Another Way to View Trades

[sharpie]

For some reason everyone here has got talking about trading already, and we are still entrenched in the top 8 with 8 weeks to go before finals, so our season is far from over.

Instead of just nominating players at random, I think we should consider that we have to have a minimum turnover of 4 players, IIRC. So I think we should face trades, etc, this way.

Here's my go. Firstly, Bevan is still a rookie. He must be elevated to the senior list for next year I think. We must get rid of someone for that to happen. It's time to go, Warfe, but does that count as a turnover? On the other hand, Rogers will stay put on the rookie list. It appears at this point that McGlone will go back to the rookie list.

Of all the guys on the senior list, I think Sundqvist would be in the most danger of being cut loose to free up a spot on the list. Powell would be the next on that list, with possibly Dempster in toe. Supposing the Warfe-Bevan swap counts, and we lose two of these guys, we have to find one more. If it was simply a matter of cutting someone, it could come from a list of the following IMO: Ablett, Nicks, Buchanan. None of these guys are essential to our team lineup at the moment and time may have run out for Nicks similar to Seymour last year. Any of these guys, with exception of Nicks, would at least attract a late round draft pick perhaps, with slightly better for Ablett or Buchanan if they can show some more good improvement in the remainder of this season.

Someone like Fosdike could be added to this list because he was clearly on the outer in the few weeks before he got injured, having started on the bench in a number of games. He would have some decent trade value I think. Otherwise I truly think it is unnecessary to chop and change our team setup at the moment.

[swansrule100]

i wouldnt be getting rid of nicks personally or fosdike

warfe is a given really

i just want to worry bout 2004 before 2005

[caj23]

Minimum 3 players to be drafted tough call for the coaching staff

Trades aren't going to make much space on the list as you either get a player or a draft pick which you must use in return

Warfe is gone - assume straight swap for Bevan

that leaves 3 more to go

i personally don't think Meiklejohn should be retained on the senior list (this obviously changes if Ball retires)

the others in danger on the senior list could be:

Sundvquist - tough luck with the knee but could re-draft as rookie

Nicks - tough call given his solid form but may have to go

Ablett - i change my mind on him every week

Malceski - have a hunch he is safe with form he showed prior to going down

Powell - haven't seen much from him this season, big question mark hanging over him

Rogers - can return to rookie list

McGlone - can't crack it for a run in the seniors, not sure about eligibility to return to rookie list (if he'd even want to)

It's all too hard i've just got too many favourites - glad i don't have to make the decision

[Captain]

Nicks will most likely stay with us next year.

He is a valuable senior player who is contributing to a winning team. His body seems to be in better shape as does his mind.

I would say the departures would be:

Warfe (retired)
Powell
Rogers (Rookie List)
Fosdike (Traded)
Saddington (Traded)
Sundvquist (Poor guy has had bad luck)
Meiklejohn

[sharpie]

Originally posted by Captain
Nicks will most likely stay with us next year.

He is a valuable senior player who is contributing to a winning team. His body seems to be in better shape as does his mind.

I would say the departures would be:

Warfe (retired)
Powell
Rogers (Rookie List)
Fosdike (Traded)
Saddington (Traded)
Sundvquist (Poor guy has had bad luck)
Meiklejohn

I thought your post was going well, but I believe it lost credibility when you brought up Saddo to be traded. We dont have a strong group of experienced talls. We need to add to it, not diminsh it. And his value will be severely affected because he is damaged goods this year. MJ is unlikely to go as well IMO. It is only his 2nd season on the list, he will get more time, plus we need backup ruckmen who can slot straight into the side to cover for injuries, and he provides us with that in some way at the moment.

The types of players we are likely to offload come from our midfield & short defender stocks. We have a large group of these types, so the tough decisions must come from here.

[Damien]

Originally posted by sharpie
I thought your post was going well, but I believe it lost credibility when you brought up Saddo to be traded. We dont have a strong group of experienced talls. .

Depends who we got for him.

[sharp9]

I've changed my mind about Nicks, too.

He's not setting the world alight but he's a genuine player - not just filling in space (if you know what I mean).

Let's say we were in a GF next year....I can see him taking some important grabs and kicking a winner.

Classic "good ordinary" player if we take that to mean a solid, experienced guy who can do his fair share even at the highest level.

As for cutting the list. Sheesh! You are allowed a maximum of 35 players on the list prior to the draft.

Obviously Bevan must be elevated for a start. So that means four to be cut. Warfe is departing, for sure.....wonder if he'll get a send-off game?

Sundqvist and Malceski could both go onto the rookie list next year (assuming, as we do, that they have a real future) because after knee reconstructions they are not going to be at their very best next year. But they can still play for the seniors because by the time they are really pushing for selection there will be at least one injury. Plus two rookies can be nominated to play anyway.

Clearly Powell is in trouble. He's got so much going for him...but is not even an emergency this week.

Meiklejohn might go back to the rookie list as well....but having been elevated only this year he is probably on a two year contract?????

Fosdike? Trading him would get us a low draft pick (say 40) if a club was after his type.. What is his type anyway? That would mean we wouldn't have to cut any more of the youngsters on the list.

It does mean that we need room on the rookie list.

Hunt seems as though he will make way. Three years on the list without a sniff of a senior game. One of the other rookies would have to go then as well. Presumably one of Taylor or Potter is not demonstrating that he will make it at senior level. (I wouldn't know).

Surely McGlone can't be on the rookie list for four years? And a 21 year old with good skills who gets 45 possessions and has played so many games against men is a MUCH better bet than, say, picking up an 18 year old with pick 67.

So here's what I reckon.

