Under Achieving Youngsters

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  • Hartijon
    On the Rookie List
    • May 2008
    • 1536

    Under Achieving Youngsters

    One could not help but be impressed by the Crows youngsters.Kids in other teams have really made their mark as well (Selwood,Rioli etc).The Swans have little to cheer about apart from a brief early burst by Barlow that fizzed out and Vezpremi,s belated but impressive debut.What's the Problem??

    1.Our luck ran out. We have been so lucky in the past with late draft picks(Goodes,O'Keefe etc) it could not last
    2.We used Rookies to fill so many gaps and it worked well.Now it is not working so well!
    3 The Canberra League is not a good nurturing ground
    4.We won a Premiership playing man on man.Youngsters need to be quite physically mature to handle the rigours of this game plan.(remember Simmonds?)
    5.Lack of opportunity.We have an established older team that it is hard to break into
    6.Little game time..Same point as 6 except when picked,they spend little time on the ground.Compare that to the young Goodes who had to carry the rucks all day and came on so much because of it.
    7.A settled game plan.Youngsters are impulsive creative individualistic...its all been said before!We are not that kind of team.
    8.Maybe poor selections but I think selection is very hard.Sure some have not come on but what a turn around for Mc veigh! You do need to give them a couple of seasons .

    Having said all that Jack,Moore,Vespa, Bird have the potential to come on and take the next step.We need them to!
  • SCGonasunnyday
    Warming the Bench
    • Dec 2007
    • 323

    #2
    Good points, would have to say it is probably a bit of all of the above.

    Perhaps the money and science involved in the draft now means that a top 10 pick is close to a certainty and a 50+ pick is more of a hail mary than it was in the past. Just looking at a couple of Brisbane games and seeing Daniel Rich, I was struck by how much of a future star this guy would be. Some errors but he was in everything and I can imagine how good he will be in 5 years.

    Laidlaw, Smith, Thornton, Brabazon etc. I have seen nothing to give me that sort of feeling, but who knows. I think a player needs a minimum 10 games in a team in a row to get a chance to prove themselves. Yet we seem to throw in a new player for 1 game against Geelong. Look at Bevan compared to Grundy - who would have the most confidence?? One gets time and the coach's confidence, the other in and out of the team and playing in different positions.

    Barlow could be the best thing since sliced cheese but unless we suffer clangers, opportunities missed goals kicked against etc (ie what happens when a raw inexperienced player is put in) for a while, will we ever know?

    Last of alll, if DOK doesn't make it I will be so disappointed, 1st round pick in the superdraft... How could we get that wrong.

    But Veszpremi - excitement plus.

    Comment

    • dimelb
      pr. dim-melb; m not f
      • Jun 2003
      • 6889

      #3
      I suspect that one of the big imponderables (I mean it can make a big difference but we can't measure it) is personality/attitude. All the youngsters, including the ones I think of as fringe players ATM e.g. "Laidlaw, Smith, Thornton, Brabazon etc.", come into this team somewhat overawed by the new company they find themselves in and probably somewhat anxious about how they will go, compounded by the thought that this is their shot at a living for the next few years and the knowledge that many are called but few are chosen.
      There is one bloke who, and this is only my impression, does not seem to be weighed down by any of this baggage. He works his guts out, applies himself with unfaltering enthusiasm to his new trade, is as willing (in an old fashioned sense) as anyone on the paddock, plays like there is no tomorrow to worry about and shows no sign of being a problem off the field. After the shortest stint in the game and with a long way to go yet, he has improved so noticeably that he could be getting serious first grade time this year. His name is Pyke, and I would like to see these aspects of his example become infectious.
      Perhaps his age and previous experience has something to do with it.
      He reminds him of the guys, close-set, slow, and never rattled, who were play-makers on the team. (John Updike, seeing Josh Kennedy in a crystal ball)

      Comment

      • Legs Akimbo
        Grand Poobah
        • Apr 2005
        • 2809

        #4
        Originally posted by SCGonasunnyday
        Last of alll, if DOK doesn't make it I will be so disappointed, 1st round pick in the superdraft... How could we get that wrong.
        Just for the record, here is the list of players taken subsequently to DoK. Judge away.

        Mitchell Brown
        Shaun Hampson
        Leroy Jetta
        Shaun Grigg
        Tom Hislop
        Gavin Urquhart
        Albert Proud
        Paul Stewart
        Brent Renouf
        Nathan Djerrkura
        Shane Edwards
        Brad Howard
        Chris Dawes
        Eric MacKenzie
        Ricky Petterd
        Clayton Collard
        Kurt Tippett
        Jarryd Morton
        Chris Schmidt
        Mark Austin
        Alwyn Davey
        Todd Goldstein
        James Hawksley
        Nathan Krakouer
        Josh P. Kennedy
        Tom Hawkins
        Bachar Houli
        Tim Houlihan
        Brad Dick
        Brennan Stack
        Colin Garland
        Kyle Reimers
        David Mackay
        Daniel Currie
        Will Schofield
        Clint Benjamin
        Brock O'Brien
        Lindsay Thomas
        Matt Tyler
        Robert Gray
        Garry Moss
        Simon Hogan
        Daniel Connors
        Jarryd Allen
        Carl Peterson
        Josh Hill
        Isack Weetra
        Tyson Goldsack
        Nick Gill
        Peter Faulks
        Malcolm Lynch
        Joe Anderson
        Ben Warren
        Sam Sheldon
        Justin Westhoff
        Andrew Collins
        Matthew Ferguson
        Paul O'Shea
        Calib Mourish
        Bryce Campbell
        Jesse White
        James Thomson
        Aaron Edwards
        Ryan Williams
        David Rodan
        He had observed that people who did lie were, on the whole, more resourceful and ambitious and successful than people who did not lie.

