2020 NEAFL discussion thread

[MattW]

In unexpected news, the NEAFL to merge with the VFL for 2021. It's an interesting move given the current climate and the move to cut costs. There are currently 9 clubs in the NEAFL and 15 in the VFL so I'm not sure how a 24 team league is going to work.

Breaking: NEAFL to merge with VFL in 2021, with its nine clubs invited to join the state league. More at Leader Local Footy.

— Paul Amy (@PaulAmy375) August 24, 2020

Great news for us, though.

[707]

9+15=24 so 23 game season!

Stunned at this news, travel costs will be big at a time when there's no money, very strange decision. And Covid is far from over so maybe no second tier next year anyway!

[liz]

I think it's a baffling move, and a terrible one for us. It would be baffling even in normal circumstances, but even more so when the competition is looking to trim costs, not add them.

At the moment we effectively have a free source of top-up players. (I don't know if the underage academy players get a match payment for NEAFL games, but if they do, I imagine it's a pittance.) While the U18 (soon to be U19) championships are on, the very bottom aged academy players get a run. Some of these guys are barely 16 years old. It fills a hole in the NEAFL system, even though many of these academy players struggle somewhat against the mature bodies of the NEAFL competition. But a lot of the NEAFL sides are also pretty young so it just about works.

The VFL has a good number of players running around who are close to AFL standard. Each year some will get drafted and go on to make an immediate impact at AFL level. Even those who don't quite have what it takes to make it at the next level are still typically older, bigger and stronger. Most of the teams the Swans have put out in the NEAFL competition would get completely wiped away by an average VFL side. Playing in a team getting trounced does close to nothing for our own young listed players, and will do even less for the academy players, were they still to be used.

That suggests we're going to have to find some mature top up players from somewhere. I can't think where. The Sydney Uni team has started to attract a few from the other state leagues or recent AFL players but they are pretty few and far between. Regardless of how or where we find them, it will cost money.

And that's before you factor in the additional travel and infrastructure costs.

I don't believe there is compelling evidence that our draftees' development has been slowed by playing NEAFL rather than VFL.

[SeanM]

I assume it would be a conference system. Where instead of playing every side once, you end up playing more games against geographically closer teams.

I think it would be good long term if teams like Sydney Uni can afford a side. Academy players that miss out can compete against VFL sides which is seen as more impressive.

[SeanM]

The VFL has a good number of players running around who are close to AFL standard. Each year some will get drafted and go on to make an immediate impact at AFL level. Even those who don't quite have what it takes to make it at the next level are still typically older, bigger and stronger. Most of the teams the Swans have put out in the NEAFL competition would get completely wiped away by an average VFL side. Playing in a team getting trounced does close to nothing for our own young listed players, and will do even less for the academy players, were they still to be used.

If that is the case.

It would be good to loosen up the rules with ex academy players to be able to keep them around for a few more years to form a core of the reserve side.

Players like Thorne, Gaden, Parks and Barling might have enjoyed competing against VFL sides in Swans colours. So even if they don't get drafted they still get to play for the Swans at a competitive level.

[Meg]

I note that on AFL site it says:

‘The AFL clubs in Queensland, New South Wales and Victoria will be able to either field a standalone team, align with an existing second-tier club or spread their AFL-listed players across multiple second-tier clubs.’

NEAFL joins forces with VFL to form eastern seaboard comp


Possibly the Swans & GWS will amalgamate for this comp thereby eliminating need for top-up players? This was mooted some months ago.

[MattW]

I think it's a baffling move, and a terrible one for us. It would be baffling even in normal circumstances, but even more so when the competition is looking to trim costs, not add them.

At the moment we effectively have a free source of top-up players. (I don't know if the underage academy players get a match payment for NEAFL games, but if they do, I imagine it's a pittance.) While the U18 (soon to be U19) championships are on, the very bottom aged academy players get a run. Some of these guys are barely 16 years old. It fills a hole in the NEAFL system, even though many of these academy players struggle somewhat against the mature bodies of the NEAFL competition. But a lot of the NEAFL sides are also pretty young so it just about works.

The VFL has a good number of players running around who are close to AFL standard. Each year some will get drafted and go on to make an immediate impact at AFL level. Even those who don't quite have what it takes to make it at the next level are still typically older, bigger and stronger. Most of the teams the Swans have put out in the NEAFL competition would get completely wiped away by an average VFL side. Playing in a team getting trounced does close to nothing for our own young listed players, and will do even less for the academy players, were they still to be used.

That suggests we're going to have to find some mature top up players from somewhere. I can't think where. The Sydney Uni team has started to attract a few from the other state leagues or recent AFL players but they are pretty few and far between. Regardless of how or where we find them, it will cost money.

And that's before you factor in the additional travel and infrastructure costs.

I don't believe there is compelling evidence that our draftees' development has been slowed by playing NEAFL rather than VFL.

