Defensive midfielders

[Charlie]

Well, it seems we are particularly strong in this area at the moment. We have Ben Mathews, Jared Crouch and Brett Kirk all in the 22, plus Ben Fixter to return from injury, who are capable of being run-with players through the midfield or down back. Is there space for all 4 of these guys in the 22? I can't really think of a time in which they were all in the team over an extended period, as opposed to 2 or 3 matches here and there.

Will one of these players become trade bait? If you think yes, whom? It's a hard one. Fixy is probably the most fragile and thus also the one with the lowest value. Only us Swans fans know what he is capable of. The thought of trading Brett Kirk should not enter anybody's minds after the year he has had.

So... Benny Mathews or Crouchy? Neither are players I'd particularly want to lose, but neither are all that devastating in their play. I'm not giving credence to P46's dislike for these two... I think they are good players. But I'm not convinced we have space for all 4 of them.

Thoughts?

[BAM_BAM]

it couldn't be crouch. He's very under rated. We'd miss him greatly

[dawson]

Fixter may be no different to Paul Licuria or Simon Garlick or Clinton King that he is deemed to be surplus to requirements and then thrives at another club.

I'm not saying he will go but someone of those fringe guys such as Buchanan, Sundqvist, Ablett will go.

The thing is that to bring about a trade or get a higher draft pick, we may be forced to give away someone we would have otherwise kept.

Jason Mooney was a good trade for us as was Mark Orchard and Ryan Fitzgerald.

[robbieando]

The following will go

Warfe (Delisted)
McPherson (Delisted)
Seymour (Retired)
Cresswell (Retired)
Stevens (Trade)

[dawson]

Forgot to mention Troy Cook.

He is doing great things at Freo and that trade was a win-win for both clubs.

Hope he doesn't come back to bite us on Sunday.

I wouldn't mind that as much as it irked me that a muppet such as Jon Hutton kicked something like 8 goals against us.

Headgear and all!!!

[Charlie]

Originally posted by robbieando
The following will go

Warfe (Delisted)
McPherson (Delisted)
Seymour (Retired)
Cresswell (Retired)
Stevens (Trade)

Probably an accurate list, but it doesn't answer the question I posed, mate.

[aflconvert]

There's no way we can trade Brett Kirk now. Actually I dont want to lose any of the 4 you suggested Charlie . Give Fixter another year -I agree more with Dawson's idea that fringe guys such as Buchanan, Sundqvist, Ablett will go.

[Plugger46]

Benny Mathews ......

Wouldn't dream of getting rid of Kirk or Fixter, and Crouchy is probably better than I give him credit for, so there is your answer Charlie.

[Plugger46]

Originally posted by robbieando
The following will go

Warfe (Delisted)
McPherson (Delisted)
Seymour (Retired)
Cresswell (Retired)
Stevens (Trade)

That's what you want Robbie, not necessarily the way the club are thinking.

[robbieando]

Originally posted by Plugger46
That's what you want Robbie, not necessarily the way the club are thinking.

Why is that??? Cresswell has said he is retiring, Seymour might go the same way because of the amount of injuries he has had, his body might not be able to take it anymore.

Warfe and McPherson have no future at this club, because why the hell would we want 2 players of their age who can't hold down a senior spot??? Despite them being your lovechildren what use are they and who in their place should go???

Stevens is one of a group of young players who might be traded, Ablett and Buchanan are the others. But of the 3 only 1 needs to go space wise and Stevens might be the more valueable due to the fact most clubs lack talls and the draft isn't rich with talls this year.

Charlie to answer your question I wouldn't get rid of any of them, they all can play a major role in the squad.

[Roscoe]

Jaysus, P46, you are slowly coming around aren't you ?

First you admit that Leo is giving us drive off half back , and now you are starting to realise the benefit of Crouch !!!!!!!


But you still won't warm to Benny.

I suppose 2 out of 3 aint bad Meatloaf !!

[Sid]

Definitely not crouchy. Only crouchy can tag players like Steven Milne or Jeff Farmer. He is one of the fastest and his maneouvrability is great.

I reckon its between fixter and mathews.

[liz]

Fixter's shown he's able to play on the small forwards as well, and maybe even better, than Crouch. Crouch has got good leg speed once he gets going but his off-the-mark, explosive speed isn't fantastic and he's been shown up at times playing on small forwards. Fixter did the role pretty well at times last season. Crouch is better in the midfield, IMO.

On the question that started the thread, not sure why one has to go, unless of course they can be used as attractive trade bait (ie someone is willing to give us something we badly need in return for one of them). Couple of reasons:

a) just because they can play defensive midfield roles doesn't mean that's all they can play. Mathews often plays as a free man across half-back - the classic sweeper role - while Fixter even showed last year he can play effectively as a small forward. Crouch has stated that he'd love to play a more attacking midfield role if he gets the chance. Cresswell started off as pretty much a defensive midfielder and look what he's turned himself into.

b) injuries mean that you ideally want players on the fringe who are capable of coming in and playing a role at the highest level. After all, the reason we haven't seen them playing all together very much is largely because Fixter's missed this season.

I don't think any of them would be that valuable to trade because its one of the easiest positions for clubs to fill - even if we do have a handful who are particularly good at it. Would we get a quality tall in exchange for one of them? I doubt it. My philosophy on appropriate players for trade is whether another club perceives them to be of greater value than the Swans know they are to the them. If so, arguably they are tradeable whoever they are. If not, and they are in or around the best 22, why offload for the sake of it?

[Charlie]

Fair enough Lizz, but realistically, if there isn't enough roles in the side there... we're not going to be able to hold onto them for a rainy day, as they are going to want to go somewhere where they are getting games.

Even if we have Fixy up forward, Kirk in the middle, Crouch in the back pocket and Mathews as a sweeper... along with Schneider, Williams and Bolton, who are generally more attacking than the aforementioned quartet, we start to look very, very short.

[penga]

i was thinking the same thing recently (again ) charlie, our interchange bench just aint big enough for the three of them

heres my best 22 for next year:

b fixter ????? saddington
hb barry ????? bolton
c kennelly bolton maxfield
hf goodes hall davis
f oloughlin doyle schneider
fol ball williams kirk
int o'keefe fosdike mathews/crouch lrt/powell/james/sunny/mcveigh/dempster/thewlis/macleski

it would show great depth, but there is realistically about 2 spots in our 22 for the three of the crouch/mathews/fixter IMO fixter can add more attack, so then it comes down to mathews vs crouch where im torn... hmmm, i think mathews could seek the highest trade value, so id trade mathews if it came down to the choice of the one of three