Campbelltown vs St George

[I_Heart_Kefalas]

So essentially, the League has stated that the buck stops with the Goal Umpires on the day for getting it wrong.

[humphrey bear]

Originally posted by Norris Lurker

Effectively, what the ruling says is that the Sydney AFL controlling body doesn't have the power to over-rule umpiring decisions. Had they ruled the other way, even though it may have been correct for that game, it would have potentially opened the floodgates for all sorts of other appeals.

Norris

The NSWAFL have the power to do what ever they want as they run the competition. Its not power they lack but the balls to do the right thing.

The excuse that it will open the floodgates for future appeals is a cop out. Sure other clubs can appeal if they feel wronged in a similar manner to C-Town. The NSWAFL could decide on every appeal on its merits and if a club is as obviously cheated as Campletown have been the AFL can uphold the appeal. If not they dismiss the appeal.

The Freo/ St Kilda decision hasnt instigated a run of appeals by AFL clubs and this wouldnt in Sydney. Like the game in Launceston a set of circumstances occurred that will probably never be repeated but as usual the NSWAFL stuffed up.

[KangaCoach]

Originally posted by humphrey bear
One line from the release says it all.

"The board accepted the final score was not correct."

It is a pathetic effort from the St George Football Club to appeal this decision. The idea in football is to get the fair and equitable result. Who cares about by-laws and obscure rules.

22 blokes from both sides ran out, played for 2 hours and at the end of the game the scores were the same. That is a draw.

The goal umpire made an error and the St George football club find an obscure rule that goes againt the spirit of the game. This is a sad day for Sydney footy.

Earlier this year the St Kilda football club could have gone to court and appealed the decision in the Fremantle game and all legal advice says they would have had the AFL commission decision over turned. They didnt because they knew they lost the game the same as StGeorge drew this game.

Shearer, this is a deplorable act by your footy club which i have always considered to be a good bunch of people. Honesty, fairness and the right thing is more imprtant than 2 points.

I wish the Crows all the worst for the rest of the year and hope such a classless, gutless and immoral act gets you exactly where you deserve to be.



P.S I dislike Campletown more than any other club in the league but they have been very poorly treated in this case.

It is certainly a interesting result considering the result of the AFL NSW/ACT investigation was that the correct result was a draw and an error in recording the scores was made. It is good to see that I am not the only one who values honesty & integrity, and for all those people who have or will allude to the fact that myself and the Campbelltown Football Club would of done the same thing if the situation was reversed. We would not of disputed the decision of the investigation.

If you are not good enough to win on the day, so be it!

[tara]

Kanga all I can say is you guys have handled yourselves well and should be conratulated on your attitude and the repsonses youve made.

Unfortunately the NSWAFL cannot be given the same praise. In one breath they openly acknowlegde the error and in the next say they tuff titties. Like the AFL earlier this year they had an opportunity to right a wrong and do the moral thing however choose to wimp out as usual. I would call into question the ethics of the people running our game and wether they have the ability to stay impartial.

[Coastal Boy]

I appreciate what people are saying when they have a go at the league.

But what happens if a game is tied when someone has a shot at goal after the siren. The umpires call out-of-bounds on the full and thus a drawn game but video evidence clearly indicates a point should have been awarded. Do we do the "moral thing" on this occasion??? Accepting video evidence of this manner can open up a can of worms whether people want to admit it or not.

[tara]

CB umpires make mistake and we live with them at the time and have to accept them. In part the human element of our game adds to the spectical take the 1979 grand final as a great example of this type of thing.

The Campbelltown situation though as I understand it was there was a dispute then and there at the time that errors had been made in the actual recording of the information not the actual awarding of a goal or point and that the matter would be contested. If an umpire awards a point but writes it on the wrong side of the ledger, that is a clerical error that should be corrected and with the technology available it was proven.

[Roo]

Coastal i know what you are saying, but that is a different circumstance. That would not stand as it was an umpiring decision that was incorrect, i think you may be getting to far into it. This was an error in recording the score by the goal umpires not an actual on field decision. So there is a massive difference.

[Roo]

If another team were in C'Towns situation (lets say North Shore) would we see a different ruling?

In my opinion we would see a different outcome.

Kanga Coach and C'town should be commended for the way they have handled the situation with proffesionalism and class, which is more than i can say for St George.

[KangaCoach]

Originally posted by ash
Fellas, please you are all too shortsighted but consistently so.

No Fox, no issue!

Would a player from either side play differently knowing the correct score?

I would be more concerned if St George rushed a behind late in the game.

