2015 academy discussion thread (with some FS thrown in for good measure)

[Bleed Red Blood]

The big weakness in basing the draft points system on the relative average level of salary is that the top picks are by design taken by the struggling clubs (except where a trade is done for these picks) who by definition have weaker lists and are therefore able to pay these early picks much more than if they were selected by teams needing to cater for all their stars within the TPP. Thus the salaries awarded to top picks is often inflated and is a reflection of the room these clubs have within the cap, and the salary these clubs need to pay to ward off approaches from the more wealthy clubs rather than there standing within the total competition. Thus they are being highly rewarded because of their ability relative to their teammates, rather than their abilities relative to all the players in the AFL.. For example I would presume that Jack Watts is on better money at Melbourne than if he was at Hawthorn. Matthew Kreuzer would be on big money at Carlton, but few people would place him in the top 100 players in the AFL. Similarly Tom Scully at GWS. These are just examples of No. 1 picks. The argument would become even more compelling for picks 2 -5 where there have been some abject failures.

Just to add to this, Brendon Goddard (#1 2002) got a huge contract from the Dons as a free agent. At least one year of the contract was over a million.

This new system is so subjective. Which is of course to be expected when we're talking about drafting 18 year olds. No one would have said when they saw Brett Kirk play that he'd become a club champion. And didn't we hear for so long how (e.g) Jared Brennan, or Andrew Walker we're going to fulfill rheir potential any year now and be top players in the game. (I do think Walker has become a very good player, but no champion)

As we all know we finished runner up, had pick 18 and used it to match pick 2.
The Hawks traded pick 19 for a former pick 2, who - in a league first (/sarcasm) - decided to leave his club in Sydney to return home to Victoria.

What is getting more attention?
The initiative that is trying to do something to produce good footballers in non-afl heartlands, or that GWS' didn't get 'fair' compensation for their high draft pick? After all if someone rated O'Rourke number 2 in 2011, surely that means you can't get him for an end of first round pick??

If the AFL had made the academies in the 80s, or 90s, hell the naughties, maybe GWS wouldn't have had to pick-up nearly all their players from outside their state. We'll never know. Sadly with this new system and no guarantees for those in the academy we might never see the best that NSW and QLD could have.

[Ludwig]

Eddie, Eddie, Eddie. Why wouldn't you go after our coaches instead?!

What do you mean, I've been traded back to Collingwood?

[S.S. Bleeder]

Just to add to this, Brendon Goddard (#1 2002) got a huge contract from the Dons as a free agent. At least one year of the contract was over a million.

This new system is so subjective. Which is of course to be expected when we're talking about drafting 18 year olds. No one would have said when they saw Brett Kirk play that he'd become a club champion. And didn't we hear for so long how (e.g) Jared Brennan, or Andrew Walker we're going to fulfill rheir potential any year now and be top players in the game. (I do think Walker has become a very good player, but no champion)

As we all know we finished runner up, had pick 18 and used it to match pick 2.
The Hawks traded pick 19 for a former pick 2, who - in a league first (/sarcasm) - decided to leave his club in Sydney to return home to Victoria.

What is getting more attention?
The initiative that is trying to do something to produce good footballers in non-afl heartlands, or that GWS' didn't get 'fair' compensation for their high draft pick? After all if someone rated O'Rourke number 2 in 2011, surely that means you can't get him for an end of first round pick??

If the AFL had made the academies in the 80s, or 90s, hell the naughties, maybe GWS wouldn't have had to pick-up nearly all their players from outside their state. We'll never know. Sadly with this new system and no guarantees for those in the academy we might never see the best that NSW and QLD could have.

Well said BRB. I particularly like your reference to the poos and wees getting an original no.2 pick for pick 19 in comparison to us getting a no.2 pick for pick 18. Where is the outcry about the go home factor the NSW and Qld clubs have to face? The Victoria clubs just want to keep things the way they are; we recruit and develop the players and they take them as soon as their first contract is finished and we get diddly squat for them.

[tasmania60]

Can Eddie be trade to Asia ,Africa , or Israel, if it came to the crunch im willing to draft him to Alaska Sand Suckers !

[Nico]

No wonder whatshisname got the lemonade from Channel 9 headquarters. The man is just not a logical thinker. The article suggests he knows best and the rest of the world is dumb. By the way who told him from the commission that the Swans had discussions with them.

