LRT v Vogels

[barry]

Not anymore.

Its Vogels vs O'Keefe for the 3rd target forward, and O'keefe is trailing badly. When Nick Davis comes back O'keefe could be in trouble.

If thats not enough, its LRT v Schuable for CHB, and by selection this week, LRT is in front.

Both Vogels and LRT played improved games again this week. The usual suspects will highlight LRT holding the ball decision, but neglect his contested marks, and crashing into packs, and exceptional ground work. not to mention his 50m left footer to MOL's chest while 2 on 1.

Great stuff from the young fellas.

[NMWBloods]

I thought LRT was beaten by Morgan.

Vogels was very good today.

[satchmopugdog]

I just posted in another thread that LRT took a contested mark and with confidence. Very pleasing sign. Sure he still is indecisive and surely should have the Rugga sense to kick for touch when he is indecisive ,but I feel it in my waters that there is improvement.

[barry]

Originally posted by NMWBloods
I thought LRT was beaten by Morgan.

You would.

Vogels was very good today.

Vogels played a good last quarter when he had fresh legs and height to his advantage (And hall no longer presenting).
Before that he was average and didnt do a lot of defensive work while in the forward line which is why Roos dragged him. I suspect that is his weakness in his game. Not a bad one though, and should be correctable if he has the desire.

[Sean]

Re: LRT v Vogels

Originally posted by barry
Its Vogels vs O'Keefe for the 3rd target forward, and O'keefe is trailing badly. When Nick Davis comes back O'keefe could be in trouble.

Don't understand why. Teams name 6 forwards - you have listed 3 and think one could be dropped. Obviously Hall & Mickey will be in the forward line so who are the other 2 that you think should be there ahead of O'Keefe?

If thats not enough, its LRT v Schuable for CHB, and by selection this week, LRT is in front.

Schauble hasn't played CHB all season has he? He's a FB.

Both Vogels and LRT played improved games again this week. The usual suspects will highlight LRT holding the ball decision, but neglect his contested marks, and crashing into packs, and exceptional ground work. not to mention his 50m left footer to MOL's chest while 2 on 1.

Let's not go overboard. Exceptional? He was OK again. I actually thought his defensive work was worse than last week but he was overall much better with the ball. I'm still happy enough with him but I'm not calling for AA selection just yet.

Great stuff from the young fellas.

I agree.

[NMWBloods]

Originally posted by barry
You would.

I thought it was fairly clear that Morgan was beating LRT for much of the game - on the lead and in marking contests.

Disregard my views all you like, but the only previous time I was highly critical of LRT was against Essendon. I thought his game last week was okay and this week was below average.

You are the blinkered one that seems to think if he manages to actually kick the ball straight or gather the ball he's done a great job.

Vogels played a good last quarter when he had fresh legs and height to his advantage (And hall no longer presenting).

So? Don't dismiss his game because of that.

Before that he was average and didnt do a lot of defensive work while in the forward line which is why Roos dragged him. I suspect that is his weakness in his game. Not a bad one though, and should be correctable if he has the desire.

Before that he wasn't on for that long.

I noticed against Essendon he chased and tackled in the forward line so I don't think it is a weakness in his game. Perhaps just a bit lazy today.

He also has a nice kick; found O'Loughlin with a good pass (which so many other players in our side struggle with - their kicks hit the ground in front of the leading player or go over their heads) and took a handy mark and goaled in the third quarter.

[stellation]

Originally posted by barry

Vogels played a good last quarter when he had fresh legs and height to his advantage (And hall no longer presenting).
Before that he was average and didnt do a lot of defensive work while in the forward line which is why Roos dragged him. I suspect that is his weakness in his game. Not a bad one though, and should be correctable if he has the desire.

He is 6'4", how much defensive work do you want from him in the forward line? I didn't notice any particular problem with it.
He was presenting when he was on the ground earlier in the game, they just weren't looking to him as they had other options. Not really his fault and doesn't cheapen the performance at the end.

[monopoly19]

LRT often seems to get caught a fair way away from his man. It might be that I'm just looking for things to pick on him about (I'm most definately not a fan), but he did NOT play well enough to keep Schauble out of the team.

Vogels was pretty quiet for most of the game, but if he kicks 3 goals every week, well, I think he's got a place in the team. I don't think him and O'Keefe are competing for the same spot, either.

