Shopping.

[MightyBloods]

Whoever we go shopping for I think they have got to have speed, skills and a footy brain but that is not enough. They also have to have determination to excel and to take it up to the opposition. It is curious but one headline after Sat. was that the Cats 'bullied' the Swans (whatever that means) and I recall that that same phrase was used after another match recently (can't remember who it was against), that the Swans were 'bullied' by the opposition. It seems that without Goodes and LRT and maybe Shaw out there protecting, some of our players are getting pushed around far too easily. I think that Mummy and Benny have not learned, as have the Geelong players, how to be imposing and hard nosed, within the rules. For such a young player AJ was superb in letting his opponent know that he was not going to be physically pushed around!

Ask Nathan Vardy if Mumford is physically imposing!

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We need a bonafide small forward with some x factor.....Mr Betts fits the bill.

Luke Breust would look good in the red & white...oh wait, he did look good!

[Ludwig]

Agree with Triple B. I wouldn't look at any of the 2012 Essendon lot without some sort of AFL drug suspension indemnification in place, which is very unlikely.

I think our main objective should be to sign up Mummy and Jesse. We are a solid and balanced team with a good age mix all over the ground. We really don't need any established players. If anything we could look to trade out someone to improve our draft position. Our speed is okay, if we can keep them on the ground. We were without some of our quickest players this year (Jetta, Rohan, Goodes, Reid, Shaw). All should be okay to go in 2014.

We will add Lloyd Perris to an already deep midfield. There will be several worthy players (Lloyd, Biggs, BJ, Cunningham), that will struggle to get games next year barring injuries, with only Jude exiting from the midfield/forward slot. We will also probably land another good midfield prospect with our first round pick, as the midfield draft is stronger than KPPs this year.

Our tall defenders will be the first that will need replacing due to retirements. But we look okay for next couple of years at least, assuming both LRT and AJ return from injury. If Jesse White can hold his forward spot, then Reid can be moved to the back, which gives us Ted, Reg, LRT, Sammy, AJ and Dre to fight over 3 spots, with Xav looking a likely prospect at this point. Who knows what will be with Walsh. But agree that the tall defender spot is the one we will need to cover first due to age, uncertainties and development time. We can probably get a good prospect this year with our second round pick. Also, at the end of next year GWS will have to start reducing their list size by 2 players, and suspect that there will be a least one good prospect we could nab from them (Jaksch, Corr, Frost, Bruce). Ben Reid will be a free agent next year if he doesn't re-sign, which is something we can look out for if things go bad for us in KPP category next season.

[Bloodthirsty]

How about Fletcher? After a two year ban he'd be available to play for us. He could share accomodation with the Swans players' grandfathers.

[MightyBloods]

How about Fletcher? After a two year ban he'd be available to play for us. He could share accomodation with the Swans players' grandfathers.

and we'll be able to get him under the 'absolutely free agent' rule for anyone who's played over 20 years!

[Ludwig]

How about Fletcher? After a two year ban he'd be available to play for us. He could share accomodation with the Swans players' grandfathers.

I hear he is going to be charged by ASADA for taking drugs for Alzheimer's!!

[707]

OK guys, here's the probable metrics for us in this years Trade/Draft period, a few assumptions are made, the lost picks of Adelaide Cows and Essendon Injectors, the extra activated mid first round pick of GWS and GCS, no more retirements, with our injury woes we go out in straight sets :-(

AFL lists this year were allowed to be 40, we ran with just 38 maybe to save $ to squeeze in Tippett?

We have three retirements so far, Bolton, Mattner, Morton, list now 35.

ND we have picks 14, 30, 48, mid 60s, somewhere in the mid/late 70s

One of those late ones will be used for Lloyd Perris who due to his high ranking won't be a rookie, list now 36, another late one to upgrade Rampe, list now 37.

We'd use picks 14, 30 & 48 you would think, list now 40.

Fairly clear cut eh? Unless Mumford gets traded to GWS, more retirements etc. But at least that are the numbers as they stand.

Soryy to spoil your fun on this thread but I can't see room to trade a player in and you really need a hole in your senior side to attract a player and I can't see that hole once the injured return in 2014.

[wolftone57]

Goodes and LRT have signed on to the end of next year I'm pretty sure.
I don't know what else we need really, it's pretty hard to choose! We have a great back line, a promising forward line, an outstanding midfield - what do we need?

I think you are missing the point of recruiting. Teddy is 30 and has between two and three years left. Reg is 27 and because of his body type can see him retiring at about 30. Teddy has an entirely different body shape more, ectomorph, than Reg who is probably more mesomorph. Ectomorph's like Dustin Fletcher and Michael Tuck found it easier to play longer.

