Depth

[ROK Lobster]

This really just makes a new thead of a point Nico has raised a number of times elsewhere. Depth? Do we have any? We have played the same core group for so long - often injured, often through bouts of poor form. Is it a good thing? Does it mean we have no depth so cannot drop injured and poorly performing players? Does it dry up the depth we might have had, not letting the fringe players have a game? Sure it is a fine line to tread, getting the balance between perservering with out of form players and building a solid core on one hane, while developing youngsters on the other, and one I am glad I don't have to tread. But what do you reckon. More games to the Canberra brigade next season?

[Nico]

Yep my hobby horse.

Brisbane, Port Adelaide and Essendon in particular have fallen for the invincible feeling.

Roos has done it very well to date and I reckon will now realise that some of the past stalwarts will need to make way for the new breed. Doesn't mean they will be traded or delisted.

Is Crouch playing on? Will be interesting to see in next couple of weeks.

Barry 29, Mathews 28, Jude Bolton 27 would you believe(have we seen the best of him) Crouch 29, Hall 30, Kirk 30, MOL 30 (all ages next season)

The best we can expect from this combo maybe 2 years. It is a lot closer than most people think. Most of these are our leadership group.

2007 must be the balancing year. Go for another flag while the stalwarts still have it, but add some genuine youthful pace to the team.

ROK, Kristen Thornton is always in the best for the 2's. How good is he and will he be ready next year? I bet if he played for the Bullies he would be a walk up start.

[hammo]

It should be time to make some tough decisions on guys like Mathews who is clearly surplus to our needs.

We need to bring in 3-4 new players again next year and we have done with Malceski for example.

I doubt Spriggs will hang around so we'd be looking at Schmidt in particular and Willoughby if he isn't traded.

I am not sure if Vogels will come on as he seemed to tread water this year but Grundy is definitely a prospect.

McVeigh could be the attacking midfielder we desperately need and Malceski is all class. Those two in particular need to step up.

I would think the bloods code would make trading players very difficult, especially if the leadership group has an influence over these decisions.

[DST]

The group we have at present is capable of playing in finals and GF's for the next couple of years.

But in order for us to be able to improve again next year, we will have to bring in 3 to 4 younger and hopefully quicker players into the side.

We have done well this year to inject Malceski, McVeigh and Richards into the side. We will need to have at least 3 of Schmidt, Moore, Willoughby, Thornton, Laidlaw, Grundy & Vogels all playing in our best 22 come finals time next year.

As long as that occurs and we draft well again this year with all our picks we can hopefully tranistion well.

We have one of the best and smartest footy managers in Andrew Ireland and very good recuiter of talent in Barham. Which I have faith in.

DST

[robbieando]

I think the midfield group is OK with the like of Malceski, McVeigh, Ablett, Buchanan, Moore and Schmidt (not forgetting the three midfielders we did pick up last year who I believe will turn out well come 2008/2009) being the longterm building blocks upon which we build our team. When you add the expirence of Goodes, Kirk, Jude, Fosdike and a hopefully fit again Crouch to that group I think the midfield is an area we really don't have to focus on unless something came up that we couldn't ignore.

The Ruck department on paper is OK with Jolly and Doyle as a 1-2 combo. However the question mark with the rucks is depth, Earl Shaw was close to senior selection (if you believe his naming as a emergency at one point during the season) and would be a good number 3 ruckman long term however with question marks on his ability to step up to the senior level and of course Doyle's ability to see out the entire season injury free, I think we DO NEED to go after an expirenced ruckman for at least 2 season and that's why Everitt is the one we are going for. The bridge between Doyle and Shaw mainly.

The BIGGEST concern for me however is the key positions. Hall is going to be 30 next season and other than LRT we have no 190cm plus key defender and long at our depth in this area, all we have is Grundy who will be good as a Key Forward Long Term, Vogels who can play at both Ends of the Ground but isn't really a Long Term option like Grundy and Matthew Davis who has been on our list for so long without getting a game. This is an area we a) need to build some young stock up in and b) get a tall key defender to release Leo from Full Back to allow him to attack more.

All in all, if I was Paul Roos I would be leaving the midfield alone, going after nothing but Key Position Players in the Draft and hope to get an expirenced Full Back and Ruckman in the trade period.

[anniswan]

Originally posted by DST
The group we have at present is capable of playing in finals and GF's for the next couple of years.

But in order for us to be able to improve again next year, we will have to bring in 3 to 4 younger and hopefully quicker players into the side.

We have done well this year to inject Malceski, McVeigh and Richards into the side. We will need to have at least 3 of Schmidt, Moore, Willoughby, Thornton, Laidlaw, Grundy & Vogels all playing in our best 22 come finals time next year.

As long as that occurs and we draft well again this year with all our picks we can hopefully tranistion well.

We have one of the best and smartest footy managers in Andrew Ireland and very good recuiter of talent in Barham. Which I have faith in.

DST

Ditto

[DST]

Originally posted by robbieando
All in all, if I was Paul Roos I would be leaving the midfield alone, going after nothing but Key Position Players in the Draft and hope to get an expirenced Full Back and Ruckman in the trade period.

Agree with that, it is key position all the way in this draft or early picks for a proven young key defender.

Gee I wish Polak would just walk into CC's office and say I want to go to Sydney.

DST

[shole]

Originally posted by robbieando
The BIGGEST concern for me however is the key positions. Hall is going to be 30 next season and other than LRT we have no 190cm plus key defender and long at our depth in this area, all we have is Grundy who will be good as a Key Forward Long Term, Vogels who can play at both Ends of the Ground but isn't really a Long Term option like Grundy and Matthew Davis who has been on our list for so long without getting a game. This is an area we a) need to build some young stock up in and b) get a tall key defender to release Leo from Full Back to allow him to attack more.

