Should Roos go now?

[ROK Lobster]

WC talk of turning this flag into a dynasty by all the major contributers (incl worsfold) committing to the club for the long term. (Remember they've won just 1 flag by 1 point to base this off).

Just goes to show that none of them meditate and that collectively they know nothing about karma.

[Go Swannies]

The contrast to West Coast is striking.

Over the last 3 years, definately the last 5 years, we have been ahead of WC.

WC talk of turning this flag into a dynasty by all the major contributers (incl worsfold) committing to the club for the long term. (Remember they've won just 1 flag by 1 point to base this off).

Sydney on the other hand, seem happy to be happy with one flag, The Major contributers happy to retire in a few years and spend the rest of their life reflecting on that one day back in 2005.

WC may not win another flag and have no dynasty. Sydney may jag another flag in the next couple of years. Doesnt change the fact that WC have their sights set on the bigger picture and while they hold that attitude will be ultimately more successful than the swans in the long term.

I think you're just taking the fact that Roos has said that he doesn't want to spend his life as an AFL coach and taken that as the whole club. On the other hand, Colless has said that the structure they are putting in place at present is meant to ensure the Swans are a powerhouse within the AFL for the next 50 years. As Sydney's only team, that's always a hope. But it won't be achieved by getting to couple of Grand Finals and winning one.

[barry]

I think you're just taking the fact that Roos has said that he doesn't want to spend his life as an AFL coach and taken that as the whole club. On the other hand, Colless has said that the structure they are putting in place at present is meant to ensure the Swans are a powerhouse within the AFL for the next 50 years. As Sydney's only team, that's always a hope. But it won't be achieved by getting to couple of Grand Finals and winning one.

Exactly why I question whether its wise to keep Roos with the Swans if he is not aligned with the long term flow of the club.

[Ludwig]

We just have to face the facts that this is just not a premiership midfield, let alone a top eight midfield.

McVeigh has simply not shown the skill necessary to play senior footy, at least for now. May well improve, but that's next year. Needs to go now.

Mathews tries hard, but can only try to limit the damage from an opposing player. Never generates any attack. Having him on the team indicates just how bad the midfield is.

Bevan will never have the skills to make it. Is unlikely to ever even reach a level of a Ben Mathews. Why do we waste our time.

Crouch, Jude and Fosdyke also need to be upgraded, although Fosdyke has generally been good this year.

We need a midfield where someone like Buchanan is your worst midfielder, not your best.

Schmidt, Moore and Jack all look like good prospects and along with Laidlaw should be given at least a half a dozen games to show what they can do.

These guys will need to get game time to find their feet in the big leagues, so why not now before the season gets too far gone and we realise that we just don't have the horses to go this year. At worst it will probably make us a better team next year. From what I've seen tonight, this team is not going far this year.

Sad to see how slow and skill-less the Swans look without Kennelly.

[Alibi Monday]

That is letting them off the hook. The Bloods football is meant to be about the players taking responsibility for the game plan as much as the coaches.

If Hall has three players on him, two other players must be without an opponent. But where on earth were they? If there are any passengers within the 22 who aren't prepared to stand up and run hard when its their turn, the team will go nowhere.

We had about 8 passengers tonight and that is at least 7.5 too many.

Spot on Liz.

Paul Roos came to the club and developed a game plan built solely around intensity, defensive pressure across the park and attack on the ball around stoppages. He went with this method because all he had to work with, re: midfielders, were 'cortinas', other than an ageing Williams. Roos has done an AMAZING job getting this team to where they've been over the past 3 years, however he has no chance of extending this if the players are choosing not to play with the same intensity. The players know the game plan and they know it's built around everyone performing. As Tadgh has said in the past, the team are choosing to lose by not choosing to win.

It's pretty clear that for all rhetoric coming from the players - they just can't match the 'Bloods' spirit as they have in the past. Maybe the key bodies around the ball aren't able to do what the mind wants, or maybe they just don't want it enough. Whatever the case, I can't see this as Roos' issue. If the players want self-empowerment, they need to take the responsibilty. If they don't take the responsibility, then it becomes Roos' job to find out who's hungry by promoting kids for the rest of the year and start to enter a rebuilding phase.

I think we're at the tipping point where the tank's probably exhausted from this group. Other sides have learn how to get the most out of their teams by watching the Swans develop what was considered an ordinary list in 2003. So now they have class and intensity - whilst we've been running on intensity and spirit alone (bar some class exceptions - Goodes, Malceski, O'Keefe, MOL, Davis).

I have faith the Roos can rebuild the team, but it will mean 2-3 years in the bottom 4. Personally, I'm thankful we've got him and that he's taken the hardest route by reworking a team and getting a Premiership out of it without having to rebuild.