The upshot is we need to start looking or developing KPP in defence. Xav is one we are developing now and Sammy could be an LRT type who can pinch hit either back or forward. But we also need to look at a 'big' key backman. Tommy might be able to fill this role but we may as well get a couple of rookies to develop anyway. We need to develop two rookie rucks. We have one in Sam Naismith but it would be good to recruit young Dawes from Newcastle. He has wonderful build and is obviously talented. Our mids stocks are good but if there is a terror in the pack (another Jetts perhaps) then we should draft him. Speed goes a long way in today's game.

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Goodes won't retire for 2-3 years or more. W

e need a defender and another small forward type would be great.

how do you know this are you psychic? Goodsie's injuries are taking a toll and if he lasts one more season I will be surprised.

[aardvark]

OK guys, here's the probable metrics for us in this years Trade/Draft period, a few assumptions are made, the lost picks of Adelaide Cows and Essendon Injectors, the extra activated mid first round pick of GWS and GCS, no more retirements, with our injury woes we go out in straight sets :-(

AFL lists this year were allowed to be 40, we ran with just 38 maybe to save $ to squeeze in Tippett?

We have three retirements so far, Bolton, Mattner, Morton, list now 35.

ND we have picks 14, 30, 48, mid 60s, somewhere in the mid/late 70s

One of those late ones will be used for Lloyd Perris who due to his high ranking won't be a rookie, list now 36, another late one to upgrade Rampe, list now 37.

We'd use picks 14, 30 & 48 you would think, list now 40.

Fairly clear cut eh? Unless Mumford gets traded to GWS, more retirements etc. But at least that are the numbers as they stand.

Soryy to spoil your fun on this thread but I can't see room to trade a player in and you really need a hole in your senior side to attract a player and I can't see that hole once the injured return in 2014.

This is of course assuming we don't delist anyone.

[wolftone57]

Here's the Free Agents List.....
Franklin, Thomas, Cooney head latest free agent list - AFL.com.au

Anyone here take your fancy?

How about Dale Morris from the dogs for the KPD and Eddie Betts as the crumbing forward?

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Ah but us good shoppers know you plan ahead Scott or you end up with stuff you never wanted!

As far as I know Cooney made a statement that he wants to be a one club player about a week ago. By the way at this time I don't think we need any other teams leavings. We need to go to the draft and get ourselves the players we need. If there are a few players we have to swap for better draft picks then we need to do that. There are some in the Twos on the senior list who are probably shaky at the moment too. Contract in brackets:Tony Armstrong (2014), Alex Brown (2013), Matthew Dick (2014) and Jordan Lockyer (2013) are all a bit shaky at this time. Alex Brown has been pretty good in the Twos but hasn't really looked like taking that extra step. He has been passed by rookies like Xav Richards, Dane Rampe, Jake Lloyd and Shane Biggs. Lockyer has failed to make much impact in his second year, though his last couple of games have been good it may all be too late. Dick is contracted for one more year but so far has not impressed to the stage I could say he will push for selection next year. Tony has been a bit disappointing from the point of view there were positions for the taking and he didn't take that extra step.

[DA_Swan]

Soryy to spoil your fun on this thread but I can't see room to trade a player in and you really need a hole in your senior side to attract a player and I can't see that hole once the injured return in 2014.[/QUOTE]

I gather you are assuming that White will re sign and Lamb will re sign besides potential loss of Mumford - i would hope we would use picks for a good player as we are young enough after you take out the retirements for this year and next and we lose a lot of experience this year and next - defender a must especially with AJ's injury

[wolftone57]

Leroy Jetta would really throw the cat among the pigeons!

I get the feeling that young Leroy is not a happy chapy at Essendon. So yes he might just be looking for a new club next year and of course there could be others after the way the players have been treated. That club had a total disregard for the welfare of their players. Wouldn't mind getting hold of Carlisle too.

[Untamed Snark]

Could someone clarify for me what happens if someone on a contract retires?
Say a player has a year left on his contract but due to injury wants to retire this season, are the Swans obliged to keep paying him for the remainder of the contract? And what about if someone has time left on their contact but are traded? Or delisted? (Can you delist someone who still has time on their contract?)

[wolftone57]

What is with the 'we need a key position defender'?? AJ, Rampe, Richards and Grundy are plenty for the next couple of years. Throw Reid in there as well.

What we need are fast midfielders. Parker, Bird, Kennedy, Hanners, ROK are all big bodied and not quick. Aside from Rohan and Jetta we have @@@@ all speed.

For a start Rampe & AJ are not KPP they are mid size defenders. We need some good KPP to take over from Reg (27) and Teddy (30). We have some speed in the reserves in the form of BJ and Lloydy also Biggs is not slow. We drafted Dick because of his speed as a defender and funnily enough Marsh, for a guy Joey's size, is quite quick, Harry is blistering ad getting better all the time. But of that group probably Dick & Harry (don't know what happened to Tom, LOL) have the most speed but not convinced by Dick at this stage. We could do with more speed and we need to get it in the draft. but a Leroy Jetta or Dale Thomas or both would not go astray. But in saying that I think Thomas will be at Giants next year.

