Scrap the Wizard Cup

[swansrock4eva]

Originally posted by swansrule100
It would stop teams getting easy draws like essendon and collingwood, who travel as much as an 80 year old in a nursing home.

Not exactly - at present there 10 victorian teams thus collingwood would play 24 maches down there regardless, but would also play another 6 matches interstate. On the other hand, an interstate team would play either 4 or 5 matches against the other interstate teams (and not counting Derbys - i.e. WC, Freo, Port and Adelaide play 4, Bris and Syd 5), 15 matches at home and the remainder in Victoria (and throw in the darbys for the relevant teams). Ultimately it even further disadvantages interstate teams in terms of sheer volume of travel, but this is somewhat tempered by the fact that every team plays each other twice, so there are no extra "freebie" wins against crappy sides in rd 16-22, and everyone will do at least 2 Perth trips.

But in terms of game time, 30 full rounds of AFL competition WITHOUT pre-season games would be disastrous for players coming back from injury over the PS, and for younger players, who either get thrown into meaningful matches with the experience of a pea. Hence, cut the number of teams to 14, you only have 26 rounds, and can leave a month to prepare before the season starts, much in similar manner to what we have now, but without the actual "competition."

[swansrule100]

i like that idea, though which two teams to cut??? if i had to cut two it would be the kangaroos and the bulldogs, or at least merge them with two other clubs.

The other soltution is 15 rounds.

I think the wizard cup is a waste of time.

I dont agree it would be a disaster to play 30 rounds for players comming back from injury and so forth, i feel there would need to be a solid reserves system in place for this transition and for young players to play at a close standard to afl. It would also mean more youngsters could play in the reserves comp, allowing teams to expose more rookies to some afl footy (by training with clubs and playing with senior players who are out of form or returining from injury or cant make the team currently)

[sharpie]

Well said SR4E.

As far as I see it, the issue isnt about how many rounds we play in the regular season. That is a separate issue to whether or not we scrap the Wiz cup.

As far as I see it, you have to have preseason matches regardless of the length of the regular season. And therefore, you may as well keep the Wiz cup as it gives more incentive to play competitively than one-off stand-alone games do. But it also allows for some teams to still use it entirely for trialling youngsters if they wish.

The 1st round or two weed out the teams who just want to trial youngsters. The final few rounds are then far more competitive between sides striving for victory, while the other teams get to continue their trials without the consequences attached to the wiz cup.

[swansrule100]

They arent separate issues because, the wizard cup takes up valuable time. I think playing everyone twice is more important than a warm up comp. I think it would work especially with a reserves comp in place.

But we will have to agree to disagree mate

[swansrock4eva]

Originally posted by swansrule100

I dont agree it would be a disaster to play 30 rounds for players comming back from injury and so forth, i feel there would need to be a solid reserves system in place for this transition and for young players to play at a close standard to afl. It would also mean more youngsters could play in the reserves comp, allowing teams to expose more rookies to some afl footy (by training with clubs and playing with senior players who are out of form or returining from injury or cant make the team currently)

The sheer length of our game makes 30 rounds + finals almost impossible, when you consider we have guys running the equivalent of half marathons on a weekly basis. Also, out of the "big four" footballs in Oz, Aussie Rules is by far the longest, with it taking at a bare minimum 2 hours to complete a game - this is 30 minutes more than soccer and 40 more than union or league.

Add to that, the amount of fitness and conditioning work that would need to be done for a season this length would be almost impossible. For a team that makes the grand final, they will have had 35 weeks of football (4 weeks of finals plus a bye in the middle somewhere, assuming the current system were just to be extended), plus 8 weeks off as per contractual obligations, and then usually another week at christmas, it leaves those teams with just 8 weeks to prepare for round one the next year, and at best, 12 weeks for those not in finals.

As I said, I would like to see a 14-team competition, with some sort of preseason warmup, but not necessarily an uneven competition like we have it now.

[sharpie]

Originally posted by swansrule100
They arent separate issues because, the wizard cup takes up valuable time. I think playing everyone twice is more important than a warm up comp. I think it would work especially with a reserves comp in place.

