Season is nearly over what do we need for next year?

[SimonH]

History suggests that we will trade for a KPP (as we do need one) rather than draft one with our first-round pick.

Our first round pick (and almost certainly our second as well, if we don't trade it) will be a mid, again, unless the Swans have an unexpected change of heart.

Top of my wish-list among realistic options is Adam McPhee. Has the body and ability to be a true KPP, but is generally played in a second-fiddle/Teddie Richards style role at the Dons. Hard to see them being interested in any of our players who would be put up for trade (JBolt is now approaching an untradeable age, and his current form would probably make us disinclined to trade him anyway), and they might blanch at our 2nd rounder. But you can't win if you don't try.

Talking of the likes of Roughead is like saying, 'Hey-- why don't we pick up Jono Brown and Nick Riewoldt? They can both play a bit.' Fantasyland stuff. Certainly don't go anywhere near Courtney Johns. Alan Didak won't be going anywhere near Sydney (nor are small forwards a special area of need), so no point speculating about him.

[Rob-bloods]

No doubt Tenace will come up again this year we were linked with him prior.

I like a few of the Freo players who are skilled types but not progressing in that schmozzle of a club. There is some flair there that we lack and we do have a knack for getting something from reasonable recycling.

In broad terms we must get a fullback and add goalscoring potency quality disposal.

The club has a rap on Meredith he was picked up for his disposal...hope that's true.

The reserves watchers comments on Currie sound very encouraging, look forward to seeing him in the team.

Retirements Matthews, Everitt...Davis perhaps?

[SimonH]

Without needlessly quoting your whole post Ludwig, they're some good points nicely written.

However, seeing the list of "first class" players tells us something: Moore, Bird, Jack and Vespa. All mids/small forwards/small defenders. Guys who've had injury-hit 2008s who (if they make the cut) can reasonably be expected to kick on hard in 2009: Thornton, Meredith, DOK, Laidlaw, Schmidt. Same story.

In terms of potential KPPs among the up-and-comers: Barlow has currently stalled, Grundy is presently just marking time as a stopgap defender (when the only really impressive footy he's played at the top level has been as a marking forward), White might make it but is yet to impress at the top level, Faulks is probably a tall flanker/pocket rather than a true KPP, Playfair is best politely described as a 'depth player who makes a contest' (and is none too young anyway), and the likes of Murphy and the Canadian rookie are still very speculative. We look pretty light on for quality KPPs.

Even if Sydney went contrary to form and picked a quality KPP with their first draft pick (there are apparently guaranteed to be some good'uns still around), we wouldn't really have the 2-3 years up our sleeves for him to develop and reach reliable AFL standard. It's just about time to gamble on another big-ticket trade.

[ShockOfHair]

Agree SimonH. We've got some gun midfielders and small forwards on the way through, but dearth of KPPs, especially up back. Leo's openly talking about possibly retiring at the end of this year -- it's hard to see him here after next season.

Grundy seems better suited up forward. I reckon there's room still for LRT, who's not had a good year, but he'll never be leader of the band up back. Brendan Murphy is spending most of his time in the twos at full back or CHB, but he's two or three years away from playing a prominent role.

I don't see any big name defenders we could pick anyone up in the draft, but there may another under the radar player like Mattner or B2 willing to switch.

[smasher]

We desperately need defenders and KPP.If you look at who's available in the draft we definatly could get a running half back flanker.There are also some big guys who will be available to us.Roosy wants to go for youth so we need to use our draft picks on previously undrafted players.
I think ROK is our only tradeable player who we would get someone good for although I would hate to see him go.

[Legs Akimbo]

I can see a possible trade of Nick Davis for either Ryan Murphy of Freo or a tall Carlton defender (like Setanta or Thornton), but this is just speculation.

Let's trade for Santata so we have on our list...

2 ex Gaelic footballers
2 rugby league background
1 ex rugby union international
1 volleyball background
1 basketball background
1 hurling background

...how about a soccor player or hockey? Seriously, bot sure carrying so many 'experiments' at the same time is such a great idea.

Anyway, great post Ludwig - you hit the nail on the head. Whilst there is much promise on our list, there is a lot of risk.

[liz]

Let's trade for Santata so we have on our list...

2 ex Gaelic footballers
2 rugby league background
1 ex rugby union international
1 volleyball background
1 basketball background
1 hurling background

...how about a soccor player or hockey? Seriously, bot sure carrying so many 'experiments' at the same time is such a great idea.

Anyway, great post Ludwig - you hit the nail on the head. Whilst there is much promise on our list, there is a lot of risk.

3 ex Gaelic footballers - don't forget the Swans have already signed Kyle Coney onto the rookie list for next year.

+1 National underage RU representative (LRT)

Goodes maybe fits the bill as an ex-soccer player. Only switched to AFL aged 15,

[ScottH]

Kelly was a League boy up to about 15/16.

He turned out OK, AFAIK.