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Could someone clarify for me what happens if someone on a contract retires?
Say a player has a year left on his contract but due to injury wants to retire this season, are the Swans obliged to keep paying him for the remainder of the contract? And what about if someone has time left on their contact but are traded? Or delisted? (Can you delist someone who still has time on their contract?)

A team can delist a player who still has time on their contract but they have to pay out the contract and it is still considered part of your salary cap. There have been a examples of players being delisted only to be picked up by another club and the previous club still paying them. Probably not s good idea. Retirements are different and if a player retires before his contract matures he can forego the payment of their contractual obligations and in some circumstances the club may ask for compensation. We had that situation with Daniel Bradshaw when he retired due to injury. The extra year on his contract was voided due to the special circumstances I believe and not considered part of the salary cap.

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Didn't Eddie Betts want $600k p.a. from Carlton?

Yes he did and guess what they said, I think it had the initials FO. Betts is 26 and will be 27 in November. Do we need a player in who is approaching his twilight? We could get Didak as he is going to be delisted and will be cheap but do we really want to. BJ is really good at roving the packs and getting the ball off hands, I would stick with him and develop him and Lambie into fearsome small to medium forwards. Add rooster to that equation and we have a pretty dangerous group. I think the problem at the moment is the Tippett factor, we are overusing him and playing him one out on several opponents.

[Ludwig]

For a start Rampe & AJ are not KPP they are mid size defenders.

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AJ is 193 cm and will be heavier than Ted in a year or 2, so I would count him as a KPP.

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If we wanted to create another spot on our list, could we delist Tommy Walsh and resign him as an Irish International, which I believe may be separate from other list size calculations?

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OK guys, here's the probable metrics for us in this years Trade/Draft period, a few assumptions are made, the lost picks of Adelaide Cows and Essendon Injectors, the extra activated mid first round pick of GWS and GCS, no more retirements, with our injury woes we go out in straight sets :-(

AFL lists this year were allowed to be 40, we ran with just 38 maybe to save $ to squeeze in Tippett?

We have three retirements so far, Bolton, Mattner, Morton, list now 35.

ND we have picks 14, 30, 48, mid 60s, somewhere in the mid/late 70s

One of those late ones will be used for Lloyd Perris who due to his high ranking won't be a rookie, list now 36, another late one to upgrade Rampe, list now 37.

We'd use picks 14, 30 & 48 you would think, list now 40.

Fairly clear cut eh? Unless Mumford gets traded to GWS, more retirements etc. But at least that are the numbers as they stand.

Soryy to spoil your fun on this thread but I can't see room to trade a player in and you really need a hole in your senior side to attract a player and I can't see that hole once the injured return in 2014.

The list size, I believe, is a total of Senior and Rookie of 44, with the senior list between 38 and 40 and the the rookie list 4-6. I think we started the year with a full contingent of 6 Rookie A List players, but not certain.

So we actually have 3 open spots at this point. Elevating Rampe doesn't change the total. Perris reduces our active picks to 2. So we now have picks (around) 14 and 30 as effective live picks. I'm not sure if we can expect to get anyone better at pick 48 than what we already have on our list. Would you trade anyone on our list for a pick 48? I am not sure about Lockyer, Armstrong or Brown, but would prefer to give each another year rather than exercise a pick 48.

[crackedactor]

Alex brown

As far as I know Cooney made a statement that he wants to be a one club player about a week ago. By the way at this time I don't think we need any other teams leavings. We need to go to the draft and get ourselves the players we need. If there are a few players we have to swap for better draft picks then we need to do that. There are some in the Twos on the senior list who are probably shaky at the moment too. Contract in brackets:Tony Armstrong (2014), Alex Brown (2013), Matthew Dick (2014) and Jordan Lockyer (2013) are all a bit shaky at this time. Alex Brown has been pretty good in the Twos but hasn't really looked like taking that extra step. He has been passed by rookies like Xav Richards, Dane Rampe, Jake Lloyd and Shane Biggs. Lockyer has failed to make much impact in his second year, though his last couple of games have been good it may all be too late. Dick is contracted for one more year but so far has not impressed to the stage I could say he will push for selection next year. Tony has been a bit disappointing from the point of view there were positions for the taking and he didn't take that extra step.

I think you are being a bit harsh on Alex Brown. He does show potential , but I know his form of late is not great. But when I look at him I also think he is just a schoolboy trying to play with men. He desperately needs a couple of solid years in the gym, especially playing in the backline, where there is more body to body contact. Alas Teddy Richards example!