Team Line Up

[Craig]

I knew everyone would go on about the Geelong game, it was only an example. Plenty of players have won games for us, I'm yet to see it with Fosdike.

All I was trying to say is that we are never going to win premerships with players like him. You talk about wingmen not having to take overhead marks, not kicking long. Look at Peter Matera and Schwass for example, both were neither superstars but they sure could play footy. Fosdike can't kick, can't mark, doesn't have the build (all admitted by people on this board), isn't very strong, doesn't get in and under so what can he do??? At least he's good at running...

[penga]

Re: Team Line Up

Originally posted by Craig
Ok I know it's been done heaps, but I thought that now we have had a few practice games under our belts, I will post the best team line up (IMO).

Nicks Hall Doyal
O'Louchlin Stevens Davis
O'Keefe Cresswell Maxfield
Crouch Saddington C Bolton
Barry Schauble Fixter

Ball Williams Goodes

Int: Kirk Kennelly Schneider J Bolton

I couldn't find a spot for Mathews, Seymour, Warfe or Fosdike as I don't think they will add much to the team.

i would prefer to have o'keefe at RFP and davis at LFP as they could lead into the pockets and hall straight up the ground. o'keefe and davis would then be both be on their preferred pocket to kick for goal... i would like to see ball and doyle rotated through chf and put stevens at half forward flank. stevens has been a smokey imo as i would never had put him in our best 22 at the end of last season but he has shown some real good form through the preseason that i couldnt leave him out now. id also really like to see a third man up tactic used more frequently ie ball or doyle could nullify the opposition ruckman and then have goodes come flying over the top and have him hit it to a player ahead of the pack... id also like to see maxfield in the middle rather than on the wing, as a captain he needs to be in the thick of it more than wing, he also is the player who can play there, his captaincy is not the only reason to put him in the middle. id prob put cressa on the bench push maxfield to the middle and kennelly to the wing with fosdike on the other wing, he has showed some real good signs imo of breaking the game open. so id leave schneider out of the team, we dont really have that more on option as far as our backline goes, unless we were to use stevens in the backline and use nicks at half forward flank, so my team looks like this:

davis hall okeefe
o'loughlin doyle nicks
fosdike goodes kennelly
c. bolton stevens crouch
fixter schauble saddington

ball williams maxfield

cresswell kirk barry j. bolton

id like to see powell replace barry as well

i think nicksy really needs to step up to the plate or he will be used as trade bait... ie id like to see LRT to eventually come into chb and push stevens to HFF. thewlis to replace kirk. we do have a bit more depth than thought, we recruited well last year, im not sure on mcveigh yet but i like thewlis, macleski and dempster. there is schneider as well... where are we going to get our FB from? pressure increases for all the senior players now!

[penga]

Originally posted by Craig
I knew everyone would go on about the Geelong game, it was only an example. Plenty of players have won games for us, I'm yet to see it with Fosdike.

All I was trying to say is that we are never going to win premerships with players like him. You talk about wingmen not having to take overhead marks, not kicking long. Look at Peter Matera and Schwass for example, both were neither superstars but they sure could play footy. Fosdike can't kick, can't mark, doesn't have the build (all admitted by people on this board), isn't very strong, doesn't get in and under so what can he do??? At least he's good at running...

i think he can kick, he will create some great run from hb, thats what he is good at... i obviously rae him a lot higher than u...

[Craig]

I agree with you about Nicks & LRT. I hope that both have big seasons.

Cresswell on the bench is a big call. He just gets so much of the ball that he's hard to leave out.

Our backline is short and that's going to be a bit of an issue. Scott Stevens at CHB could work or maybe Goodes. That's exactly where we need LRT to come along and the problem would be solved.

[penga]

Originally posted by Craig
I agree with you about Nicks & LRT. I hope that both have big seasons.

Cresswell on the bench is a big call. He just gets so much of the ball that he's hard to leave out.

Our backline is short and that's going to be a bit of an issue. Scott Stevens at CHB could work or maybe Goodes. That's exactly where we need LRT to come along and the problem would be solved.

i realise its a big call, but his legs are aging and i think he wouldnt suit being on the wing, maybe have goodes on the wing, cresswell in the centre and fosdike on the bench? i realise youll agree with the bench call

[Mike_B]

Re: Re: Team Line Up

Originally posted by penga
i would prefer to have o'keefe at RFP and davis at LFP as they could lead into the pockets and hall straight up the ground.<P> id also really like to see a third man up tactic used more frequently ie ball or doyle could nullify the opposition ruckman and then have goodes come flying over the top and have him hit it to a player ahead of the pack

Our crumbing of packs (or lack thereof), along with our skills that go MIA rather often are the two things that have frustrated me more than any other aspect of our play over the past few years.