[Jeffers1984]

They are all no good. Ryce Shaw was the one who got off lightly out the debacle a couple of weeks ago.

Tim Boyle, absolute waste of time. Ordinary player at the very best. When he has played against us he has been pretty weak. Wouldn't think he is any better than Henry Playfair.

Agree Nico. No to Tim Boyle for me. Would struggle to hold the number 1 forward position for us.

[ScottH]

Another "couple of years left" ruckman?

Melbourne ruckman Jeff White vows to play on | Herald Sun

[Donners]

Wouldn't it be ironic to sign White to play second-fiddle to Jolly?

[hammo]

History suggests that we will trade for a KPP (as we do need one) rather than draft one with our first-round pick.

Our first round pick (and almost certainly our second as well, if we don't trade it) will be a mid, again, unless the Swans have an unexpected change of heart.

Top of my wish-list among realistic options is Adam McPhee. Has the body and ability to be a true KPP, but is generally played in a second-fiddle/Teddie Richards style role at the Dons. Hard to see them being interested in any of our players who would be put up for trade (JBolt is now approaching an untradeable age, and his current form would probably make us disinclined to trade him anyway), and they might blanch at our 2nd rounder. But you can't win if you don't try.

Talking of the likes of Roughead is like saying, 'Hey-- why don't we pick up Jono Brown and Nick Riewoldt? They can both play a bit.' Fantasyland stuff. Certainly don't go anywhere near Courtney Johns. Alan Didak won't be going anywhere near Sydney (nor are small forwards a special area of need), so no point speculating about him.

How old is McPhee, Simon? It's an interesting proposition and certainly Essendon are a rebuilding club who may be looking to trade for picks. I wouldn't want to offer a lot for him though and therein lies the problem.

Contrary to the popular opinion here, I also don't think Fremantle will be willing to offload any of their talented youngsters. It will be a big cut at the top for them with a lot of experience retiring or being delisted so they can build from the bottom.

Kosi's name keeps being mooted for trade and it is one of those trades that has the potential to benefit the player, old club (St Kilda) and new club. The Saints will have to do some rebuilding as their current list won't get near a flag and have the sort of players that would interest a lot of clubs in trades. Roos' relationship with Lyon could assist us in this regard. I would say as far as St Kilda goes, Kosi has the most trade value and could be expendable to them. Del Santo, Milne, the Raf and Xavier Clarke may all go as well, as well as the Gerhig and Harvey retirements. That's a good position for St Kilda to be in as far as trade week goes.

If ROK is going to play more of a midfield role for us, I wonder if Ash Hansen at the Eagles is worth looking at for our forward line? A change of clubs might benefit him as well.

And given the huge gap in experience between our current midfield and our future one, Ben Cousins shapes as the perfect, albeit flawed, pick-up to rotate between the midfield and forward line. Players of his class rarely come along as cheaply as we could get him for (a PSD pick) and we could still get 3 or 4 good years out of him. Our young mids would also benefit from training and playing alongside one of the best attacking players to have played the game.

Despite the Chambers debacle, I am confident we won't go anywhere near O'hAilpin and Johns.

[smasher]

3 ex Gaelic footballers - don't forget the Swans have already signed Kyle Coney onto the rookie list for next year.

+1 National underage RU representative (LRT)

Goodes maybe fits the bill as an ex-soccer player. Only switched to AFL aged 15,

Don't forget the cricketers: Moore and Buccy

[Lohengrin]

How old is McPhee

He's 25.

[Ludwig]

In terms of potential KPPs among the up-and-comers: Barlow has currently stalled, Grundy is presently just marking time as a stopgap defender (when the only really impressive footy he's played at the top level has been as a marking forward), White might make it but is yet to impress at the top level, Faulks is probably a tall flanker/pocket rather than a true KPP, Playfair is best politely described as a 'depth player who makes a contest' (and is none too young anyway), and the likes of Murphy and the Canadian rookie are still very speculative. We look pretty light on for quality KPPs.

This was part of my point. We have a number of players, particularly KPPs as you have noted, that are too good to delist but perhaps not good enough for the seniors just yet. We just don't know, and won't be in position to know until they can get some more playing time. If Grundy, White, Barlow and Murphy all come through, and many on this board have suggested that they will, the KPP problem is solved, even with a bit of overkill. I think 2 out of these 4 will suffice until Goodes retires.

If you start to do the end of year list changes, you'll see how difficult it will be to both take advantage of a good draft without dropping players with potential. And if we trade for a KPP it will only make it harder to evaluate the potential of these taller KPPs now playing mostly in the seconds.

With Leo, MOL and Barry all looking like they are near certain to go on at least through next year, there will hardly be many KP opportunities until these retirements materialise, maybe in 2010. I think it will be next year that a trade or draft decision will loom large. Hopefully by then we will better know the destinies of the likes of White, Murphy, Grundy, Faulks, Barlow, Pyke and Orreal, and we might add to that list LRT and Playfair.

I think this is a good year to get the most we can from the draft and leave the big trades for another time.