Great opportunity to revitalize our list

[tombomb]

I think we need to be super active in the trade period and i think we have a great opportunity to revitalize our list for the next 5 years.

We have to be willing to lose hall and okeefe. Personally i think hall would be a far bigger loss than okeefe. Even though OKeefe is out of contract, he is likely to attract a bit of a bidding war from melbourne clubs.

here is a possible scenario for okeefe and hall
okeefe - hawthorn - pick 16 plus tim boyle.
hall - Bulldogs - pick (28 or whatever it is) + farren ray

we then on trade one of our second round picks to essendon for lovett.

leaving us with picks 11 (?), 16, 28
gaining boyle, ray and lovett
losing hall and okeefe.

yes we are losing 2 quality players ... but hall has one maybe 2 years left, and his behaviour this year cant be ignored. Okeefe is gone, even if he changes his mind i think we should try and trade him. A player who openly says that he wants to see what he can get from other clubs ... needs to be traded. If all the talk is right then clubs are not going to trade picks inside the top 10 ... which rules out essendon, port, richmond, carlton. A straight swap for a pick inside the top 10 would be preferred to trading with hawthorn but i think we might not have that option.

Anyways, those are my thoughts ...

[Plugger46]

A player who openly says that he wants to see what he can get from other clubs ... needs to be traded.

Disagree with that one entirely. O'Keefe is 28 and about to enter the last major contract of his career. He should be trying to get the best possible contract he can. The days of club loyalty are well gone, and rightly so - as clubs rarely show loyalty to players.

[tombomb]

The days of club loyalty are well gone, and rightly so - as clubs rarely show loyalty to players.

Report in the paper this morning that he is being paid $450k this year by sydney

Club loyalty may be gone but greed is alive and well.

Okeefe has squeezed us before on contracts.

[Plugger46]

Report in the paper this morning that he is being paid $450k this year by sydney

Club loyalty may be gone but greed is alive and well.

Okeefe has squeezed us before on contracts.

He has 4 years or so left playing footy at the highest level. From what I've seen of him, he won't have a career in the media and I'm not sure if he has any qualifications outside of football - so it makes sense to look at all options.

He's an absolute star and deserves everything he gets in my opinion.

[tombomb]

Carlton says O'Keefe uses dirty tricks | The Australian

"We've got plenty of room inside the cap for several players in the calibre of O'Keefe," an angry Swann said. "If O'Keefe's serious, we'll have a closer look at it, but we don't think he is serious, he might be chasing a bit more money from the Swans."

Roos said he could not explain why the out-of-contract O'Keefe was in dispute, or why he was yesterday being shopped around Melbourne clubs by his management.

"We just don't know, I'm certainly none the wiser," Roos said. "Last Monday week he came back to us with his revised request and we accepted it. I don't know what's changed."

I had a friend who was on the swans top up list a few years ago when they were playing in the sydney league (i think as the redbacks). Anyways, i remember asking him who at the club was a dickhead and the only person he said was okeefe.

time to cut him loose!

[ShockOfHair]

Of all the Swans players, I'd have thought O'Keefe would rank lowest on the d-head table. Always come across as genuinely nice bloke - not the most riveting interview subject, but a decent guy as well as one of our top four players.

[tombomb]

Of all the Swans players, I'd have thought O'Keefe would rank lowest on the d-head table. Always come across as genuinely nice bloke - not the most riveting interview subject, but a decent guy as well as one of our top four players.

can only really go on what my mate told me ... he did also say that cresswell was a d-head. Plus it does seem a little odd for a player to be openly saying it is an issue of money ... not length of contract or other factors. Especially for a player who is already so well paid.

[liz]

It's hard to get excited about a list "revitalisation" that involves giving up two of our genuine matchwinners for a Playfair-wannabee, a skinny outside player with so-so skills and an inconsistent runner with off-field issues.

Boyle and Ray do nothing for me. Lovett does address one of the squad's weaknesses but he represents a new coat of paint rather than a complete refurbishment.

