, we are very fortunate to have some great people at the club including Chatova who give plenty to the club. However I digress.

The Eagles were under absolutely no illusions that the step up into NEAFL wouldn't create it's challenges. We knew it wouldn't be easy both on and off the field however our members voted for the move. Our players expressed an absolute desire to play at the highest level possible in Sydney which is as it stands currently the NEAFL. They could have taken the easy path and voted to stay in the Sydney AFL. After 3 successive flags they expressed a desire to go to the next level. There were other clubs at the time who were asked to submit an application for the NEAFL. Some decided against it and some failed dismally. The Eagles and Uni were successful and both took the opportunity presented.

What I will say is that the Eagles aren't in the NEAFL to make up the numbers. We don't go around promoting "pathway" and the other tag lines that get thrown around. We are there to compete, play finals and win it. We know how far off we are but we have some great people involved who are resilient and are in it for the long haul. We are equally committed to our premier division side and we want them winning games and making finals. At the end of every year we assess everything and then create a plan to get better.

Whilst we are not in the same ball park, don't have the same finances, sponsors or exposure, I view it as similar to the AFL sides who gained entry. Fremantle have just played in their first ever AFL grand final after nearly 20 years. I can't imagine they sat around wanting to pull the pin throughout the early stages.

I find it funny that some on here want to continually attack the concept of NEAFL and cry foul. Personally, I want to see more of the Sydney AFL sides step up into this competition so we can improve the overall standard of football being played in Sydney. It will be a very good day when we stop losing some of our best talent to the VFL, SANFL & WAFL and players here see that they can play a higher standard of football in their own state.

[Tim Freedman]

The fact that both SHEagles and SydUni receive an AFL grant to help finance their NEAFL venture is probably widely accepted as necessary.
But to allow them access to other clubs players takes things too far. I can only assume both clubs approached the NSWAFL crying they had a lack a talent in their ranks....or worse, the NEAFL complained they needed to improve their list.
If they cannot recruit a competitive list without assistance then maybe they have bitten off more than they can chew and they ought to reconsider their position.
Young footballers would consider it an honour to play for GWS or Swans reserves. Due to player number constraints for these clubs it is necessary. But SHEagles and SU both have lower grades which they can draw on so they ought to leave everyone else alone.
I feel sorry for the budding reserve grader who has busted his butt over the off season to be overlooked by the fly by night imports from other clubs.
Young players assist the Swans and GWS with the hope they may get discovered. But I assume SHEagles and SU are not permitted to offer any temporary player a permanent offer for the next year or there really will be a club riot. So what's the point? Once again....this whole thing is ridiculous.

Coastal, I think you will find everyone is getting their knickers in a knot over nothing. I really can't see why the Eagles or Uni will be going after every clubs best players every week to top up their lists. I'm confident that both clubs will put their own players first before trying to get players from other clubs. It's an AFL decision which is very far removed from what the original discussions were.

The original discussions surrounded a few hurdles that were faced in the first few years. We had a few players who had come to the Eagles from other Sydney AFL clubs and signed as an Eagles player wanting to play NEAFL. However, some had a few concerns about playing premier division against their old club which IMO is fair enough. They knew that they may be a fringe player or may get injured throughout the year and therefore they were concerned about playing prem div. We understood that so we spoke to the AFL about the potential of allowing our signed players who had come from other Sydney AFL clubs to go back and play at their premier division club if they were not selected to play NEAFL. We saw it as very rare and would only use it for those players who expressed this desire. It wouldn't be ideal for our premier division side but it would allow the player to be happy. We actually trialled it in 2013 with a player in the 1st half of the year AND it worked very well for both our club and the other club. However, at June 30 the AFL demanded that the player pick one club as per standard transfer deadlines.

The AFL have then made a decision that everyone is now aware of and it will be a trial basis. They have to start somewhere and time will tell if it needs changing.

[ShortHalfHead]

Volunteers at the club have been stretched since the Sydney AFL introduced its current and ridiculous structure. IMO, and I know many on here don't agree, the Sydney AFL have tried to satisfy the few rather than the many by turning it into a team competition rather than a club competition. .

I would dispute that statement. I think that the growth shows that it's been a success. The year before divisionalisation, Penrith had 1.5 teams. Got 5 now. Sure, there are some blowout games here and there, but not like previously when a team was getting flogged by 20 goals every week and had no-where else to go but to go around again the next year with the same result.

The main critics are the PD clubs, who liked the cosy arrangements.