Vote #1 - Paul Chambers

[Carolyn]

Originally posted by timbo
How about the Chambers attempt at the mark in the third quarter about 20 out from goal.

I was wondering if anyone had the confidence to kick it to him, screaming for it so close to goal.

I laughed when someone actually did.

And he did fumble the mark.

If he took that mark, I was hoping that he would kick a goal

[swannieserin]

Originally posted by Carolyn
If he took that mark, I was hoping that he would kick a goal

He's improving out of sight - the fact he was both free and in the forward 50 at the right time is proof of that. Give him a few more weeks and I reckon he'll be taking marks and maybe kicking goals! (Ok so maybe I'm a bit hopeful but he seems to have improved at reading the game)

[giant]

Honestly, I've been happy to see some improvement in recent weeks but last night was just awful. I reckon you could take the tallest bloke off Bondi Beach and teach him more about ruckwork in a pre-season than this bloke seems to know.

Nice to see "Torture" appears to have stuck tho...

[goswannie14]

Originally posted by timbo
How about the Chambers attempt at the mark in the third quarter about 20 out from goal.

I was wondering if anyone had the confidence to kick it to him, screaming for it so close to goal.

I laughed when someone actually did.

And he did fumble the mark.

He nearly took a mark in the goal square in the last...until Bazza spoiled the attempt. (See thread "What was Bazza thinking").

[elroy67]

Originally posted by giant
Honestly, I've been happy to see some improvement in recent weeks but last night was just awful. I reckon you could take the tallest bloke off Bondi Beach and teach him more about ruckwork in a pre-season than this bloke seems to know.

I think his ruckwork is pretty good. His 2nd efforts are promising, and I'm more than happy he does not hog the footy and puts team play above personal gain.

[lachlanc]

Would be interesting to see what would happen if we were up against it - a losing streak of a few games etc.

Wonder if Roos would be able to tolerate what is currently a luxury - a ruckman who is still a liability but is developing, albeit slowly.

Do you then go back to one ruckman, bring in Vogels to help out down back while Hall and Goodes also do some stoppages?

Right now the Roos philosophy of playing two genuine ruckman is working, as it did last year. Given the way teams who don't subscribe to it - ie St. Kilda - are faring then let's hope he's right yet again and that it continues that way.

Bizarre thing is that I don't reckon Chambers would get a game at any other club, apart from Sydney.

But it is obviously working for us - he is either making a contribution to the whole thing or else he is being carried. You have to think that the guys who coach the team know the game well enough to be able to make this call.

Would be interested to hear if people think any other team would actually have him in their best 22?

For myself, I can imagine him in the Swans - for all the reasons of team, structure etc. - but not in any other side.

[satchmopugdog]

Stopped off in Melbourne on way back home from Europe with the intention of seeing Chambers get a kick. Disappointed BUT in the warmup I was able to note that he is a right foot kick and they didn't look too bad.

We could change his nickname to witch's hat but that would be too harsh as he does work hard in a tragic/comic way.

Saw him play in round 1 and was able to note an improvement. His movements are a bit neater and instead of rushing at packs he is thinking about clearing a space for smaller players to pick the ball up.(or maybe I was reading too much into his actions)

With us winning I think euphoria has coloured my perceptions.

[Legs Akimbo]

His continued inability to pick up, grab, hold, kick, handball the foothball is extraordinary. Yet here he is a fixture in the best 22 of the reigning premiers.

One has to admire Roos faith in him and you can always be certain Roos is working to a plan. Possibly the plan is as simple as just giving the guy absolute certainty that he is not playing for his position every week and hoping such faith will be returned in improved performance gained from confidence. Didn't Roos say something on the radio about that yesterday with respect to Jemima?

However, I wonder if we can afford to carry Torture, why can't we carry Shaw or Ericksen both of whom surely have greater long term potential?

