Scoreboard looks sick for Swans

[Xie Shan]

This is the best analysis I have read about the Swans in quite a while, by Rohan Connolly in The Age. The numbers speak for themselves.

* Over the past month, Sydney ranks only 12th in total points scored.

* The Swans are ranked just 12th in creating scores from turnovers.

* The Swans are ranked 17th in scoring goals from forward entries compared to their opposition.

* Luke Parker is third on our goal-kicking list with just 15 goals for the season.

Sydney's 89-point smashing at the hands of nemesis Hawthorn wasn't just a wake-up call, but a bucket of cold water and a few slaps around the cheeks to go on with.

Source: Scoreboard looks sick for Sydney Swans

[Matt79]

We have two big main tall forwards- Buddy and Tippett and thus often we kick long hoping for them to mark it. Our issue with this plan is that the ball is going to come to ground more often than not, however, we have no small/med forward in the Bruest / Ballantyne ilk to crumb and apply pressure. Thus we get killed on the rebound out of defence by highly efficient and skilled sides like Hawthorn. Imagine what a Rioli would do in our forward line...

[jetts32]

We could've had Rioli aswell, but that would've hurt us because we wouldn't of got Veszpremi...

[707]

Absolutely spot on. To win or break even on the stats just shows that it's disposal efficiency and game plan that are the problem. Or disposal efficiency not allowing the game plan to work.

don't make 15 goals difference but having Rohan and Heeney in the forward line makes it a whole lot more potent and stops some of the easy rebound scoring occurring.

This season may be shot and the recruiting ban will really hurt us this year so we may not be a contender next year either. Some massive list calls to be made this year. The VFL has effectively killed us in the window before the GWS juggernaught really gets rolling. Not happy!

[i'm-uninformed2]

The downturn in big Mike's body/form has hurt us badly too, as I think Tippett can be a weapon up forward clunking marks, and playing no more than support ruck - but instead, he's been stuffed into the centre as a battering ram.

And yes, as someone said earlier, Rohan and Heeney running round with pace, tackles and a bit of flair thrown in makes for a very different forward line

[dimelb]

The combined effects of injuries and the AFL's interference are problems at present, the latter continuing until next year. I hope the club makes some approach to the Commission to underline the bleeding obvious.

But the biggest problems are of our own making, one way or another. I am prepared to back Horse for now and I think he has earned our trust, but I am not happy about the combined effect of what looks like a loss of spirit by the team and the coaches' (note the plural) failure to respond to the challenges set us by other teams. Just compare our effort this weekend with our earlier win over Hawthorn. We ran onto the field through a banner that said "We bleed red and white. We are the Bloods", and that's how we played. It was a ripper of a game, played with intensity by both sides.

We didn't lack intensity on Saturday, at least up to the final quarter when the game was altogether out of reach. We lacked variety and precision, and these failings will not be changed in a hurry. It took Hawthorn a season or two to develop the precise kicking that is now their trademark. Other clubs have followed their lead and are playing better football accordingly, Richmond perhaps the most notable, but see also the improvements in outfits like St Kilda and the Western Bulldogs. We don't seem to have learned anything from this and we have to expand our repertoire. The players can't play a full game with the level of intensity required by our approach, and I doubt that any team could match after match, week after week for a whole season.

I think the other main problem is our lack of positioning, the sense players develop to the point where they know where the support is and can pass or kick to the next link in the chain. We do it in patches and it looks spectacular when it comes off but more often we seem to run into a blind alley. I don't think this can be fixed quickly either, but we're dealing with experienced players who should be capable of working out where to be. Let's see if we can do this on a more regular basis.

In the meantime it wouldn't hurt for some of them to spend a bit more time with the kicking coach.

[Jimitron5000]

I would say the top three points in the original post all stem from poor disposal. We continually butcher the ball all over the ground and it makes it very difficult to score, and much easier for the opposition to score.

[mcs]

+1

In Horse we trust!

That thumping last night has been brewing for a few weeks now, I was actually not that surprised.

The idea we need a rebuild is crazy but I do believe we need to freshen up the list.

Mills and Dunks added to Heeney will freshen up the list quite a bit and you'd hope that Hewett will also come on...

In terms of this year I think we need our very top 22 fit to have any chance come September - Heeney, Rohan and McGlynn will add a bit more starch but I fear we are gone this year

People are putting a lot of faith in Mills and Dunkley. Mills looks a fine player in the making, and Dunkley has done well at junior level (But is it just he matured quicker than the rest) - both may make it, both may not. Dunkley may not even choose to come to the Swans anyway.

We do need to freshen the list, but will have little opportunity to freshen it where we need to due to the AFL and its shifting goalposts around trading.

I completely agree about this year - we need our best 22 fit and firing in September to have any hope. As Saturday showed, our depth is just not there, especially against the imposing depth the Hawks have got (helped by no one whimpering even a sound when they've consistently been able to pillage excellent players out of other clubs, whilst building more and more depth).

[mcs]

I think the other main problem is our lack of positioning, the sense players develop to the point where they know where the support is and can pass or kick to the next link in the chain. We do it in patches and it looks spectacular when it comes off but more often we seem to run into a blind alley. I don't think this can be fixed quickly either, but we're dealing with experienced players who should be capable of working out where to be. Let's see if we can do this on a more regular basis.