As for one person who played with the club as a top-up over 6 years ago maybe not getting along with O'Keefe, it is hard to see that as compelling evidence for getting rid of him. He's certainly shown no external signs of DH-ness onfield or in the media, and on the couple of occasions I've had the pleasure of chatting with him, he's been absolutely charming.

[Lohengrin]

It's hard to get excited about a list "revitalisation" that involves giving up two of our genuine matchwinners for a Playfair-wannabee, a skinny outside player with so-so skills and an inconsistent runner with off-field issues.

What are all these examples of ROK being a matchwinner?

Boyle and Ray do nothing for me. Lovett does address one of the squad's weaknesses but he represents a new coat of paint rather than a complete refurbishment.

As for one person who played with the club as a top-up over 6 years ago maybe not getting along with O'Keefe, it is hard to see that as compelling evidence for getting rid of him. He's certainly shown no external signs of DH-ness onfield or in the media, and on the couple of occasions I've had the pleasure of chatting with him, he's been absolutely charming.

Ah, now I understand.

[tombomb]

It's hard to get excited about a list "revitalisation" that involves giving up two of our genuine matchwinners for a Playfair-wannabee, a skinny outside player with so-so skills and an inconsistent runner with off-field issues.

I think you are being biased to label okeefe a genuine matchwinner.

Ray/lovett are both speedy midfielders ... which is exactly what we need.
Boyle is not just a playfair wannabee ... we did trade like pick 40 or something last year for playfair ... so you would have to say that pick 16+40 for rok would not be a complete disaster. Plus boyle is a great kick and is clearly surplus in a team with roughead and franklin.

We need to make changes to our list. we are not going to play in the grand final for the next 5 years if our one trading move is to trade nick davis for pick 60. The way i see it is that it is great that okeefe is happy to leave ... no sentimentality in booting a premiership player ... we either do something drastic this year ... or we will be stuffed for a very long time. we wont have anything worthwhile to trade for the next few years ... plus we wont have get any decent picks because of the new sides.

[caj23]

I think you are being biased to label okeefe a genuine matchwinner.

I suggest you watch a tape of the rd 16 Carlton game at Telstra Dome for an example.

As for your 5 year plan, it is the worst time ever to bottom out as the new Gold Coast and West Sydney franchises are going to be monopolising the draft for 4 of those years

[tombomb]

I suggest you watch a tape of the rd 16 Carlton game at Telstra Dome for an example.

I watched the game and he played a great game, as did jude bolton.

By that definition every player who has ever played a great game or got brownlow votes is a genuine matchwinner.

As for your 5 year plan, it is the worst time ever to bottom out as the new Gold Coast and West Sydney franchises are going to be monopolising the draft for 4 of those years

I dont necessarily see us bottoming out. We won multiple games this year without hall, so really you are talking about losing okeefe but adding (hypothetically) ray, lovett, and boyle. Im not talking about bottoming out. If we go with the same list, we will struggle to make the 8 next year, wont make the 8 the following year and not have any barganing power to trade for draft picks or have any picks of our own. We need a change, the era has finished the list needs to change.

[Lohengrin]

I suggest you watch a tape of the rd 16 Carlton game at Telstra Dome for an example.

One game.

[caj23]

One game.

FFS i didnt realise I had to name a certain number

Just how many games does it take to qualify as a matchwinner?

I'm not going to go back and review his career but 2005 Preliminary Final is another obvious example

[caj23]

I watched the game and he played a great game, as did jude bolton.

By that definition every player who has ever played a great game or got brownlow votes is a genuine matchwinner.

Um no that is just stupid and not what I said at all, OI'Keefe was a genuine matchwinner on the day who got us over the line on the day by virtue of his own solo performance. I don't think Bolton was/is a matchwinner

I dont necessarily see us bottoming out. We won multiple games this year without hall, so really you are talking about losing okeefe but adding (hypothetically) ray, lovett, and boyle. Im not talking about bottoming out. If we go with the same list, we will struggle to make the 8 next year, wont make the 8 the following year and not have any barganing power to trade for draft picks or have any picks of our own. We need a change, the era has finished the list needs to change.

Ray, Lovett and Boyle are strugglers and if you think they are going to take us anywhere near a premiership in the future you are sorely mistaken.