[gilze]

What i fail to understand is the praise thats heaped on LRT for doing the basic things any member of a team's starting 18 does or should be able to. He had the sit for a few marks and he took them, he saw a free man and kicked it to him, so? Schauble is a better player and looked to me as if he was regathering some form last week so I'm dissapointed and bemused that he was relegated by Roosy to the reserves. The one thing I like about Vogels so much more than LRT is the fact that he looks like an AFL player. I'm sure O'Keefe isn't worrying too much about Vogels. he's been a very handy inclusion and would be usefull if he can just continue to bob up and kick some goals. But O'Keefe has been improving recently and is a pretty vital player in our forward structure

[barry]

Originally posted by NMWBloods
I thought it was fairly clear that Morgan was beating LRT for much of the game - on the lead and in marking contests.

Disregard my views all you like, but the only previous time I was highly critical of LRT was against Essendon. I thought his game last week was okay and this week was below average.

You are the blinkered one that seems to think if he manages to actually kick the ball straight or gather the ball he's done a great job.

I would say Morgan and LRT came out about square. The majority of time Morgan got it was on the lead from a great kick in the midfielder, where the kicker wasnt under any pressure at all. Not many backman can do much there.
Contested possesion,and in despute I put LRT ahead.
And it was great to see LRT setting up drive from the backline with good link up play.

And lets be honest, you've been scathing on LRT over the past few weeks.

[B]
[B]
So? Don't dismiss his game because of that.

No, but kept in context.

Before that he wasn't on for that long.

I noticed against Essendon he chased and tackled in the forward line so I don't think it is a weakness in his game. Perhaps just a bit lazy today.

I half heard Demmie go on about his lack of defensive work on one occation.

He also has a nice kick; found O'Loughlin with a good pass (which so many other players in our side struggle with - their kicks hit the ground in front of the leading player or go over their heads) and took a handy mark and goaled in the third quarter.

LRT hit MOL 100% of the time the two crossed.

[Schneiderman]

Re: LRT v Vogels

Originally posted by barry
Not anymore.

How about you wait until Roos moves him to CHB. He probably wont whilst he is kicking goals, but I am confident that if he does he would easily show up LuRTches' averageness. One good mark and two solid kicks do not a good CHB make.

[barry]

Originally posted by gilze
But O'Keefe has been improving recently and is a pretty vital player in our forward structure

O'keefes had a shocking year. typified by the essendon game where he was torn a new a-hole.
O'keefes previous role has been 3rd target behind MOL and Hall. If Vogels continues his improvement and gets good game time, I see O'keefe under pressure with Davis coming back.
Probably Saddington too as he dropped some sitters today.

Maybe O'keefe, Vogels and Saddo vying for 2 spots on the forward line might be more accurate.

[barry]

Re: Re: LRT v Vogels

Originally posted by Schneiderman
How about you wait until Roos moves him to CHB. He probably wont whilst he is kicking goals, but I am confident that if he does he would easily show up LuRTches' averageness. One good mark and two solid kicks do not a good CHB make.

Dont get me wrong. I think Schuable is a fantastic ingedient to the swans backline. He has played CHB most of his career, but been moved down to FB to cover the main forward over the last couple of years. although Leo barry is taking over that role now.
His best position is still CHB where his speed isnt exposed by a fast leading forward.
I was suprised as any that LRT stayed in the team and Schuable droped this week. When I praise LRT, its with a big picture in mind. I wont tell you where I see LRT playing in 5 years time as it may scare you.

Schauble will come back in next week. Hopefully his omission this week was just for the doggies and to build up a bit more fitness.

But I guess its a sign of things to come. Maybe Roos sees him as too injury prone to keep as the core KPP over a long campain.

[Sean]

Originally posted by NMWBloods
I thought it was fairly clear that Morgan was beating LRT for much of the game - on the lead and in marking contests.

That's a pretty big call. He had 3 marks (same as LRT) and kicked one goal. Had less than 10 touches overall.

I guess if you had to pick a winner Morgan may just be ahead but it was close enough to call it a draw IMHO.

[gilze]

Saddington may have 'dropped some sitters' but considering he is coming back from a knee reconstruction I think the signs he has shown so far have been reasonably positive. I can't see Vogels getting enough game time to worry O'Keefe in the near future. Whilst Davis is used around the ground too much to take over the role as 3rd forward to Baz and Mick IMO