Balmain Players Walk Out of Match v Wests - Match Abandoned

[mountainsofpain]

IMO only when the facts are all revealed can the actions be judged.
Sure, a game and opposition was disrupted. That's ordinary. But let's not get carried away. Teams have forfeited many games this year in lower divisions and even pulled out completely. Premier div is a little different without a doubt and doing it deliberately is not the same. Whether neutrals are sympathetic comes down to if the actions were justified. Until we know more thats hard to say.

You didn't answer my question. Are you saying that this was the only way to bring this issue to "public notice"?

And what "facts" could possibly justify this course of action? It's an internal club dispute for heaven's sake.

Forfeits are hardly comparable to what occurred here by the way. Clubs don't set out to deliberately forfeit and in most cases do so in advance, meaning the opposition club doesn't have to front up on the day.

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2. Can the club survive to the end of the season til the AGM without having to have an EGM now? That is, how crucial is it that the action had to be taken now that couldn't wait 3 more rounds of footy?

3. What has happened in the last 5 AGM's at the club? I know of many clubs where there have been board upheavals via the AGM. The issues seem to be well-known in AFL Sydney circles for a long-time now, let alone the club & definitely not merely in the last week. In fact, I recall receiving a phone call in July last year (13 months ago) from a dissident player when a few issues surrounding the sports club development arose & there was a big push for Yellow & Black to return ... so even what happened in last year's AGM?

These are very good questions and ones that I had pondered as well - particularly point 2.

It appears that this stunt was pulled because the club's administration is currently refusing to hold an Extraordinary General Meeting. Well even if that is the case, and as wrong as that may be, why can't people wait until the club's Annual General Meeting to sort this out if necessary? The club may be able to dodge an EGM, but it can hardly do the same with an AGM. I'd imagine the AGM would be held sometime after the season's end and before the end of the year, why can't these issues be resolved then? After all, isn't that what Annual General Meetings are for?

And, yes, what has gone on at recent AGMs?

[ShortHalfHead]

I asked the AGM question on the deleted thread when it first became public. asking why they don't just sort it out at an AGM.

One reply said they hadn't had one for years, which would be in defiance of the incorporation rules. I just don't know why it couldn't wait, or been addressed in the past. Not sure, but was under the belief that an EGM must be called if a certain number/percentage of members request one.

Bit like the political arena, you get what you vote for and can do little about it until the polling booths open for the next election.

[Ancient Tiger]

Obviously people in Sydney football are concerned as to why the players had to take the action they did last Saturday, of walking off the field during the game against Wests, as they should be.

As a long time player/official of the Balmain Football Club (45 years), I totally support with their actions. The reasons are as follows.

Firstly, two years ago because the Club was being run so poorly a group of players contested for positions on the Board at the AGM. Three players were successful and joined me on the Board however, we were outvoted 5 votes to 4 on every occasion, and apart from that the "other Directors" would hold meetings outside of our regular meetings and make decisions that affected the Club without any participation from us at all. This is absolutely against our constitution (and other things that I will not mention on this forum with respect to the administrator of this site).

Needless to say over the next twelve months the players on the Board lost hope of being able to achieve anything with Balmain and two of them left to join other Clubs. One of them our club captain at the time, and then the reserve grade coach. What a loss !!.

The administration of the Club continued and actually got worse over time, until just recently the following events occurred.

(a)The Licenced Club was closed and put into receivership. However,the Club's assets over debt was around $4.5 million after the property was valued at $5.2 million. The property was sold at $5.2million but it appears that the sale must have fallen through because the property was sold again in March but this time for only $2.2million to a Company that was only registered in March this year (the same month as the sale...alarm bells?).

(b)Contracted players /Coaches have not been paid.

(c)Players issued a notice to the Board, in accordance with the constitution, for an Emergency General Meeting......the Board ignored this and refused to call a meeting, even though they were honor bound to call a meeting in accordance with the constitution.

(d)The players started negotiating with the Board to form a committee so that they could run the Club themselves however, despite giving the impression that a settlement on this issue was nearing completion, they back flipped at the last moment and dismissed it out of hand, and sacked one of those in negotiations.