Delisted - Warfe, Sunny, Malceski, Powell
Traded - Fosdike

Elevated - Bevan, McGlone

Leaving 35 players, and three picks, say....17 ( ) 33 and 40

[sharp9]

Originally posted by Damien
Depends who we got for him.

Saddington plus #12 for Judd, you mean

I'd buy that for a dollar.

[Captain]

Originally posted by Damien
Depends who we got for him.

Exactly

If we were able to trade Saddo and a pick for say Ottens or Thompson I would jump at that.

[boroboy]

Originally posted by Captain
Nicks will most likely stay with us next year.

I hope so - he's been invaluable this season - a wise old head just doing the simple things right when the pressure's been on. At the start of this season I would have said trade him - but he's clearly demonstrated his value to the squad. IMHO Warfe, Powell, Mieklejohn and Sunny all on their way.....

[Damien]

I think you have to consider a fair majority of the team as potential trade bait really, because if you intend to trade for a very good player, unless you have pick 1 to 5 in the draft, you are going to have to give something good up.

There are players (who I am not going to name here in case I begin a riot lol) who I am willing to give up to secure a top line player for.

It all depends on who is available, what other clubs are after and what we REALLY need to take the next step (That is persuming we haven't already taken it by September

The Kangaroos didn't want to give up Club Champion and Premiership player Shwass for the very talented Shannon Grant - but they relented, and while it was win-win - they did win the 1999 premiership with Shannon Grant best on ground!

Sometimes you have to be ruthless and harsh and trade away a favourtie to keep on track.

[Scottee]

The likely 3 in my opinion are:

Maxfield (Retired) unfortunately.
Warfe
Sunny(bad luck)

Also possible are:

Hunt(Rookie not shining)
Potter (Rookie) havn't heard what's happening with him?
James (Why isn't he getting a game?Not top 22)
Dempster- hasn't cracked it for a single game yet and few injury problems.
Ball(Possible retirement) Hope not!!

I hope I'm wrong with several of the above but it appears this way to me.

Ideas of trading Nicks, Fosdike, Saddington etc are unrealistic in my opinion, they are each solid top 22 players.

[Newbie]

Originally posted by Scottee
The likely 3 in my opinion are:
Ideas of trading Nicks, Fosdike, Saddington etc are unrealistic in my opinion, they are each solid top 22 players.

Being a solid top 22 players does not exclude oneself from being traded.

Roos has a policy of giving youngsters a game to see if they are up to it. I doubt very much Dempster would go. Macelski was spoken highly by Roos just prior to his injuries, I doubt he would go either. Sundquist is a chance to be delisted and redrafted as a rookie.

The rest of the names would get us little if anything from the draft/trade.

Playing conservative (e.g. not trading top 22 players) means that our change/improvement would be incremental. That might be OK for a top-tier team but wont work for a team of our standard. The AFL system does not reward teams for being competitive unfortunately.

[chammond]

Originally posted by Newbie
Being a solid top 22 players does not exclude oneself from being traded.

Roos has a policy of giving youngsters a game to see if they are up to it. I doubt very much Dempster would go. Macelski was spoken highly by Roos just prior to his injuries, I doubt he would go either. Sundquist is a chance to be delisted and redrafted as a rookie.

The rest of the names would get us little if anything from the draft/trade.

Playing conservative (e.g. not trading top 22 players) means that our change/improvement would be incremental. That might be OK for a top-tier team but wont work for a team of our standard. The AFL system does not reward teams for being competitive unfortunately.

Absolutely right!

If the Swans are looking for a top 50 player(s), then it's no use offering fringe players like Ablett for trade. We will need to lose one of our top ten players (not counting the older ones) plus a high draft pick . . . maybe Saddington, Kennelly, Schneider, Bolton or even O'Keefe?

If we want a marquee player, then we'll need at least two first round picks to trade.

Mind you, I suspect that Roos really is looking for only an 'incremental' improvement, and won't want to lose any of his first 22. Maybe pick up an up and coming midfielder in exchange for a first round pick?

As for delisting . . . . what's the point in getting rid of untried players like Dempster or Malceski and then replacing them with similar unknowns from the draft? The only player I'd say is really dicing with death is Powell.

And the only way Nicks will go is if his chronic back forces him to retire . . . if he wants to play on then he will, I'm sure.

If Ball and Warfe retire, Bevan is promoted, and Hunt is delisted, then I think we could meet the AFL's draft requirements by shuffling players from the senior list to the rookies (Sundqvist, Malceski, Meiklejohn?).

Trade our first pick for a ready-made, get another young ruckman with our second pick, and a couple of project talls with picks 3 and 4.

Easy!

[robbieando]

Remember we must use 3 picks in the National draft and the need to find a spot on the list for Bevan, means we need to at seasons end lose 4 players either via retirement, delisting or trading. For every player we bring in via a trade thats another spot that needs to be found. So there are going to be some hard calls this off season. I would like the club to put Bevan on the list, have 4 draft picks and bring in one key defender from another club via a trade. To do this we need to open up 6 spots on our list for next year.

How I would do this is to delist Rowan Warfe and James Meiklejohn and be rid of them. I would then delist both Nick Malceski and Jarrad Sundqvist, but I would then select both to be put on our rookie list. So far that is four spots available and the next two would be trading two of our current players. My guess is that Luke Ablett and Nic Fosdike would be the two most likely to go in this case, though I wouldn't rule out a surprise trade.

Aaron Rogers and Scott McGlone, will both out back onto our rookie list.

No matter, how the Swans decide to go this off season, some tough calls have to be made and most likely they won't be popular.