        Comment

        • Hartijon
          On the Rookie List
          • May 2008
          • 1536

          #5
          Originally posted by Legs Akimbo
          Just for the record, here is the list of players taken subsequently to DoK. Judge away.

          Mitchell Brown
          Shaun Hampson
          Leroy Jetta
          Shaun Grigg
          Tom Hislop
          Gavin Urquhart
          Albert Proud
          Paul Stewart
          Brent Renouf
          Nathan Djerrkura
          Shane Edwards
          Brad Howard
          Chris Dawes
          Eric MacKenzie
          Ricky Petterd
          Clayton Collard
          Kurt Tippett
          Jarryd Morton
          Chris Schmidt
          Mark Austin
          Alwyn Davey
          Todd Goldstein
          James Hawksley
          Nathan Krakouer
          Josh P. Kennedy
          Tom Hawkins
          Bachar Houli
          Tim Houlihan
          Brad Dick
          Brennan Stack
          Colin Garland
          Kyle Reimers
          David Mackay
          Daniel Currie
          Will Schofield
          Clint Benjamin
          Brock O'Brien
          Lindsay Thomas
          Matt Tyler
          Robert Gray
          Garry Moss
          Simon Hogan
          Daniel Connors
          Jarryd Allen
          Carl Peterson
          Josh Hill
          Isack Weetra
          Tyson Goldsack
          Nick Gill
          Peter Faulks
          Malcolm Lynch
          Joe Anderson
          Ben Warren
          Sam Sheldon
          Justin Westhoff
          Andrew Collins
          Matthew Ferguson
          Paul O'Shea
          Calib Mourish
          Bryce Campbell
          Jesse White
          James Thomson
          Aaron Edwards
          Ryan Williams
          David Rodan
          Holy @@@@! that says it all! Can't believe the quality on this list! DOK was seriously rated above these? You gotta be kidding me?

          Comment

          • The Big Cat
            On the veteran's list
            • Apr 2006
            • 2360

            #6
            Tom Hawkins was a father/son - can't count him.
            Those who have the greatest power to hurt us are those we love.

            Comment

            • Jeffers1984
              Veterans List
              • Jan 2003
              • 4564

              #7
              Mitch Brown was the one there. Will be a gun KP for the Eagles.
              Official Driver Of The "Who Gives A @@@@ As The Player Will Get Delisted Anyway" Bandwagon.

              Comment

              • Legs Akimbo
                Grand Poobah
                • Apr 2005
                • 2809

                #8
                Originally posted by Jeffers1984
                Mitch Brown was the one there. Will be a gun KP for the Eagles.
                Yep - that was the one that pissed me off at the time. The others I can live with.
                He had observed that people who did lie were, on the whole, more resourceful and ambitious and successful than people who did not lie.

                Comment

                • Number 43
                  Warming the Bench
                  • Dec 2008
                  • 168

                  #9
                  Originally posted by Legs Akimbo
                  Yep - that was the one that pissed me off at the time. The others I can live with.
                  What about Jetta, Houli and Alwyn Davey? Any of them would be pretty good at the feet of Hall and O'Loughlin.

                  Comment

                  • Legs Akimbo
                    Grand Poobah
                    • Apr 2005
                    • 2809

                    #10
                    Originally posted by Number 43
                    What about Jetta, Houli and Alwyn Davey? Any of them would be pretty good at the feet of Hall and O'Loughlin.
                    I think there was a thread on drafting indigenous players going around somewhere...

                    P.S. - I realise that Houli is not aboriginal
                    He had observed that people who did lie were, on the whole, more resourceful and ambitious and successful than people who did not lie.

                    Comment

                    • Mr Magoo
                      Senior Player
                      • May 2008
                      • 1255

                      #11
                      Please enlighten me as to which of those named are stars of the game.

                      There are some useful players but very few stars on that list. I see about a dozen names that stand out as players with some potential but not much more (and I agree you can forget hawkins as he would have otherwise gone top ten if not for the father son rule) and even most of those have only gained such standing in the past season.

                      Comment

                      • caj23
                        Senior Player
                        • Aug 2003
                        • 2462

                        #12
                        Originally posted by Mr Magoo
                        Please enlighten me as to which of those named are stars of the game.

                        There are some useful players but very few stars on that list. I see about a dozen names that stand out as players with some potential but not much more (and I agree you can forget hawkins as he would have otherwise gone top ten if not for the father son rule) and even most of those have only gained such standing in the past season.
                        Just off the top of my head, Brown did a great job in his first season as a key position backman, had a knee reco last year. I was very disapointed on draft day when we skipped him for someone i'd neverh heard of

                        Hampson and Renouf have proven to be adequate support ruckmen at senior level in their short careers, a position we are sorely lacking in.

                        having said that i hope dok shows something this year as he must be on his final chance

                        Comment

                        • ScottH
                          It's Goodes to cheer!!
                          • Sep 2003
                          • 23665

                          #13
                          You have to look at the team that these players who have played, were drafted into. Most of them sould be the bottom half of the ladder teams over the past few years, or teams suffering long injury lists.Not the teams that have been successful consistently over in recent years.

                          Comment

                          • Ludwig
                            Veterans List
                            • Apr 2007
                            • 9359

                            #14
                            Dok

                            Here's an article that may help to explain why Daniel O'Keefe hasn't progressed very far. Sounds like he is virtually starting from scratch due to injuries, and maybe he can show something this year in the Reserves.

                            Comment

                            • 2005
                              : IN THE OUTER :
                              • Dec 2007
                              • 604

                              #15
                              Worrying thing he said was that he played better against Melbourne than he did Port.Maybe he meant he spent more time on the ground against Melbourne than he did against Port
                              Est 1874
                              SMFC
                              09.18.33.2005

                              Comment

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