Peoples lives have been affected by this club. Players pick up their lives and move interstate with promises that are not delivered, and where does that leave these players in the wake of all this? If one afternoon of missing football is as "tragic" as some of you suggest then please consider that, and the f

Overall the players have lost in the last few years:

1. Their "Tiger" name which the entire club hold with pride, apart from the administration (which was not put to vote by the members)
2. Their home ground, which is the best ground in Sydney
3. Their licensed club
4. The money from the sale of the license club which would fund the club ongoing forever
5. Next is the move to be called the Sydney Dockers and play out of Coogee
6. The manner in which the AGM's were conducted with regards to voting (I imagine the legalities around this are not for this forum)

I could go on with a myriad of occurrences that can all be substantiated by Club minutes and other documents but my love for the Balmain Football Club won't allow me to air any more dirty washing at this point, and the additional information I know would not be appropriate for this forum as it pertains to potential legal issues and also against the forum policy. And that is why it is a matter for the AFL to investigate.

I have also noticed people asking what else have they done to get this public knowledge. Well you have all drawn reference to the petition that the group made public previously and I assume that this would be an initial "cry for help". The fact that people from other clubs got on and supported the players shows that everyone knows what the issues are. The AFL knew that they were planning this Sydney Dockers move away from the local Balmain area, but what has been done?

These players are absolute legends in my eyes for the courageous stand they took when they knew there would be consequences against them to save their club

It is time support the players and stop the rot.


I hope this helps the Sydney Football Family understand the situation and assists you in understanding why the players had to make a statement.

The question is why have we not heard one from the club (alarm bells)

[MrTaxman]

Thanks Ancient. So there our AGMs being held and you clearly know how to get people on the board via the AGM process ... why didn't you get another 2 to get the balance of power for the following AGM (ie last November)? It really isn't that hard to stage a boardroom coup if you really are so passionate. Is it still only 5 board members that are the "baddies" or has it increased to 7 or 8 after the others did not seek re-election? Sounds like less than 50% of your own club members are supporting ye. If you can't get the votes from within, why take steps to involve people from outside? Whilst we probably all like Balmain, I don't think that you will get much sympathy from other Sydney clubs. These are common problems in sporting clubs - look at the number of changes at Parramatta Eels & Melbourne Demons over the last decade!

Did you have any sympathy for Nor-West Jets who got savaged this year with some quality Div 2 players going to Balmain so much so that they had to make the hard decision to drop down to 3rd division as a result? Did you call up those players & tell them to not go to Balmain but to stay & support their local junior club who got ravaged with the Hercules division moving out of Richmond airbase? I doubt it.

As for the players well I guess there won't be much sympathy for them from outside either. They made the decision to play for the $$ at your club - if they did their due diligence correctly then they could have gone elsewhere for lower match payments. If they weren't getting paid then should have moved elsewhere - even prior to 30 June cut-off. Non-payment of players has been a big myth going around about your club for the past 15 years, particularly around the premiership glory years in the 1990s. Can you categorically dispel that rumour prior to 2013? Reality is that Sydney is an amateur comp. What would be the average pay per player per game at Balmain? My guess is that it is less than $100 on average & half that if the side loses.

Have you done a company search on the new owners of the property? If you have alarm bells ringing then that would have been the best $16.50 investment that you could have made. Otherwise it would be wise not to cast dispersions.

If the plan is to move to the Sydney Dockers in Coogee then why not let them (you could even vote strongly in favour in the next AGM) & you set up a new Balmain club in Balmain with the Tiger as the emblem in yellow & black with a new constitution with a new president, a new committee, play out of Drummoyne etc? Of course you would need to start out in the lower divisions like Auburn, Gosford, Blacktown, Maroubra, etc. But if player power is so strong then I am sure that you could be back in Premier League within 5 years under the new name. With being in "funky Balmain", I am sure that there are a number of corporates that you could sign up as sponsors to fund the new club. What I am getting at is what is actually stopping you from dis-associating yourselves as a group from Sydney Dockers? Is the Sports Club (and potential diminishing honey pot) the only reason?

