what is the difference?

[swansrule100]

I was just watching some of last years grand final after watching some 2005 finals etc. I was trying to think as to why we have gone from a pretty good team (not the most skilful) that can run hard and match it with the best, to a team that looks a complete rabble for 60% of the match. We pretty much have the same core group of players on the field.

Then i thought perhaps thats the problem, we still have the same old players on the field. (I dont know why i was watching last years grand final, just looking for a moment where it could somehow change and we end up winning.)

Every time we are in trouble its the same old players we have to turn to and they dont seem to have much left to give perhaps? I am not good at analysing these things, so what does someone with a clue have to say? what is essentially the difference between the current team of the last few weeks compared to the team that played in the last 2 grand finals? is it just form? or a weak tired game plan?? or a lack of a type of player? Or did we just have our day in the sun?

if we cant somehow fluke a turn around this year i cant see us challenging for the flag for the next five years at least.

[liz]

In recent years, the Swans have earned the tag of the team that works the hardest when they don't have the ball. At the moment I don't think they are working anything like as hard. Not all of them, but it only takes a couple to drop off slightly and gaps start to open up all over the place.

Add to that the fact that other teams have probably raised their workrate, especially when they play us, and we come back to the field pretty quickly.

I still see the woeful skill level at the moment as a symptom of something else not quite working as it should, rather than the main issue in itself. Though having a couple of blokes capable of taking contested marks around the ground would be a nice start - one skill area not often talked about where we seem to be well down compared to other teams at the moment.

[Danzar]

How often do you see Sydney shepherd?

Rarely.

Just one example but it says a lot.

[liz]

How often do you see Sydney shepherd?

Rarely.

Just one example but it says a lot.

Except that we've had discussions on here about shepherding over the past few years and the general feeling has been that it's not been one of the team's strong points.

So while it may be a valid observation, it doesn't really explain why they're not currently achieving what they did in 2005-6.

[Nico]

Appears to me that some players have dropped off the pace. J Bolton certainly and Bevan has continued to be poor. Mathews was doing a reasonable stopping job early in the season but his last few have been woeful.

Ablett's poor disposal is now so obvious probably because the team was going so well in the past it was a bit disguised, as others were worse.

Hall's form drop is a big factor.

McVeigh has gone backwards at a 100mph.

Buchanan is just not getting near the footy and for someone with so much stamina and ability to finish games off, he must be carrying an injury.

Dempster hasn't stepped up.

Kennelly out is a huge loss and LRT and he gave us so much more back half structure. Their absence puts enormous pressure on Barry, Bolton, Richards and Malceski who have done a manfull job so far. When you have to rely on Mathews and Bevan and struggling Dempster to make up the numbers back there together with midfielders who are poor at getting back because of lack of pace (except Kirk and Schmidt when he is on)then something has to give.

Put Kennelly, LRT, Schneider and hopefully Hall into that side and drop Bevan, Mathews, Vogels and J Bolton and we will be cooking again. Dempster stays because he plays so much better and with confidence with the full backline around him.

[ScottH]

I don't think we've ever been the most skillful team (no matter what the experts say). I think we have been the most skillful teams tactically. IE. skilled at waiting and finding a free player and hitting them on the chest.

Now teams are working harder without the ball (as liz pointed out what we used to do) and putting pressure on us we are turning the ball over much more often.

So the teams who are more skillful are whipping our buts early. Then tire out as the swans work there way back into the game. The better teams hang on for a win.

[TheMase]

I think there are several key ingredients missing.

