2009 Rate a Season: #3 Jarrad McVeigh

[Armchair Coach]

I gave him 5. Bit of a meh-factor this year, considering 2008. He was out injured though at times. He needs to (and can be) alot better.

[BeeEmmAre]

Score after 27 voters - 7.07/10

[Chilcott]

I wanteed to give him a 6.5.

Had some very good games, but was quiet in other games.

I think that was due playing while injured. Had problems with his groins and hammy's this season.

[caj23]

7 - Which may be a bit harsh as I definitely think he was hampered by injuries last season. One of our most important players now and we really missed him when he was absent.

If he can get a bit more support in the midfield next year he will really tear it up

Late developers those McVeigh boys!!

[hammo]

Geez I wonder whether some people actually watch Swans games.

McVeigh actually averaged more possessions in 2009 than 2008, although his goal kicking was a bit down.

Fair enough he's being judged on a harder scale now, but he's also being tagged harder by the opposition.

McVeigh's possessions would be worth two for every one of Rhys Shaw's who is getting universal praise for bouncing the ball while largely running around in circles in the back half with no opponent.

[Go Swannies]

Geez I wonder whether some people actually watch Swans games.

McVeigh actually averaged more possessions in 2009 than 2008, although his goal kicking was a bit down.

Fair enough he's being judged on a harder scale now, but he's also being tagged harder by the opposition.

McVeigh's possessions would be worth two for every one of Rhys Shaw's who is getting universal praise for bouncing the ball while largely running around in circles in the back half with no opponent.

That's a pretty tough assessment on a B&F leader who also led the AFL for metres gained.

Would you say McVeigh's possessions are worth more than, say, Goodes?

[reigning premier]

Geez I wonder whether some people actually watch Swans games.

McVeigh actually averaged more possessions in 2009 than 2008, although his goal kicking was a bit down.

Fair enough he's being judged on a harder scale now, but he's also being tagged harder by the opposition.

McVeigh's possessions would be worth two for every one of Rhys Shaw's who is getting universal praise for bouncing the ball while largely running around in circles in the back half with no opponent.

So more posessions = Better season but more posessions by Shaw = not as good as McVeigh. I'm confused. Think you are too.

[AnnieH]

What a huge difference this thread is to the rating thread the year before last.

Good one McHack.

[caj23]

The poing Hammo was making was that McVeigh's season is underrated by supporters relative to Shaw's.

McVeigh's use of the ball is far superior to Shaw's and I don't see how you could argue with that.

[reigning premier]

The poing Hammo was making was that McVeigh's season is underrated by supporters relative to Shaw's.

McVeigh's use of the ball is far superior to Shaw's and I don't see how you could argue with that.

Under rated because he under performed. I think McVeigh is our best player. The only one that comes close is Goodes. But the fact is he had an ordinary season.

[Vonsteinman]

Geez I wonder whether some people actually watch Swans games.

McVeigh actually averaged more possessions in 2009 than 2008, although his goal kicking was a bit down.

Fair enough he's being judged on a harder scale now, but he's also being tagged harder by the opposition.

McVeigh's possessions would be worth two for every one of Rhys Shaw's who is getting universal praise for bouncing the ball while largely running around in circles in the back half with no opponent.

Bob Skilton Medal
1. Ryan O?Keefe ? 528 points
2. Rhyce Shaw ? 453 points
3. Brett Kirk ? 421 points
4. Darren Jolly ? 415 points
5. Adam Goodes ? 394 points
6. Jarrad McVeigh ? 366 points

Turns out the Swans coaches weren't watching either Hammo

[hammo]

So more posessions = Better season but more posessions by Shaw = not as good as McVeigh. I'm confused. Think you are too.

No. Possession stats for defenders mean nothing in modern football. A large proportion of Shaw's stats come from him running behind the fullback to switch play, getting a handpass then runing off up field with a few bounces and bombing long to a contest on centre wing. Often he'll track back to the other side of the ground and rack up a few more bounces. Fair enough that's his role, but his high number of possessions and being the leading bouncer in the AFL don't automatically indicate a better season than McVeigh who wins his possessions at clearances.

The poing Hammo was making was that McVeigh's season is underrated by supporters relative to Shaw's.

McVeigh's use of the ball is far superior to Shaw's and I don't see how you could argue with that.

Spot on.

Under rated because he under performed. I think McVeigh is our best player. The only one that comes close is Goodes. But the fact is he had an ordinary season.

You say he underperformed but his stats say otherwise. Maybe he underperformed according to expectations which were set very high, just as Shaw exceeded his quite modest expectations in comparison.

Bob Skilton Medal
1. Ryan O?Keefe ? 528 points
2. Rhyce Shaw ? 453 points
3. Brett Kirk ? 421 points
4. Darren Jolly ? 415 points
5. Adam Goodes ? 394 points
6. Jarrad McVeigh ? 366 points

Turns out the Swans coaches weren't watching either Hammo

Well I am not privy to their reasoning of course, but the Swans coaching panel have historically rated first year, ex Collingwood players very highly - Shauble, Williams and now Shaw.

[reigning premier]

No. Possession stats for defenders mean nothing in modern football. A large proportion of Shaw's stats come from him running behind the fullback to switch play, getting a handpass then runing off up field with a few bounces and bombing long to a contest on centre wing. Often he'll track back to the other side of the ground and rack up a few more bounces. Fair enough that's his role, but his high number of possessions and being the leading bouncer in the AFL don't automatically indicate a better season than McVeigh who wins his possessions at clearances.

If they mean nothing, why did you say his possession count was up in your original post?? Probably best not to argue for stats in McVeigh's case and then use them against Shaw in the next post. Makes you look confused.

Geez I wonder whether some people actually watch Swans games.

McVeigh actually averaged more possessions in 2009 than 2008, although his goal kicking was a bit down.

Fair enough he's being judged on a harder scale now, but he's also being tagged harder by the opposition.

McVeigh's possessions would be worth two for every one of Rhys Shaw's who is getting universal praise for bouncing the ball while largely running around in circles in the back half with no opponent.

[laughingnome]

No. Possession stats for defenders mean nothing in modern football. A large proportion of Shaw's stats come from him running behind the fullback to switch play, getting a handpass then runing off up field with a few bounces and bombing long to a contest on centre wing. Often he'll track back to the other side of the ground and rack up a few more bounces. Fair enough that's his role, but his high number of possessions and being the leading bouncer in the AFL don't automatically indicate a better season than McVeigh who wins his possessions at clearances.

Are you suggesting that there is no merit in switching play from one side of the ground to the other?

I understand the suggestion McVeigh had a harder time this year with tags and that midfielders in general are under more pressure with possessions, but I don't think that's the point. I believe every player on the park busts a gut trying to do their best (with rare exception). These rankings refer not to how hard they tried but to how effective they were. The general perception seems to be McViegh's effectiveness was down as the pressure on him increased, whereas Shaw's effectiveness was up given his role as a running back, something both he and his brother excell at but neither had been given clearance to do regularly before this year. I would be suprised if Shaw ranks as high next year as he no doubt will recieve more defensive pressure from the opposition forward line.

[Primmy]

The poing Hammo was making was that McVeigh's season is underrated by supporters relative to Shaw's.

McVeigh's use of the ball is far superior to Shaw's and I don't see how you could argue with that.

In other words they work well together