I would prefer we play committed and hungry raw players and finish 12th than scrape into the finals with up and down commitment. I just have no idea which team is going to turn up each week. At least I know they'll be half-a-dozen passengers.

[Vivien]

Exactly why I question whether its wise to keep Roos with the Swans if he is not aligned with the long term flow of the club.

Why the assumption that just because Roos doesn't want to spend the rest of his life coahing means he has no concern for the long-term future of the club? I think all he's trying to say is that there's more to life to football, which is a fairly healthy attitude IMO.

[Mr_Juicy]

But Roos wont do it. His answer to the North game was to drop a young get-the-ball type for Bevan who came off a shocker in the reserves.

Well I thought Bevan was ok tonight. I thought everyone was ok. The only person I can see as being dropped for tonights effort was MOL. I love the guy, but he gave us nothing. Is he injured? Wtf was going on with him? I put it down to just a bad night.

McVeigh is the only person in the team I think that provides us with nothing. We've persisted too long with him and have not come up trumps. I'm sure Schmidt could provide us with as much and has more of a future.

To anyone who says Roos was out coached blah blah I say pfft! I haven't read anyones thoughts on this so I'm probably being a bit unfair on rwo posters. Saints were just on song. They played well and thoroughly deserved the win. I don't think we played that badly. Where did we go wrong? Just not enough from players like Goodes, MOL, McVeigh and maybe spider. Spider is great around the rucks but I think he's lacking around the ground. Are we not using him well? Should he be more of a link man than a stop gap measure? perhaps. I think he would be better suited to be plonked in the middle and left to his own devices.

Great efforts from Kirk, Eski, ROK, Teddy, B1 (was ok). We look so much better when attacking. It should be the focus, and we should only revert to the lock down style when 3 goals down, or god forbid, 4 goals up. I don't think we are in a lot of trouble for the rest of the season (injuries aside). Nick Davis needs to get more involved, and Stella needs to stop feeding Goodes pancakes. It's killing him.

[CureTheSane]

In the last 1/4, I think it was Walls who said that Roos has to change his game plan around if we were to have any hope.

Blind Freddy could see that we weren't going to win playing the way we were at that point.

I posted a thread titled "My thoughts on tonights game" after last weeks loss.

In it I mentioned that Roos still appeared to be adamant in not changing the game plan in line with the way the game was tracking.

It appears that he most definitely won't now.
Seems he thinks that if we stay committed to the plan we will come good.

Maybe we will.
Like I mentioned, we won a flag and lost the next year by 1 point.
Not bad.
The time to complain will be the end of the season.

If we don't make the 4 or the 8, there will be many supporters calling for blood.
and maybe rightly so.
It's damn frustrating to see us losing and no significant reactionary position changes.

To say that changing the players around would have made no difference is silly.
It would have either caused a bigger loss or maybe helped us to a win.

Luckily for me I didn't have to go to the ground and pay to see it.
I could find something else to do towards the end of the first quarter.
Thank you AFL for televising a game that was being played in my home town.
It saved me the trouble of making the trip to the city

[CureTheSane]

Saints were just on song. They played well and thoroughly deserved the win.

The kangaroos were on song last week too.

We need to be able to belt out a better tune to beat the teams WHEN they are on song.

To me, there wasn't all that much in it.

We still lack depth, something that hasn't really been tested over the last 2 years.

Again, Roos seems to like to play the fewest players he can in a given year.

Is this good or bad?

You'd have to say that the short term results have been good, time will tell if it reduces our long term winning ability.

[Mr_Juicy]

Yes I agree with you but when you're down by 5 goals in the last qtr and Hall is still being held by two defenders, as he was all game, you can't help but scratch your head and wonder what's happening.

I think this is the what's wrong. We should be playing man on man in the forward line if Hall is double teamed. Create some blocks, get him free. Kick to someone else??? Push Malceski up to the wing get him to take some marks around Half forward, give him license to use his boot at goals. This is really only possible if we get tiger back soon though.

Get the run off half back to find targets like Davis, Ablett, Eski, et al on the 50. Give them free reign to have a shot 50-55 out.

[swantastic]

That is letting them off the hook. The Bloods football is meant to be about the players taking responsibility for the game plan as much as the coaches.

If Hall has three players on him, two other players must be without an opponent. But where on earth were they? If there are any passengers within the 22 who aren't prepared to stand up and run hard when its their turn, the team will go nowhere.

We had about 8 passengers tonight and that is at least 7.5 too many.

Is it april fools day? 8 thats the biggest joke i've ever heard more like 18

[cruiser]

If he's going to leave in 2 or 3 years anyway, isnt it better to build our future around a coach (and game plan) that doesnt have a used-by date ?

contrast West coasts approach with all involved assuming Worsfold will be there for another 20 years (ala Sheedy), so long term stability and long term stategies can be put in place.

Give it a fracking rest!