• Talk between players ie. You're Hot!
• The players in the past couple of years that have been key to our side, making less quality players looking better than they are (ie. Goodes, Hall, O'Loughlin, Barry etc are not performing, and it is effecting the likes of McVeigh, Matthews etc)
• I am not sure it is our skills that are totally ordinary, but our leading. The players are not running hard enough, nor 'creating space'
• Not enough pressure on the opposition to force the turn over, especially in the forward 50
• Tempo football continuous - In previous seasons we would slow the game down and have periods of 'burst' where we'd put on 3-4 goals in only a 5-10 minute period. This season has seen us save that all up and try to come back in the last quarter.
• Lack of height in defense is putting extra pressure on other defenders, and midfielders.
• Without Kennelly we have a lost one of our ONLY major offensive weapons.
• Basically, our weak players have been exposed. Matthews is getting slower, McVeigh is soft and lacks pace, hardness. Bevan, whilst has endeavor does not have the skill. Lack of preparation on youngsters also means we were not prepared for injuries.

People say our skills are down because of the pressure the opposition is applying on us. I don't buy that. We were under pressure in many games last year, and in 2005 and have never looked like rabble we currently do.

I think some of the things above has made some contribution to it, and now it has become a question of confidence above everything else.

[ScottH]

[*]Talk between players ie. You're Hot!

This could dangerous when they are doing team bonding sessions.

[TheMase]

This could dangerous when they are doing team bonding sessions.

Whatever it takes to get the confidence back

[Swannette]

Have just watched a fair bit of the Hawks/Pies match and the quite outstanding skill level on show in that game had both of us asking several times - why can't we do that? Fair dinkum - the contested marks were amazing, the accurate kicking - rarely to the bootlaces, and the handball hardly ever to a man in trouble. Even Melbourne on Friday night had great skills. Sheesh - this is really an area where we've gone backwards this year. Sigh.

[NMWBloods]

Maybe what's wrong is that the team had only a season and a half of good play in it. It wore itself out in that intense period and has nothing to fall back on.

[ScottH]

Maybe what's wrong is that the team had only a season and a half of good play in it. It wore itself out in that intense period and has nothing to fall back on.

Wheels fallen off?

[stellation]

Wheels fallen off?

NARF!

[Hazcam]

i think you need to look at the fct that since 2003 we have played in at least the 2nd week of the finals. you can't assume this will happen all the time. this year we went with the same philosphy of going with the older players (eg. getting spida) so we can milk out another premiership witht he list. If we had luck on our side we could well be going for 3 straight flags this year. thats a pretty amazing feat.

im tipping a bottim 8 finish next year and a close call as to whether we make the finals or not this year. i've watched a fair few matches/highlights this year (thanks to foxtel) and there are alot of teams fairing better/look more promising than us: hawthorn, adelaide, west coast, collingwood, essendon, st kilda, north melbourne.

we are in the 6-10th position as far as i see it.

to compare how we've faired vs other major teams since 2000:

'00 '01 '02 '03 '04 '05 '06

adelaide: 11th 8th p/f s/f 12th p/f p/f
brisbane: s/f PREM PREM PREM g/f 11th 13th
sydney:7th 7th 11th p/f s/f prem g/f
essendon: PREM g/f s/f s/f s/f 13th 15th
west coast: 13th 14th 8th 7th 7th g/f PREM
collingwood: 15th 9th g/f g/f 13th 15th 5th
port adelaide: 14th s/f p/f p/f PREM s/f 12th

(hopefully the table came out rigth if not my apologies)

basically out of the last 7 premiership sides and other consistent contenders, Sydney has made at least the 2nd week of the finals on 4/7 times.
adelaide: 4 times
brisbane: 5 times
essendon: 4 times
c'wood: 2 times
port power: 5 times

we've missed the finals only 1/7 times.
adelaide: 2x
brisbane: 2x
essendon: 2x
west coast: 2x
collingwood: 4x
port: 2x

So based on that Sydney has been one of the most consistent sides post millenium. Although we unfortunately couldn't do a brisbane (3 straight) or a port adelaide (minor premiers 3 straight) but we've been pretty solid. It's interesting if you look at the trends, after a lean year or 2, sies come tot he fore for a few seasons before tapering out. Every team except for adelaide and collingwood has built up to a flag. Maybe this could be their year? Or even Hawthorn?

Sydney will make up the finals numbers this year, sorry to say....

[swansrule100]

which also means we havent had any decent draft picks.