Essendon affair

[Ludwig]

The only point where I differ is No. 2. It still seems to me that a footballer has the right to say to ASADA, "I'm not a biochemist and I'm certainly no expert on drugs, so I checked with the club doctor and got the OK." At that point he's done his due diligence and in my view the matter should then be taken up with the doctor, the coaches etc.

There are certainly mitigating circumstances when the coach and doctor say everything is WADA approved, but the players know that they are ultimately responsible for what goes into their bodies. Some of the particulars, like the program involving perhaps thousands of injections, going off-site to receive injections and the secrecy of the program should raise a few eyebrows, and perhaps it did, since not every player was on the program. This case should set the bar higher for what is due diligence for players if confronted with a similar situation.

The AFL has to comply with the WADA code if it wants to receive government subsidies. So if it takes the money, it has to agree to a sometimes harsh and strict code. But it is understandable that the WADA code is so strict, since most drug takers in sport get away with it. Keeping drugs out of sport is a very difficult task.

My understanding is that thymosin Beta 4 is not detectable with drug tests at the time and may still not be tested for, so no one will test positive and therefore only a circumstantial case can be pursued. And this makes it all that much more difficult to enforce a drug code.

[goswannies]

I believe that like so many great people in life that Hird fell in with the wrong people. The situation reminds of a high achieving teenager who meets a new friend, who is a bad influence and ends up heavily dependent on recreational drugs.

Hird trusted Dank. He is an experienced sports Doctor. Doctors are the most trusted people in society. Why would you not have trusted Dank at the time? The results of the players were also impressive, which encouraged Hird to keep things going.

You wouldn't trust Mr Dank because he is, in fact, not a doctor. Never was. Never will be. He has no sports doctoral qualification (either medically or philosophically). A quick fact check - or even paying any vague attention to the media over the last two years, would tell you he is a biochemist or sports scientist (depending on which articles you read - or perhaps didn't, in your case)... with questionable qualifications at that. What is currently understood about Mr Dank's qualifications are:

- he's got a physiology or pharmacology degree (they don't even seem to know this for sure)

- he claims to have a degree in biochemistry from the Queensland University of Technology,

- Me Dank was a PhD candidate (but it was suspended last year) at the University of Sydney for a thesis on antioxidants. FYI this is the wrong sort of doctor for administering drugs!

- it is believed Dank undertook a Masters degree in sports science at the University of NSW in the mid 1990s, but it is unclear whether he graduated. UniNSW, in fact, have no record of him graduating

Defending James Hird based on a one off encounter (when you would expect him to be on good behaviour) is one thing, but at least have accurate facts in your defence please.

A rogue "scientist" is not one of the most trusted people in society.

[Ludwig]

I had the opportunity to meet Hird and Tania at a corporate function years ago.

I believe that like so many great people in life that Hird fell in with the wrong people.

James and Tania must have been captivated by the depth of your football knowledge. It must have been difficult to drag themselves away from you.

Unfortunately, like Hirdy, you seem to have have fallen in with the wrong people, like the RWO gang, who are too dumb to appreciate the kind of innovative thinking that could take the Swans to another premiership, whatever it takes.

[barry]

I dont feel sorry for the players at all. They took injected drugs. They were , quite rightly, suspects.

Unless ASADA appeal, the only closure will be when the 34 players and hird retire.

What changes have the AFL made such that prosecution is easier next time ?. Nothing. What has the government done to give ASADA the powers it needs to go after non detectable drugs?. Nothing.

If anything, their are calls to water down ASADAs power. The drug cheats have won.

[Mel_C]

My heart went out to him when he was booed at ANZ. All people on Red and White have friends and family members who have fallen in with the wrong crowd with adverse consequences. I felt for him at a human level.

Sorry but I have no sympathy for Hird. He took no responsibility and he made the situation all about him.

He took the AFL and ASADA to court not because of essendon's "innocence" but because the investigation was supposedly unlawful.

What gets me is that if you were running a legitimate supplements program wouldn't you want to know what each player was given and how much so that you could determine what worked and what didn't??

I have no issue with the swans supporters booing him. Just wait and see what happens this week against the hawks!