[tara]

Did you have any sympathy for Nor-West Jets who got savaged this year with some quality Div 2 players going to Balmain so much so that they had to make the hard decision to drop down to 3rd division as a result? Did you call up those players & tell them to not go to Balmain but to stay & support their local junior club who got ravaged with the Hercules division moving out of Richmond airbase? I doubt it.
?

Please name them other than the young Cass joining his brother who else?

[MrTaxman]

Please name them other than the young Cass joining his brother who else?

I understand the two Johnston boys (Brent & Ryan?) went across as well as Cass & maybe one or two others. Pekay would be more up to speed on that as well as the behind the scenes impact as I believe they were leaders at the Jets & quite influential with the father (who I played with at Aburn & Parra) with the junior club/s in the region.

[Ancient Tiger]

Thanks Taxman. As I mentioned previously the discussions around what happened at that board meeting are not for this forum, other than to say all players voted for the playing group, however there were around 60 people who were at the AGM who were apparently Balmain Members voting that I have never seen before in my 45 years at the club, and not seen since.

As I said all avenues that have been able to be taken by the players have been taken. And before you all go and say that constitutions must be followed and it is easy to enforce, then you have NEVER been involved in anything similar to that of Balmain. But again on that, this forum is not the place to discuss these details.

With regards to the players who get paid that you have no sympathy for, then WOW is all I have to say. Players from professional leagues are recruited from all over the country and have the right to expect what they are promised when they arrive. The fact that you discount them moving across the country chasing a dream, or just looking for an opportunity to do something different is staggering to me. You say people have the right to be upset about missing an afternoon of football and yet don't recognize the severity of lives being affected, just because they are paid footballers. And it was not the paid footballers who walked off, it was the heart and sole of the club that had had enough. So paid or non paid, lives have been affected.

I believe the charge was $18.50 for the ASIC information, but this forum does not allow for further discussion on the point as I alluded to.

You are also missing the point that they are not complaining about the players for leaving to other clubs, they are highlighting the reasons why and trying to do something about it.

If the people of this league do not stand up and support the players, who have been victims of a selfish administration for years that has destroyed the club, then I am lost for words. Football at this level is all about the players and giving them a place to play, and the players have had enough. This stand should be a wake up call for administrators who forget what they are there for!

[tara]

I understand the two Johnston boys (Brent & Ryan?) went across as well as Cass & maybe one or two others. Pekay would be more up to speed on that as well as the behind the scenes impact as I believe they were leaders at the Jets & quite influential with the father (who I played with at Aburn & Parra) with the junior club/s in the region.

The Cass's were a big loss but that probably had a bit to do with Bully.

[MrTaxman]

however there were around 60 people who were at the AGM who were apparently Balmain Members voting that I have never seen before in my 45 years at the club, and not seen since.

With regards to the players who get paid that you have no sympathy for, then WOW is all I have to say. Players from professional leagues are recruited from all over the country and have the right to expect what they are promised when they arrive.

I believe the charge was $18.50 for the ASIC information, but this forum does not allow for further discussion on the point as I alluded to.

Sounds like they knew how to stack the AGM & beat you at their own game. I am afraid "That's politics!" & you really need to wait til the AGM at end of year - if you thought there was something fishy about the last AGM then you really needed to bring it to a head a bit earlier in the year .. but with 3 games to go? Seriously.

Can you request an up to date list of financial members, particularly as you are on the board? Surprised that 60 members could sway. What entity is it - Balmain Dockers club or Drummoyne Sports Club? Is the structure part of the problem? What were the numbers at other recent AGM's? Can you get 61+ members for the next AGM in your corner?