I would assume they slow played the final ten minutes of the game.

Humprhey you funny old fello and Woodsy both clubs acted responsibly and for the sake of the rules and the game here in Sydney the final outcome was correct.

It is the process during and immediately after a game that may need to be reviewed.

By the way, dont be surprised if the Crows win the flag. They have the most talented list in this league.

A Penno v Crows GF - watch this
space!!!

I have played and watched many football games, I am yet to see a side with a two point lead slow play down for the final 10 minutes!

I would love to play/coach against a team under your expert guidence.

It was bad enough being robbed of the opportunity to argueably win the game by the field umpires, when after we after we had kicked a goal to level the scores. A Crows player was reported and sent off while the ball was on it's way back to the middle, meaning a free kick should of been awarded in the centre or where the incident occured. (whichever is the greater advantage) Not only wasn't a free kick awarded at half forward and possibly a subsequent 50m when a Crows official was also reported in the same incident (No free kick either?) The umpire then restarts the game with about a dozen players inside the centre square.

Now to top it off the goal umpires have the wrong score recorded and a couple of selected wise people decide to completely disregard the decision of the supposed controlling body and find that as long as the correct process was followed it does not matter if the goal umpires fail to correctly record their own and the field umpires official ruling on each score?

AFL NSW/ACT do not appoint any other official scorer and the Laws indicate that if the score can not be decided by the goal umpires in the absence of an appointed official scorer disputes will be decided by the controlling body.

Yet in this case the controlling body gets over ruled because apparently the goal umpires did not have a dispute in the scores and waived off on what they thought the correct score was.

This means that as long as one umpire agrees to change his scorecard to match the other or the scoreboard and they waive off it can never be questioned.

So much for correct rules and processes hey Ash?

[I_Heart_Kefalas]

Really makes you want to drop a 20 in the back pocket of every goal umps before games just in case...

Considering "the correct process" is followed, the goal upmires then basically control the entire result of the match regardless of what actually happens on the field, and judging by this incident apparently the league is then powerless to correct the result, despite comprehensive evidence of an error....

I am not aligned to either club and do not blame either club for their actions taken, but surely the league has got itself into a dangerous situation by following the rule book instead of basic common sense.

[Adroit]

Maybe Ash could run the NSWAFL. Nothing lost.

[Coastal Boy]

Originally posted by Roo
Coastal i know what you are saying, but that is a different circumstance. That would not stand as it was an umpiring decision that was incorrect, i think you may be getting to far into it. This was an error in recording the score by the goal umpires not an actual on field decision. So there is a massive difference.

I accept your point. If the goal umpires record the wrong score (clerical error) it is different to an umpiring decision(human error) or a siren not loud enough(mechanical error). I see merit in changing a result due to clerical or mechanical error but not human error. I guess the field umpires should have been more responsible with the scoring cards and the acts that followed after the game. Are the field umpires more to blame than the league I wonder?

[Monty Burns2]

Originally posted by Woodsy
Would imagine he is not eligible as he does not meet one of the following criteria

- Former AFL Superstar in need of gainful employment;
- Business Associate of Richard Colless; or
- Current or past President of either North Shore or Pennant Hills Football Clubs

He could be Penno's pres.....

[in_the_outer]

Woodsy,

When did a current or past president of Pennant Hills run the NSWAFL? I know Ross Howarth was a commissioner but going through the Year Books of Pennant Hills on their website I can't seem to find his name in the list of past presidents.

[Rafters]

Originally posted by Woodsy
Would imagine he is not eligible as he does not meet one of the following criteria

- Former AFL Superstar in need of gainful employment;
- Business Associate of Richard Colless; or
- Current or past President of either North Shore or Pennant Hills Football Clubs

Guess I better get to know Mr Colless then ... would love the opportunity to be involved in the running of footy in this state.

Its funny how laws/rules can be interpreted ... I would have loved to have known the thoughts of the original AFL lawmakers of their interpretation of this particular situation in relation to the rule book they wrote ... I am sure that they would not have let the pure fabric of what is right get in the way of a technicality.

Imagine if the same situation happens on Sept 9 this year? At what price could the goal umpires be "bought" ... would a million dollars be an incentive to rig the result because of a technicality? Not that it would happen at Sydney levels but there is more & more money these days at AFL level ... food for thought.

So did the St George club deny that the scores were in fact level in the appeal process? A great win for their legal guru to expose the loophole ... but a sad decision by their management / committee to go ahead with the process ... we are not playing for sheep stations!!