LRT, Rohan and Parker are among the worst players in the AFL

[iigrover]

Seriously, Jon Pierik is a dead set idiot...

Tiger six-pack rates a mention

[desredandwhite]

Um. Did you even read the article? It stated that we didn't have any players ranked in the "poor" category.

Either way, these "ratings" are based on pure numbers on a limited set of seasons. Doesn't really reflect effectiveness or impact.

[J_Moore]

They're listed in the "Below Averag (sic)" group, not the poor group, so your thread title is a bit of a stretch.
And Jon Pierik is just reporting on the Champion Data AFL Prospectus. These aren't his value judgements.

And clearly a those guys often didn't make much of an impact on the stats sheet (at least in the area CD uses to assess their respective positions).

It's not really a controversial position to take with LRT, for instance.

He was a key forward/ruck who averaged about a goal a game, and generally got dominated in hitouts when he was used in that area. He was basically used to provide a competitive presence, give some structure to the forward line, and shut down a rebounding CHB/FB if they were on the ground. None of those jobs makes much of a statistical impact.

The article does demonstrate some of the limits of statistical analysis, particularly in a game like Australian Rules (as compared to, say, baseball or cricket, where pretty much everything is statistically quantifiable).

[jetts32]

I can feel the love.
Keiran Jack wouldn't be too far off elite you'd think.
Also if Hanners and Mcveigh play like they did in the finals, there is 2 more elite.

[AnnieH]

Really?
Did Little Ranga play much last year, or was he sitting up in the Brewongle in a cast?

[iigrover]

IMO the idiotic thing about this article is classifying players as Elite or Poor based on select statistics. For those titles to have relevance they would have to take into account many other matters.

As a most basic example, Jon Pierik did not even attempt to weight the statistics for games able to be played. If he did so, I would seriously doubt Rohan would be classified as a Below Average player.

This is even before you get into the notion that a certain statistic has a different value to the team based on the position of the player. For example, if a defender got only lots of tackles and smothers (and no goals) all game, that could be very valuable, yet those same statistics by a full forward may not be as valuable to the team.

So classifying players with such titles based on raw statistics is rubbish, and IMO Jon Pierik is an idiot for attempting to do so.

[Triple B]

Some of the comments are gold, but this one sums it up pretty well..

Any system which puts Gary Rohan and Luke Parker in the same category as Jesse White and Andrejs Everitt is fatally flawed.

Jadzia

Well done Jadzia.

The whole notion of publishing names of guys in the 'poor' category is pretty ordinary form IMO.

[Dosser]

Really?
Did Little Ranga play much last year, or was he sitting up in the Brewongle in a cast?

Yes, but the point is that he wasnt very good at sitting up there.

[707]

Please read the article as that explains how the categories are set up. It basically rates players against each other iin a position, mid, ruck etc and of course is based on Dreamteam points so high possession players rate more highly even though they may not be as effective game wise as players with a lower DT number.

It's why a gun player game winner like Brad Sewell (Mid) is only Above Average but do occasional nice things Luke Bruest (General Fwd) is Elite.

It's why hugely game influencial Lewis Jetta (Mid Fwd) is only Average but role player Ben McGlynn (General Fwd) is Above Average.

The Champion Data AFL Prospectus has been in the shops for six weeks but seems John Pierik has only just discovered it! I can thoroughly recommend spending the $40 on it, it's an absolute bible for the season.

For what it's worth, eight of our Premiership heroes are rated Average and another three Below Average. How the hell did we win the flag?

Looking through the Prospectus, I think I could make up a composite side of only Average players that would go deep into September so statistics are only useful up to a point.

[Nico]

I am now convinced statistics in our game can be so far away from the real picture. I don't know where some of his analysis comes from assuming it was based on 2012 form.

Le Cras - didn't play
Duffield - dropped for most of the season for genuinely poor form (had him in my Supercoach team for a while)
Grimes from Melbourne - from memory injured for quite a while.
Roughead - by all measurements had a howler of a year. had wooden hands and couldn't find the footy. Must have had a poultice of knockouts.

[timthefish]

at a glance lrt certainly looks like one of the worst players in the game but when you watch him for a bit you eventually realise you are watching a player who has a complete understanding of his limitations and (substantial) abilities and who accordingly rarely makes an error.

swans legend. hope he plays 300 games.

[Nico]

at a glance lrt certainly looks like one of the worst players in the game but when you watch him for a bit you eventually realise you are watching a player who has a complete understanding of his limitations and (substantial) abilities and who accordingly rarely makes an error.

swans legend. hope he plays 300 games.

Disagree. For a man of his build I think LRT has few limitations. He is a grossly underrated footballer. He is an outstanding defender and his versatility makes him a very valuable player. Many have forgotten that he missed most of 2006 and 2007 seasons with a foot injury after having a top 2005. He reads the play extremely well and makes few mistakes.

[ShockOfHair]

One of the many great things about the Grand Final was the huge wraps LRT got from the entire commentary crew. I think his stats were among the lowest in the team but he was sensational. He has that rare talent of being able to do the important things when they have to be done.

As for those stats: I can see how these aggregated comparative stats could be meaningful in the context of other measurements but on their own they are useless. Even the rawest Dreamteamer knows that Goodes plays mid and forward, and Delidio plays back and mid, etc, etc,.; how do you 'compare' them to other players? THe only way to really measure a player is against the job he's been given. If I really wanted to measure Jetta's effectiveness I'd rate yards made just as much as goals and possessions because that's the job he's given. Some midfielders are stoppers, some defenders are rebounders, and so on. Every team has a different mix so to call out individual players as this story did is pretty ridiculous.

[GongSwan]

How does Rohan get a mention from his 4 games last year, or Parker who missed alot of footy and then was the sub? Seriously, judging kids now on limited games? Tool

[Velour&Ruffles]

One of the many great things about the Grand Final was the huge wraps LRT got from the entire commentary crew. I think his stats were among the lowest in the team but he was sensational. He has that rare talent of being able to do the important things when they have to be done.

So true. LRT was instrumental in us winning the 2013 flag. A sensational game in defence against the Crows when we were hobbled down there, and then a really important pack busting contribution as a forward in the grand final. On top of his 2005 flag contribution. He's one of the guys you want to have fighting on your side in the trenches. Some egg-headed computer programmer can say he is below average, but my eyes tell me something very different.