While the detail will obviously be important, it's interesting in that it seems to be quite different to the amalgamated development league Harley flagged in May: "AFL club chiefs back push for new 14-team reserves competition" AFL club chiefs back push for new 14-team reserves competition.

Still, we'll see what Harley says now but I'll be surprised if he's against it, given he appears to have been part of working on it.

I think the reason it's good for us is flagged in your post: the competition will be better. As Harley said in that May article: “The concept is to develop a culture of winning and competing".

The question of how we'd fill out our team is an interesting one, but I don't think the answer is necessarily bad for us or one we're unhappy with.

[MattW]

Here's Pridham from a few months ago, in favour of a national reserves competition where 'everyone has an equal opportunity', and against merging with GWS reserves to participate: "AFL 2020: Sydney Swans chairman Andrew Pridham says play on, reverses opposition to AFL playing in coronavirus crisis" AFL 2020: Sydney Swans chairman Andrew Pridham says play on, reverses opposition to AFL playing in coronavirus crisis.

[dejavoodoo44]

I note that on AFL site it says:

‘The AFL clubs in Queensland, New South Wales and Victoria will be able to either field a standalone team, align with an existing second-tier club or spread their AFL-listed players across multiple second-tier clubs.’

NEAFL joins forces with VFL to form eastern seaboard comp


Possibly the Swans & GWS will amalgamate for this comp thereby eliminating need for top-up players? This was mooted some months ago.

My guess if there's mergers, it will probably be along the lines of; Southport Suns, Sydney University Swans, Canberra Giants, Williamstown Bulldogs, etc. Some might work in the short term, but I think that once the game gets back to a healthier financial state, then there will be a certain amount of lobbying, for the arranged marriages to be annulled.

[lwjoyner]

I am a vic swan. appears as if the afl want to stuff up northern clubs. Join a standalone vfl team or wither on the vine is their directive. Vic afl teams its ok. Should be no afl teams allowed in the vfl. Whats good for the gander is good for all.

[barracuda]

My guess if there's mergers, it will probably be along the lines of; Southport Suns, Sydney University Swans, Canberra Giants, Williamstown Bulldogs, etc. Some might work in the short term, but I think that once the game gets back to a healthier financial state, then there will be a certain amount of lobbying, for the arranged marriages to be annulled.

I agree. I also think it is quite a good outcome. It enables the players in the non afl neafl teams, uni, canberra etc to play VFL. This is very good for NSW footy as it provides a pathway without a non drafted player needing to relocate to victoria or SA. Also if they cut the list sizes it provides a continued pathway for young players who are delisted as a result. For the Academy kids they would be unlikely to get any games under this scenario.

Overall the proposal could see a significant uplift in standard.

[Mr Magoo]

I agree. I also think it is quite a good outcome. It enables the players in the non afl neafl teams, uni, canberra etc to play VFL. This is very good for NSW footy as it provides a pathway without a non drafted player needing to relocate to victoria or SA. Also if they cut the list sizes it provides a continued pathway for young players who are delisted as a result. For the Academy kids they would be unlikely to get any games under this scenario.

Overall the proposal could see a significant uplift in standard.

Agree - the Academy boys will be estatic. Its actually a pretty sobering journey for most academy kids through the system - they can start with the academy at 12 or 13 , they spend a few years just training with the aacademy and getting to 16s when they finally pull on swans gear to play against GWS, they may be selected for NSW and then within a couple of years all but one or two are spat out to find their way either at a SANFL/ VFL club , another NEAFL club or back in Sydney leagues. Most would be more than eager to play in a Swans reserves team to continue their journey.

[rb4x]

I thinkk it will be a good outcome only if the Swans can afford a reserves team which is based in Sydney. If the amalgamation is an affiliation with say Port Melbourne we would be back to the bad old days. A combined Sydney and Uni team might work but only if under the one banner and management with the same coaching team but that would mean taking over the students. They might not be happy with that. Very much depends on how lists are formed and on budgets etc. with no details as yet disclosed.

[barracuda]

I thinkk it will be a good outcome only if the Swans can afford a reserves team which is based in Sydney. If the amalgamation is an affiliation with say Port Melbourne we would be back to the bad old days. A combined Sydney and Uni team might work but only if under the one banner and management with the same coaching team but that would mean taking over the students. They might not be happy with that. Very much depends on how lists are formed and on budgets etc. with no details as yet disclosed.

Good points. An amalgamation with a Melbourne team would be a disaster for Sydney footy. It would leave undrafted talent with no quality comp if they want to stay in Sydney. A merger with uni would see some tensions no doubt. If uni tipped in $ only to see their quality players treated like topups then they would not be happy. Having said that, with a list cut there may only be 4/5 swans players each week anyway.

[Markwebbos]

Wonder if this is the precursor to cutting list sizes In some way?