[Conor_Dillon]

Sorry but I have no sympathy for Hird. He took no responsibility and he made the situation all about him.

He took the AFL and ASADA to court not because of essendon's "innocence" but because the investigation was supposedly unlawful.

What gets me is that if you were running a legitimate supplements program wouldn't you want to know what each player was given and how much so that you could determine what worked and what didn't??

I have no issue with the swans supporters booing him. Just wait and see what happens this week against the hawks!

Agree whole heartedly...the way he handled himself throughout the entire ordeal was abhorrent, I would have been incredibly embarassed to call myself an Essendon supporter. For what it's worth, Paul Little was equally as bad.

[barry]

Move discussion to a board no one reads = kill discussion .

[Big Al]

Agree whole heartedly...the way he handled himself throughout the entire ordeal was abhorrent, I would have been incredibly embarassed to call myself an Essendon supporter. For what it's worth, Paul Little was equally as bad.

If a manager at my work over saw a program that brought ridicule and embarrassment to my employer he'd be out the door quicker than an Eddie Maguire sprint to to a microphone to denounce the Swans.

In the AFL you get a 12 month holiday in France and you keep your job.

This should be a "Seems Legit" Meme.

[unconfuseme]

The ones who should really be crucified over this were losers anyway ... Julia and her dog - YES YOU JASON CLARE!

In their desperate bid to deflect attention from their dysfunctional government, they only managed to derail ASADA's investigations.

Absolutely pathetic, shameful and Un-Australian.

We all know the answers to this sordid affair ... when it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it's a f&$3#ng duck folks!

[AnnieH]

I had the opportunity to meet Hird and Tania at a corporate function years ago. He was terrific company and was interested in the people around him that he was speaking with. Tania was equally delightful. He was not arrogant at all.

I believe that like so many great people in life that Hird fell in with the wrong people. The situation reminds of a high achieving teenager who meets a new friend, who is a bad influence and ends up heavily dependent on recreational drugs.

Hird trusted Dank. He is an experienced sports Doctor. Doctors are the most trusted people in society. Why would you not have trusted Dank at the time? The results of the players were also impressive, which encouraged Hird to keep things going.

My heart went out to him when he was booed at ANZ. All people on Red and White have friends and family members who have fallen in with the wrong crowd with adverse consequences. I felt for him at a human level.

La la land must be a nice place to live.
Are the houses there expensive?

Two facts:

Dank is NOT a doctor; and Hird is a turd.

He got booed because he allowed YOUNG MEN in his care to be injected with god knows what.
I can't wait till these boys grow a third boob... just so you can see that this whole exercise was wrong to begin with.
I'm peeling the potatoes to make the fries to eat with your words.

[Matt80]

La la land must be a nice place to live.
Are the houses there expensive?

Two facts:

Dank is NOT a doctor; and Hird is a turd.

He got booed because he allowed YOUNG MEN in his care to be injected with god knows what.
I can't wait till these boys grow a third boob... just so you can see that this whole exercise was wrong to begin with.
I'm peeling the potatoes to make the fries to eat with your words.

Your a Swans cheer squad member and I'm a Swans member.

We have a common interest that we are both passionate about. Can you try to be a little more positive towards me? We are on the same team!

[Big Al]

Your a Swans cheer squad member and I'm a Swans member.

We have a common interest that we are both passionate about. Can you try to be a little more positive towards me? We are on the same team!

Then stop writing bull@@@@.

Hird was in charge of a programme that brought shame and ridicule on his employers and endangered the health of the people he was in charge of. No where else in society would you see someone keep their jobs in those circumstances.

BTW: Annie is actually the Matriarch of the Brewongle glitterati. I assume the banner thing in Adelaide was Annie storming the ground with security too scared to stop her.

[Matt80]

Good to know. I sit in the Brewongle as well.

[AnnieH]

Your a Swans cheer squad member and I'm a Swans member.

We have a common interest that we are both passionate about. Can you try to be a little more positive towards me? We are on the same team!

I'm a redback member; and a regular premium member.
I put more money where my mouth is.

[Big Al]

I'm a redback member; and a regular premium member.
I put more money where my mouth is.

Not to mention a fair bit of scotch on game day. [emoji3][emoji3]