The last month has shown this positioning issue to be an ongoing problem, shown up time and time again. It was every bit as bad against Brisbane the week before as it was against the Hawks - who are undoubtedly the masters of always having players in the right place and the right time.

Our structures, especially around stoppages are an issue too - how often were there multiple Hawks players sitting out the back, with no one in cooee of them. We also spend far too much time worried about the man, rather than the ball as well.

[mcs]

- - - Updated - - -

I would say the top three points in the original post all stem from poor disposal. We continually butcher the ball all over the ground and it makes it very difficult to score, and much easier for the opposition to score.

Quality disposal skills have never been our way, but this year it really does seem to have taken a turn for the worst.

Perfect example was the beginning of the Lions game last week. Our first 5 entries into the forward 50 were absolutely abysmal, pretty much all caused by sub-standard kicking skills.

The hawks showed on Saturday night, time and time again, what high quality skills mean for a team.... i.e. you don't actually need much ball to kick a lot of goals. Even when we had momentum, it was stung out of us by just a handful of entries by the Hawks, who used their skills to rip us a new one.

[mcs]

We have two big main tall forwards- Buddy and Tippett and thus often we kick long hoping for them to mark it. Our issue with this plan is that the ball is going to come to ground more often than not, however, we have no small/med forward in the Bruest / Ballantyne ilk to crumb and apply pressure. Thus we get killed on the rebound out of defence by highly efficient and skilled sides like Hawthorn. Imagine what a Rioli would do in our forward line...

I find it hard to comprehend how poorly we seem to (or it appears anyway) to have thought through the strategy of the twin big power forwards - in particular around the need for smaller, crumbing forwards. I'm guessing the thoughts were 'the midfielders can do it' and that was just about it - rather than actually identifying that we need to fill the smaller forward role as well. Hopefully the return of Heeney can help paper over the cracks in that respect somewhat, but its asking a lot of a very talented, but still very young and inexperienced player.

For most of this year our forward line has been in disarray. We have two forwards that can kick big bags, but no idea of how to best play to their strengths, and seemingly little ability to actually provide high quality delivery into the forward line.

[dimelb]

The combined effects of injuries and the AFL's interference are problems at present, the latter continuing until next year. I hope the club makes some approach to the Commission to underline the bleeding obvious.

But the biggest problems are of our own making, one way or another. I am prepared to back Horse for now and I think he has earned our trust, but I am not happy about the combined effect of what looks like a loss of spirit by the team and the coaches' (note the plural) failure to respond to the challenges set us by other teams. Just compare our effort this weekend with our earlier win over Hawthorn. We ran onto the field through a banner that said "We bleed red and white. We are the Bloods", and that's how we played. It was a ripper of a game, played with intensity by both sides.

We didn't lack intensity on Saturday, at least up to the final quarter when the game was altogether out of reach. We lacked variety and precision, and these failings will not be changed in a hurry. It took Hawthorn a season or two to develop the precise kicking that is now their trademark. Other clubs have followed their lead and are playing better football accordingly, Richmond perhaps the most notable, but see also the improvements in outfits like St Kilda and the Western Bulldogs. We don't seem to have learned anything from this and we have to expand our repertoire. The players can't play a full game with the level of intensity required by our approach, and I doubt that any team could match after match, week after week for a whole season.

I think the other main problem is our lack of positioning, the sense players develop to the point where they know where the support is and can pass or kick to the next link in the chain. We do it in patches and it looks spectacular when it comes off but more often we seem to run into a blind alley. I don't think this can be fixed quickly either, but we're dealing with experienced players who should be capable of working out where to be. Let's see if we can do this on a more regular basis.

In the meantime it wouldn't hurt for some of them to spend a bit more time with the kicking coach.

Sorry, I've put this in the wrong thread - should be in Scoreboard looks sick for Sydney Swans, along with response from mcs. Could some kind soul please move them?

[Xie Shan]

For me the article highlighted that we are playing a poor brand of footy and have been for a while. Ignoring any issues to do with our recruiting and list management, we are playing a style of footy that doesn't produce enough goals. We nearly lost to Essendon in Round 1 because we couldn't score for three quarters! I still think we are a more than capable side, but we are not getting reward for effort at the moment. When you don't hit the scoreboard regularly enough it's not surprising to see heads drop after the opposition gets a couple of quick goals, which Hawthorn are so good at doing.

[mcs]

For me the article highlighted that we are playing a poor brand of footy and have been for a while. Ignoring any issues to do with our recruiting and list management, we are playing a style of footy that doesn't produce enough goals. We nearly lost to Essendon in Round 1 because we couldn't score for three quarters! I still think we are a more than capable side, but we are not getting reward for effort at the moment. When you don't hit the scoreboard regularly enough it's not surprising to see heads drop after the opposition gets a couple of quick goals, which Hawthorn are so good at doing.

Hard to argue with that - and it all comes back to our game plan, or lack thereof of one. Whereas in 2012 we had a game plan that everyone understood and everyone played to, this year, apart from 'bomb it and hope', we have nothing.

We have two of the best forwards in the game and yet we can kick a winning score to save ourselves at the moment.

[barry]

We should tank and get mills and dunkley cheap. Hawthorn are unbeatable this year but will be too old next year. 2016 giants won't quite be a force. Let's aim for 2016!