That's why I think we got Richards this year. Can play back or forward

All in all, if I was Paul Roos I would be leaving the midfield alone, going after nothing but Key Position Players in the Draft and hope to get an expirenced Full Back and Ruckman in the trade period. [/B]

From what's been quoted by Roos, it looks like we'll be keeping our 1st round pick and possibly our second round pick as well. This is supposed to be the Super draft chock full of KPP's

[Industrial Fan]

Originally posted by robbieando
The BIGGEST concern for me however is the key positions. Hall is going to be 30 next season and other than LRT we have no 190cm plus key defender and long at our depth in this area, all we have is Grundy who will be good as a Key Forward Long Term, Vogels who can play at both Ends of the Ground but isn't really a Long Term option like Grundy and Matthew Davis who has been on our list for so long without getting a game. This is an area we a) need to build some young stock up in and b) get a tall key defender to release Leo from Full Back to allow him to attack more.

All in all, if I was Paul Roos I would be leaving the midfield alone, going after nothing but Key Position Players in the Draft and hope to get an expirenced Full Back and Ruckman in the trade period.

Henry Playfair.

Grundy will be in the next g.f. the swans play.

[SimonH]

Sorry, if I'd been paying more attention I probably would have posted in this thread rather than starting my own.

As you can see, my particular hobby-horse is somewhat different to Nico's.

In terms of senior players who are likely to/a reasonable chance of retiring in the next 2 to 3 years:

Kirk, without underestimating him in any way, is replaceable-- we have players on our list now who can be groomed to take his role.
MO'L is a one-off. He isn't a true KPP. You will be lucky to see a player of his 'type' twice in a generation; so you can only 'replace' him with a quality decent-size forward. Grundy is the great white hope of those currently on our list.
Leo Barry: In some senses a one-off, 'cos he's a 184cm guy who plays a KPP role. But sure, we need to develop CBolt (or Dempster?) into a true full-back; or trade or draft for one.
BBBH: The big one, really. We either need to accept there won't be another and build a different style of forward line with a more democratic structure, hope that we strike gold with a draft pick in the mid-teens (which is probably a 20-30% chance), or pay up big (we paid 3 highish draft picks for BBBH).

That's it. The whole list is above. Compared with the problems that other teams have in losing players to retirement in the next couple of years, we're doing okay. Plus I'll bet you that at least one of the above will still be playing good footy in 2010.

I agree that the big question mark for the trade period is, 'Do you persist with our current ruck division, or bolster it?' I'm in the former category: Jolly has well and truly proved himself in 2006 to be in the top half-dozen ruckmen in the comp, and you don't downgrade his role because of one poor game; and I think that Doyle, if the medicos are happy with the state of his body, has shown enough to indicate that he can make it (incrementally improved over the last 6 weeks, and while he didn't do much more than create a contest in the first 3 quarters on Sat, he really stood up in the last).

Certainly more games to the Canberra brigade next season-- spots on the list are tight, so 2005 draftees Brabazon, Laidlaw (early indications have been positive) and Thornton have only got one more year to impress before they're at risk as well. We got some decent game time into Grundy, Schmidt & Phillips, plus a bit more into Moore and Bevan, in 2006, despite our good injury run meaning that we weren't generally forced to play seconds. Not bad going.

Provided we draft (and/or promote rookies, plenty of whom are tall) for KPPs in the upcoming draft, I think that Sydney's list balance looks pretty good, both for age and style of player. I'll certainly be the first jumping off the Harbour Bridge if we draft another 3 midfielders.

[Industrial Fan]

Originally posted by SimonH

I agree that the big question mark for the trade period is, 'Do you persist with our current ruck division, or bolster it?' I'm in the former category: Jolly has well and truly proved himself in 2006 to be in the top half-dozen ruckmen in the comp, and you don't downgrade his role because of one poor game; and I think that Doyle, if the medicos are happy with the state of his body, has shown enough to indicate that he can make it (incrementally improved over the last 6 weeks, and while he didn't do much more than create a contest in the first 3 quarters on Sat, he really stood up in the last).

Conan (Doyle) had the game of his career......did more than just create a contest......

after watching the game again, we would have lost by 2 goals plus without him.

A future star (if, as usual he stays uninjured)

[Triple B]

SimonH I think you are pretty close to the money there.

Of the seconds, Thornton and Laidlaw both look prospects to me.

Moore is the standout of the backup midfielders IMO, however he certainly will never be the outside midfielder which we would dearly love, purely an in and under which we already have in spades. That said, he'll be in there pushing for selection.

Grundy is a given.

I still hold hopes for Ericksen, he has steadily improved year by year, although still a few years away as a seniors ruckman.

I don't subscribe to the theory that we are a tired ageing list at all.

[NMWBloods]

Originally posted by BBB
I don't subscribe to the theory that we are a tired ageing list at all.

We're the second-youngest list in the comp.

The big replacements in a few years are Hall, MOL, Barry and Kirk as SimonH notes.

The main difficulty will be to replace Hall. We can see quite easily how important a key forward is and there are never that many around.

[allanh]

Originally posted by NMWBloods

The main difficulty will be to replace Hall. We can see quite easily how important a key forward is and there are never that many around.

that's where Kris Tarrant comes in. Of course, not for a 1st round pick. Maybe a 2nd.

[swansrule100]

Originally posted by allanh
that's where Kris Tarrant comes in. Of course, not for a 1st round pick. Maybe a 2nd.

chris tarrant is a waste of space