But we will have to agree to disagree mate

But it is a separate issue, because regardless of how many rounds there are in the regular season, you still have to have a preseason of some form or other.

Do you honestly believe you can scrap the Wizard Cup and have absolutely no preseason games whatsoever before the regular season starts?

[swansrule100]

i dont see the need for an official warm up comp.
Even if its just 4 extra rounds instead of the extra 8 needed for 30 id do it.

Maybe then thered be one week of pratice, but if every team starts without a practice comp its fair. Teams could still play intra club trials or matches against some vfl side or whatever if they wanted. I dont see why you need to practice for the real thing, they do know how to play. If only 8 teams played a wizard cup then they have an unfair advantage, but if every team just starts, they all start level.

Besides half the teams dont use it for youth, most of the teams wont risk injured players (you did say it helps bring them back) well players like crawford wont play til round 1 cos the wizard cup is a waste of time.

[sharpie]

Originally posted by swansrule100
i dont see the need for an official warm up comp.
Even if its just 4 extra rounds instead of the extra 8 needed for 30 id do it.

Maybe then thered be one week of pratice, but if every team starts without a practice comp its fair. Teams could still play intra club trials or matches against some vfl side or whatever if they wanted. I dont see why you need to practice for the real thing, they do know how to play. If only 8 teams played a wizard cup then they have an unfair advantage, but if every team just starts, they all start level.

Besides half the teams dont use it for youth, most of the teams wont risk injured players (you did say it helps bring them back) well players like crawford wont play til round 1 cos the wizard cup is a waste of time.

Every sport has warmup events before the real competition. There must be a reason for this. Perhaps the players actually NEED them.

[Mike_B]

Maybe they should go back to the round-robin wizard cup - 4 groups of 4, top of each plays in the semis?

[robbieando]

We will NEVER have a 30 Round season because that would add on over 2 months to the season, thus to keep the Grand Final on the last Saturday in September we would have to start the season in the middle of January. If we then were to have 2 preseason trial matches we would be starting in the first week of the new year, thus giving clubs less than 5 weeks for Pre Season training thanks to the AFLPA's 8 week brake after the season and 2 weeks off during the season.

Scraping the Wizard Cup might happen, but we still will have 4 weeks of trial matches, so why not keep the Wizard Cup.

[swansrock4eva]

Rob did you not read my post?

Obviously if the DID do a 30-round season, finals would no longer be in September, because playing in January is just too hard on the footballers due to the heat and the sun and aside from that, the logistical clashes with cricket would just be stupid.

[swansrule100]

Originally posted by sharpie
Every sport has warmup events before the real competition. There must be a reason for this. Perhaps the players actually NEED them.

not that many sports do, and some that do like nba or whatever take the game worldwide and use it for promotion.

I just think using the time for a longer and more even season is more important.

[sharpie]

Originally posted by swansrule100
not that many sports do

what sports dont?

Originally posted by swansrule100
some that do like nba or whatever take the game worldwide and use it for promotion.

but it still is a preseason, isnt it?

And during the afl preseason, games are held in places where otherwise people would not get afl games during the season, like newcastle, etc.

Originally posted by swansrule100 I just think using the time for a longer and more even season is more important. [/B]

but do you play any elite sports? So how would you know? I dont play elite sports either, but I reckon by the very fact that so many sports DO have a preseason that these elite athletes actually NEED one.

[robbieando]

Originally posted by swansrule100
not that many sports do.

As sharpie said which sports may these be???

The AFL does
The NRL does
The Super 12 does
The A-League/NSL does
The NBL does
The NBA does
The NHL does
The MLB does
The NFL does
Soccer Leagues thoughout Europe and the World do as well.

End of the day there is no major sport/league that doesn't have some kind of pre season series of matches and for the AFL not to and then extend the season is pure madness, regardless of how fair the fixture will become.

[swansrule100]

The NHL doesnt have one at the moment, doesnt even have a regular season.

I appreciate what your both saying, but i have my opinion regardless of how wrong you think it is, i think most players dog the pre season anyway and couldnt give a rats.

But anyway at the moment its there and not gonna change so its not important.


And i dont play elite sports just footy cricket badminton and tennis