Player rankings

[NMWBloods]

Originally posted by Ruckman
Perhaps we expect more from his disposals because he uses the ball well but also perhaps because we have come to expect less when it comes to his tackle count?

Why don't people comment on Hall's and MOL's tackle count?

[Ruck'n'Roll]

Originally posted by NMWBloods
Why don't people comment on Hall's and MOL's tackle count?

I should have said his tackle/shepherd/1%er count?

And I think KPP's (esp forwards) can perhaps be expected to be less effective in these areas becuase they do a lot more primary target work (competing 1 on 2, being scragged, wrestling etc). It's the smalls/mediums who should be working hardest to lock it in.
Also
MOL's a cripple.

[stellation]

Davis plays a purely attacking role no matter where he is on the ground. He doesn't have a high tackle count, but he doesn't get in the middle of stoppages because that is not his role. How many of Kirk's tackles come from riding his man the second the ball goes to him? At stoppages Davis is an outside receiver, he spends his time trying to get away from his man and that appears to be what the coaches want from him- to be in space. Davis is averaging 1.3 tackles per game this season, Blake Caracella is averaging 1.2 and Nathan Brown (Rich) was averaging 1.

[giant]

Originally posted by Ruckman
I should have said his tackle/shepherd/1%er count?

And I think KPP's (esp forwards) can perhaps be expected to be less effective in these areas becuase they do a lot more primary target work (competing 1 on 2, being scragged, wrestling etc). It's the smalls/mediums who should be working hardest to lock it in.
Also
MOL's a cripple.

MOL's diagnosis is a bit harsh but I take (& agree with) your point.

Bazza tho doesnt seem to have his defensive game together this yr nearly as well as he has in the past. I don't think we'll ever judge BBBH's game by the # of tackles but I reckon he does need to sharpen his defensive game from where it is atm.

[Ruck'n'Roll]

Originally posted by stellation
Davis plays a purely attacking role no matter where he is on the ground. He doesn't have a high tackle count, but he doesn't get in the middle of stoppages because that is not his role. How many of Kirk's tackles come from riding his man the second the ball goes to him? At stoppages Davis is an outside receiver, he spends his time trying to get away from his man and that appears to be what the coaches want from him- to be in space. Davis is averaging 1.3 tackles per game this season, Blake Caracella is averaging 1.2 and Nathan Brown (Rich) was averaging 1.

You are quite correct in your analysis of the game, esp your comments on stoppages and when we're entering 50 and comparison with Brown etc.
I think perhaps that this argument somewhat weekens your earlier

Only because it was Davis, which gets back to the value of his disposals over the value of others.

argument.
If because of his role we can't expect him to tackle/shepherd/1% because of the role then we really should be expecting more from his disposals.

In any case I don't expect him to I don't expect him to chase down opponents, I don't expect him to go hunting for tackles (although strangely enough Wayne Carey claimed he did exactly that rather than counting goals).
So while I don't expect a Kirkesque tackle count however I do expect him not to fall off tackles when they are there.

[ScottH]

Originally posted by Snowy
I made some excuses for Kennelly but I think they were valid.

Kennelly is trying to keep his goal kicking tally in tact for the rest of the year.

[Sanecow]

Originally posted by ScottH
Kennelly is trying to keep his goal kicking tally in tact for the rest of the year.

Wow, didn't realize that unfortunate situation. More hit outs than goals this year, perhaps a move to the ruck?

[Go Swannies]

Originally posted by giant
MOL's diagnosis is a bit harsh but I take (& agree with) your point.

Bazza tho doesnt seem to have his defensive game together this yr nearly as well as he has in the past. I don't think we'll ever judge BBBH's game by the # of tackles but I reckon he does need to sharpen his defensive game from where it is atm.

I think Baz has been told not to go in hard in defence in case he injures himself. On Saturday there was one time while he just looked on while another Swan ran in to make the tackle. He seemed to be twitchy about his inaction as he watched and it was so unlike his normal hard game that it has to be team orders.

[Wazza]

I posted my comments on Davis V ROK re his performance more around his 2nd efforts and defensive play, there where a few times the Adelaide defenders ran out of defence past Davis very easily. Davis is a match winner when hot but horrible when he is cold....a bit like porridge.

Cheers

Waz

[TheHood]

It was won and lost on 2 stats that clouded every other good stat we could muster:

Clangers (as mentioned...we were unclean)

Rebounds from F50 (Adelaide dominated...who didn't respect who? Our pressure was poor in our F50).

We won the rest of the game and that didn't include the 4 points.

It was a huge effort but we were so much better than them. Never seen a team escape jail more often than Adelaide this season.

[Thunder Shaker]

Originally posted by TheHood
It was a huge effort but we were so much better than them. Never seen a team escape jail more often than Adelaide this season.

I expect Adelaide to be found out during the finals. They will probably meet the Saints in the first week, and the Sainters could pur?e them the way both sides are playing. Then the second week could see Adelaide exit in straight sets if they meet a side like Brisbane.

[Ruda Wakening]

Originally posted by Ruckman
Although his 4th Q miss should also have been money for jam.

Like the money for jam mark/goal that MOL fuct up from a perfect Davis delivery. They all count.

[stellation]

Originally posted by Ruckman
I think perhaps that this argument somewhat weekens your earlier argument.
If because of his role we can't expect him to tackle/shepherd/1% because of the role then we really should be expecting more from his disposals.

I see your point, but I don't think it really weakens the argument. Putting greater value on his disposals is why he is a receiver. I don't think we get enough out of Davis, but from the nature of the role you are dependent on other players to get the ball to you (which does not absolve him of responsibility for having a slack game).

I've always though of 1%ers with forwards as an odd one really, if a 1 %er is an extra effort that does not draw a stat for the player then you could probably argue that a forward offering a lead that is not honoured is a 1%er if it clears space for another forward. Davis does this constantly through a game (long leads in particular that free up space for O'Loughlin); a different type of physical effort, still requiring a level of commitment, and you could probably equate it in some way to a midfielder bumping another player or a defender spoiling a mark. If you see Davis or O'Keefe come off for a breather after playing a role along those lines they are both completely exhausted even though they may only have 1 touch to their name.

[NMWBloods]

Davis is also our third highest goal kicker over the past 8 weeks.

[Ruck'n'Roll]

Originally posted by stellation
I've always though of 1%ers with forwards as an odd one really, if a 1 %er is an extra effort that does not draw a stat for the player then you could probably argue that a forward offering a lead that is not honoured is a 1%er if it clears space for another forward.

Actually that's a very good point and I agree completely, indeed I'd suggest watching the leading behavior of a forward line is a better indicator of how their doing than a tackle count for exampe. Certainly an absence of movement in the forward line is a damning sight.
As for Nick though, regardless of coaches instructions; I do think his habit of falling off tackles and/or ignoring opportunities to tackle is unlikely to do anything for his standing within the team or with opponents.