[satchmopugdog]

Have just looked at the thread about the number of games and the numbers that Benevolent Ert supplied and my jaw dropped when I saw that He has played 40 games!!!! Just think of all the talented footballers out there ie Schmidt who would love to be able to play one game. It has just reinforced my prejudice against tall people.(This goes back to my basketball days when I thought it would be good to see tall people have to shoot to a set of goals that were as far from hand to hoop as it was for me and see how good they were)

[SMFC]

Here's something...

Jolly was no different to Chambers when he was picked up. He was a dud at Melbourne, at their feeder club Sandringham, and is pretty much what Mark Jamar is at the Demons now. He was though, a revelation in his first full senior year at the Swans.

Chambers is great value in around the grounds for the ruckman's main prioritive - tapouts. The people who look at the possession stats for ruckman are the same AFL clout supporters who thinks backmen should 'run'. Their first job is to stop their man..

Ball was also pretty shoddy at the coasters, though one things with the boom of Swans support, I'm going back a few years too many aboot states other than NSW.

I'll call him Torch as it goes with his surname, not out of disrespect and say that at tapouts he held his own against Everitt and Taylor.

Everyone has seen the Doyle light (or lack thereof) at last.

[Ruck'n'Roll]

Originally posted by SMFC
Jolly was no different to Chambers when he was picked up. He was a dud at Melbourne, at their feeder club Sandringham, and is pretty much what Mark Jamar is at the Demons now. He was though, a revelation in his first full senior year at the Swans.

Granted there were some simularities they were both recruited to the Swans as 23 year olds, they were both languishing in the reserves and both debutted 4 years prior to their recruitment.

While I don't believe stats are the be-all-and-end-all. I am beginning to be a tad worried about what sort of "revelation" Chambers is making. While Jolley's performance improved when he came to the Swans, Chambers are going the other way.

Jolly (averages) 2004 2005
Posessions 3.4 7.8
Marks 1.6 2.7
Taps 6.3 17.9
Chambers (averages) 2005 2006
Possesions 5.0 2.8
marks 1.4 0.2
hitouts 12.5 10.0

Originally posted by SMFC
I'll call him Torch as it goes with his surname, not out of disrespect and say that at tapouts he held his own against Everitt and Taylor.

&

Originally posted by Richard Davis By the way, he rucked well in the second half against Everett who is supposed to be the best in the business.

Pardon me guys but while many of us were indeed encouraged with his efforts over the last few weeks, his game against the Hawks was horrible. For goodness sakes 2 of his "effective" taps occured when he missed the ball with his hand completely and it then bounced off his head!!!!!

Originally posted by Richard Davis
Come up with a better replacement. Earl Shaw and Andrew Ericksen are 5 years away.

5 years??????
Leaving aside his ability, or lack thereof for a moment, Paul Chambers played his first game in 2002, Darren Jolly in 2001. At the same age as Earl Shaw is right now.

[NMWBloods]

Originally posted by SMFC
Jolly was no different to Chambers when he was picked up. He was a dud at Melbourne

Jolly was not a dud at Melbourne.

[stellation]

Originally posted by NMWBloods
Jolly was not a dud at Melbourne.

That's right; I know a few Demons fans that were not happy to see him go at all. He was just stuck behind White, who famously (does he still do it now?) hated being rested and wanted (and, in all fairness, could) ruck all day.

[mocaholic]

Chambers is hopeless. Embarrassing. Rubbish. Jolly was NEVER bad, just starved of opportunity, as has been recognised. Chambers wasn't getting a game even when King and Ottens were injured! The cattery'd be cacking themselves if they didn't have other things to worry about...

Just cos he's got a big body shouldn't mean he's a walk-up start. Really, if we're going to develop them then give the younger blokes a go.

[giant]

Originally posted by Ruck'n'Roll


Pardon me guys but while many of us were indeed encouraged with his efforts over the last few weeks, his game against the Hawks was horrible. For goodness sakes 2 of his "effective" taps occured when he missed the ball with his hand completely and it then bounced off his head!!!!!

Classic! I spotted these as well - the first time he did it I chortled; the second time, I kinda cried.

Shame there is not a separate stat for "bonce out" coz Torture would be flying ahead.