[jono2707]

Write Eddie off at your peril kids - damage will be done no matter how silly his rants....

[Dosser]

Write Eddie off at your peril kids - damage will be done no matter how silly his rants....

You are 100% correct. I am amazed at how many people in my office listen to Eddie each morning. Slowly but surely they start to take on board what he says - after all, if it is said enough, it must be true, right?

I actually suspect there is another agenda here. For generations Collingwood has been seen as the club to hate (my father told me the next best thing to seeing your team win is to see Collingwood lose), and that has been both an advantage and disadvantage to them. Eddie once said that he wants to turn Collingwood into the Manchester United of AFL - ie. international support, merchandising, etc - however, if you are the club that everyone loves to hate, then it becomes problematic.

The solution to this is to start to demonise another club, and what better way is there than to treat an interstate club as one that is a raider from the north? This club is a "powerhouse" that is manipulating the AFL rules (and even transgressing them) in order to "buy" premierships. They are allowed to pay their players more, will take your club's best players, have a hidden reservoir of junior talent that only they have access to, control several child slavery rings and probably support ISIL. As a Victorian, and regardless of the club that you support, we all need to band together to repel the invader so that the competition becomes "fair" once more and we can return to the status quo that has served us so well in the past.

What we are watching is a process of emotional transfer from Collingwood to the Swans, and it is being done brilliantly. As I said, you say it often enough and it becomes true. I suspect that, for the next generation, it is possible that the club that everyone loves to hate will go from Collingwood to Sydney and Eddie will have achieved his goal. As much as we like to say so, he is not an idiot or a fool, and I believe that he has a long term goal that is slowly being realised.

Beware the fat controller because while he is both of those things, he is also a very smart man.

[andy0414]

If the Swans keep picking players from the Academy and accumulating points they get shut out of the draft, but what is stopping them from just keep picking from the Academy and accumulating more and more points each year. It would be a bit like what Roos offered to do a few years ago.

[Dosser]

Because if you dont have the points you cant even pick from the academy.

[andy0414]

Because if you dont have the points you cant even pick from the academy.

Yeah I guess they thought of that one.

[Meg]

Some agitation from the Crows about what the proposed draft bidding system might mean for father/son picks.

Michelangelo Rucci: AFL’s father-son review creates more problems than it solves

[dimelb]

The Crows and Port have every right to be cranky about the AFL's latest brainchild - or should that be brainfart? Here's what a SA supporter wrote on Footy Almanac:

Father-Son has always been a Victorian club scam. Just need to wait for the second decent Crows prospect so they can change the rules again. It?s teeth grindingly annoying to watch South Australian sons of South Australians go to Vic clubs under father son.

[Primmy]

Very very good point dimelb.

And here I am thinking that perhaps Eddie was developing early onset dementia. Maybe he just has a lot of nasty agendas.

[Ludwig]

The main reason for including the FS in with the academy bidding is that it clearly is targeting the Swans circumstances this year. They probably will reverse it the next time Collingwood has a top notch FS selection. If the FS rule stands as is and the proposed academy bidding system is introduced, then the Swans could use their first 4 draft picks to get Mills, but Dunkley would still come to them with their next available pick, which might be something like 86, an outcome the Swnas would be most happy with. So the only way to get the Swans to cough up next year's picks as well is to put the 2 systems together.

Even if the FS bidding is separated by the academy system, I wouldn't be surprised to have special 'Swans' rule that makes us pay extra to get both Mills and Dunkley.

Most Victorian club administrators can remain sounding reasonable about this, since they have Mad Dog McGuire barking like a rabid hound and making enough noise for them all.

Mad Dog Eddie.jpg

[EskisLeftBoot]

The main reason for including the FS in with the academy bidding is that it clearly is targeting the Swans circumstances this year. They probably will reverse it the next time Collingwood has a top notch FS selection.

I would argue we already saw this happen. Note that originally it was proposed that LAST year they would change the system, when Isaac was already being touted as a potential top 3 pick. But because Darcy Moore was in the process with Collingwood, surprise, surprise, we don't get the change till THIS year.

I would love to know what some of the other big clubs are thinking though... surely Richmond, Geelong, Carlton, Hawthorn and Essendon have as much or more to lose out of any FS tinkering. And they do have the ability to shut Eddie up if they want to.

To your point Ludwig, it may well be a one-year-wonder system, that magically disappears the moment any other club other than ours looks to be impacted...