So how much is owed to players by financial year in total? Are all players paid up to & including the last game of 2012 & its only 2013 payments that you are talking about? My knowledge - merely via the grapevine (probably this one) - is that it is an issue going on at the club for the past 15 years. Were players being offered ridiculous amounts to play? Are we talking about the entire squad or merely 4-5 players? As a committee member - even though you may have been outvoted 5 to 4 - do you have an ethical responsibility to let these players know that there is no money to pay them & tell them not to travel from the other side of the country - or at least try to source other sponsors to help fund their costs? Do you have a legal obligation regarding being a committee member of an organisation whilst trading insolvent? Does a professional footballer really dream of playing in Sydney for lower cash than 80% of other competitions across Australia?

I really don't know what you can expect the league to do other than drop the club to a lower division or not grant a licence to participate at all. Have league registration fees been fully paid over the years, including 2013?

I stand corrected on $18.50 charge - I will toss in the $2 difference to the "Save the Tigers" fund.

PS I can see Mike Sheahan doing a documentary now "Balmain: The Forgotten Years"

[Tim Freedman]

How many of your current list are Balmain boys / locals?? Less than 50% I would think considering the recruitment over the last few years.

I wonder what they think about the walk off and how committed they are for next year considering the ongoing turmoil. Queue opposition recruiters.......

[Tiges]

For a young player to travel to Sydney to play football would be an amazing experience. These guys aren't usually AFL material and enjoy the opportunity.

Do you have Mike's number?

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Tim...some of those in the walk off are local junior legends at their club, and those clubs know what the issues are at Balmain, and would be happy to see it in different hands!

[Ancient Tiger]

Stacking of votes is not politics, as it is not legal taxman, which is why I cannot discuss what transpired on this forum. Although I would like to know who those 60 members were!

You are correct though, the complex structure of the Drummoyne Sports Club was designed to make it difficult for bigger clubs to take over the club, however today it is being used by a group of people to hold the club at ransom at all costs.

As I said I am lost for words if people didn't support these players, who are trying to save an entire club that has fallen apart at the seams. If the administrators did care about the club, they would walk away and let the club rebuild. Why don't they? Because they care about their greed. The players tried to recoup some of the money to start them off and were not asking any where near what the Sports Club received (when they were negotiating), but now they just want their club and will start wherever they need to in order to rebuild the real Balmain brand.

Clubs are about players, not administrators, and if people cannot see the difference, my faith in people is bitterly fading!

Wouldn't you think that a response from the administrators to refute all these concerns you think would be a good thing to do? Unless of course the players are 100% justified in this extreme action, and all these facts highlighted are true. So don't expect a response!

[ShortHalfHead]

Stacking of votes is not politics, as it is not legal taxman, which is why I cannot discuss what transpired on this forum. Although I would like to know who those 60 members were!

Surely there was a book at the door that everyone had to sign, and the names of the 60 members should have been there. If they let anyone into the room to vote, the board (all of them) would be responsible and should have not let it proceed. Were the 60 financial? Receipts?

Yes taxman, a few questions to be asked.

[Ancient Tiger]

That was the question I asked ShortHalfHead and then was then removed from the Board by way of vote from the people in question. It is not as simple as some suggest to enforce constitutions and laws, and justice is for those with the biggest wallets. As I said the Balmain set up is much more complex due to the affiliation with the sports club, and removing board members once they are in is NOT as simple as people are suggesting.

If you all cannot see by now the enormous lengths these players had gone through over the last few years to get their club back (before it came to this), and if you do not back a playing group who has the courage to stand up to such selfish administrators, then the point of sport and sporting clubs is lost on you. EVERYONE in Sydney Football, and certainly on this forum has taken swipe for years at Balmain, it is about time to support those who are taking action from the ones who you have all been talking about all this time.

[Steamboat]

The actions that were taken by those that organised Sundays debacle clearly demonstrate that they are not fit to be involved in the running of the club.

What about the 10 or so embarrassed dockers players that were left on the ground after the walk off, we're they not informed of action to be taken,or did they think it was too drastic and one not to be supported.They were obviously keen to represent the club as best they could on the foot ball field.

If they did not know about or support the action, then it would be unlikely that they turn up for the remainder of the season, do Balmain then pull out for remainder of the season.

What is the leagues response?Do they take the chance of this happening again-and do their opposition turn up to possibly waste their time?