IMHO its more important than having a 3rd man in for an aerial contest up forward is having at least one player in the forward pocket who will play front-and-square and crumb those balls that end up being spoiled/dropped in the marking contest. For me, if Davis and/or ROK can and more importantly will play that role, then I'm happy to see them in the forward pocket - both can take a mark and are decent kicks for goal. But if they won't crumb, put someone in there who will.

[penga]

we also have (potentially) james to come in at FB and then where will schauble go, back to chb then where with LRT, BP? saddington to hbf and c. bolton to wing? i do like the idea of this though ie having to decide who will cut the mustard...

[penga]

Re: Re: Re: Team Line Up

Originally posted by Mike_B
Our crumbing of packs (or lack thereof), along with our skills that go MIA rather often are the two things that have frustrated me more than any other aspect of our play over the past few years.

IMHO its more important than having a 3rd man in for an aerial contest up forward is having at least one player in the forward pocket who will play front-and-square and crumb those balls that end up being spoiled/dropped in the marking contest. For me, if Davis and/or ROK can and more importantly will play that role, then I'm happy to see them in the forward pocket - both can take a mark and are decent kicks for goal. But if they won't crumb, put someone in there who will.

thats y i put ND and ROK down there instead of doyle, if not these two then who? i do see what u mean though...

[Craig]

Someone like Buchanan could potentially be a good crumbing forward pocket. Though I think he needs a good year in the seconds first. O'Keeff would be ok in the FP but I think that his running and lovely kicking would work better up the ground.

[penga]

Originally posted by Craig
Someone like Buchanan could potentially be a good crumbing forward pocket. Though I think he needs a good year in the seconds first. O'Keeff would be ok in the FP but I think that his running and lovely kicking would work better up the ground.

imo buchanan will never make it, i think thewlis could be good at fp if the kick form the boundary line at the NSO game is anything to go by. but i like ROK as a forward, he showed some real good things against the roos

[NMWBloods]

Fosdike can't kick, can't mark, doesn't have the build (all admitted by people on this board), isn't very strong, doesn't get in and under so what can he do??? At least he's good at running...

I think Fosdike's basic skills are far better than most players on our team. His ability to use both sides of his body and deliver well can be excellent at times. His problems tends to be he loses focus or concentration, and delivers it poorly. At least that can be corrected with a bit more steadiness, which I believe will come as he develops and gains more confidence.

[NMWBloods]

Re: Re: Re: Team Line Up

Originally posted by Mike_B
Our crumbing of packs (or lack thereof), along with our skills that go MIA rather often are the two things that have frustrated me more than any other aspect of our play over the past few years.

IMHO its more important than having a 3rd man in for an aerial contest up forward is having at least one player in the forward pocket who will play front-and-square and crumb those balls that end up being spoiled/dropped in the marking contest. For me, if Davis and/or ROK can and more importantly will play that role, then I'm happy to see them in the forward pocket - both can take a mark and are decent kicks for goal. But if they won't crumb, put someone in there who will.

LOL - three men up, none down is a trademark of the Swans, whether Sydney or South Melbourne variety!

I agree that our crumbing has generally been poor. Part of it is half the time no one seems to have the nouse to wait under the pack. Part of it is also that many of our players don't seems to read the ball well and don't know quite where to go to crumb the ball well.

[Nico]

I wonder sometimes whether some people on this site have any football knowledge or insight into some of the subtleties of the game.

In particular the arguement on the relative abilities of Nick Fosdike.

Under the previous coach both Fosdike and Bolton got very lttle game time - regularly on and off the bench. Does anyone have the stats on these players in the past 3 years as to game time, and whether either of them actually played a full game or at least 3 quarters. As, I for one reckon that they played one or 2 and then back to the 2's.

Hence little chance to develop at the top level.

Enter Paul Roos who gives these players a lot more game time, and Bingo, they give the side something. Eg Fosdike 20.5 possessions per game.

Under Roos, Fosdike's disposal skills improved and he learned how to make space. Clearly he is not an in and under player and Roos recognises this. He also knew that Fozzie reads the play very well and has excellent anticipation. So if you look at replays you will see he is very often by himself making position between HB and HF. By doing this it gives Barry Hall plenty of time to make his lead.

I think Fosdike is very underrated, is a pill magnet and will prove a very valuable player in the halcyon days to come. I would expect, on Cressa's departure, that he will rack up the number of stats Cressa now gets, which means he can never be left out of the side.

By the way, I too thought that he was just making up the numbers until midway through last season.

[NMWBloods]

By the way, I too thought that he was just making up the numbers until midway through last season.

You didn't recognise his ability until then?

Actually, I've always quite liked the way Fosdike looked on the field, as I think he has good skills and I'm a bit of a fan of players with appreciable skills, but find it very frustrating when they don't use them effectively. I think he's always looked like one of the more skilfull players in our team - like players on other teams!!

I think he could become a Barry Mitchell type of player perhaps.

[penga]

yeah, ive always enjoyed watching fossie play...

i think he will become the player that we will go "we gave up paul licuria for him? woah, collingwood got screwed with that one!"