[Q...]

Having read nothing but the result and the first post in this ridiculous thread I was going to write something honest, correct and undoubtedly, justifiably, removable by the mods.

So instead I'd like to ask (and I apologise if someone has already asked this): what brings you to the conclusion that removing a coach after round 7 of a season, following 2 seasons that produced a premiership and a one point loss in a grand final, while the team he coaches is in 10th place on the ladder and one game outside 4th position, is an appropriate option to consider?

I know it was a long winded question that didn't appear grammatically correct whilst reading it, but really... I'm frustrated with the negative questions and comments on this forum that have no substance and no foundation.

We don't coach them, we don't play for them, we have zero influence on what they do or how they go about doing it. We are a supporters. As a supporter, I hope that they Swans will show their true spirit and skill and make a genuine, deserved run at this years flag. If they don't, then that's a painful, frustrating #*&@ing annoying piece of reality. If they fail then the people that have influence over what the team does and how the team does it will hopefully have learned some lessons from the previous season and improve the following year. Hopefully that will lead to many more happy days for Swans fans.

I understand that this is a place that people put forward their opinions without the concern that they count for naught; but sometimes I wish we could just acknowledge that not everything is rosy and sometimes we, as supporters, need to deal with the way that makes us feel and not look for someone to blame for making us feel that way.

[CureTheSane]

Having read nothing but the result and the first post in this ridiculous thread I was going to write something honest, correct and undoubtedly, justifiably, removable by the mods.

So instead I'd like to ask (and I apologise if someone has already asked this): what brings you to the conclusion that removing a coach after round 7 of a season, following 2 seasons that produced a premiership and a one point loss in a grand final, while the team he coaches is in 10th place on the ladder and one game outside 4th position, is an appropriate option to consider?

I know it was a long winded question that didn't appear grammatically correct whilst reading it, but really... I'm frustrated with the negative questions and comments on this forum that have no substance and no foundation.

We don't coach them, we don't play for them, we have zero influence on what they do or how they go about doing it. We are a supporters. As a supporter, I hope that they Swans will show their true spirit and skill and make a genuine, deserved run at this years flag. If they don't, then that's a painful, frustrating #*&@ing annoying piece of reality. If they fail then the people that have influence over what the team does and how the team does it will hopefully have learned some lessons from the previous season and improve the following year. Hopefully that will lead to many more happy days for Swans fans.

I understand that this is a place that people put forward their opinions without the concern that they count for naught; but sometimes I wish we could just acknowledge that not everything is rosy and sometimes we, as supporters, need to deal with the way that makes us feel and not look for someone to blame for making us feel that way.

I think you'll find that the content of the thread has little to do with the title which was pretty stupid.
The vas majority of us are happy with Roos.
who wouldn't be after 2 consecutive GF's and one of them a win?

It's just frustrating to see us going down, and nothing being done about it during the game.

Reminds me of the dude in the X wing fighter with the other dude next to him complaining that he is going to die.
The more senior dude says "Stay on target! Stay on target!" so the good soldier does and gets blown to @@@@.
Then the commander dude also gets destroyed, and the rebels are no closer to destroying the Death Star.

Until Luke comes in and says "stuff protocol, I'm going with my gut" and raises the automatic aiming system.
He takes a chance and destroys the baddies.

Sometimes you have to take a chance to win.
We won't do that.
To their credit, the players are good little soldiers.

[Q...]

The only thing is I think the Canberra competition is too easy for the reserves and the gap between Resreves and Seniors too great.

It shouldn't be here, I'm sure. But then I'm sure someone will move it if need be...

I'm not picking on you annew, your post is just the most recent that I have a seen a claim resembling this, so it gets used...

Often, it is implied on this board that the ACTAFL (or its new moniker) has such an inferior level of competition to the SA, WA and Victorian state leagues that it hinders the Swans developing players in their capacity to play in the AFL at the level that is required.

Is this actually true?

What does a reserves league need to prepare you with?

Skills?
You don't make them. You practice them.

Hardness?
Ask Aaron Hamill about whether or not there was anyone, in his time in the ACT, that was willing to take him on. He was a man mountain in U19s but I didn't see any shyness around him.

Work ethic?
How much time does a Swans listed player have to spend on football compared to trainee in the Australian Public Service that also plays football have? It's like comparing a daddy-paid-for-me-uni student (sorry full fee paying) living in Vaucluse to a generational welfare dependant HECS (or is that HELP nowadays) student living in Bankstown.

I'm sure I haven't covered them all. Please give me some suggestions of what I've missed or where it is that I'm wrong in my assessment.

I'm not convinced that the Swans reserves participation in the ACT competition has any substantial negative impact on the Swans developing players from playing effectively at the highest level.

I think that any such belief is mainly borne of bigatory or bias, not fact or analysis of fact.