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  • Nico
    Veterans List
    • Jan 2003
    • 11339

    I went to the game and there was some glaring weaknesses that happen every week.

    My hobby horse, poor centre bounce strategies and clearances was so obvious. It is so frustrating when you see the likes of Sewell and Mitchell getting first hands to the footy and easy clearances. They are so desparate to be first to the footy. Sewell was BOG for mine.

    Melbourne coach Dean Bailey did an expose last week on how Hawthorn set up at centre bounces and what to do to counter it. Basically they set up with players spread so they have a gap to run into on their defensive side. To combat it you simply put a player there. It worked beautifuly today so well that our blokes many a time didn't get near them. Clearly our coaching panel is not aware of this play and didn't watch the Bailey segment.

    By the way, who was on Sewell as he didn't have a man all day. At one point J Bolton appeared to be close to him on occasions. If that was Jude's role then he failed miserably.

    We cannot win games with only around 14 players on the field. We have a massively long tail to our team and it has never been more evident than today. At the game you get a much better view of what players are doing. The following players were clearly absolute pasengers today for the following reasons:

    Crouch - slow and has no idea any more. His only saving grace today was Rioli did a hammie at the 8 minute mark. He was useless and woeful all game.
    Past his use by date big time.

    Grundy - I'm off him now. He is slow and just doesn't get to contests. He takes the odd lead up mark but is labourously slow. There was one contest on the Southern stand HFF where he completely misread where the ball was going and simply ambled (and that's kind) after the Hawthorn player who had gathered the ball. Best described as a boarding house cup of tea - big and weak.

    Buchanan - That perfect kick on the run to a Hawthorn player cost us dearly. He could have kept going, drawn the player for an easy handball to MOL. The rest of his game was rubbish and without looking at stats I would guess he would have struggled to get the dozen. A weak effort that smacks of a player past it, disinterested or thinks there is no one to replace him.

    Malceski - How many touches did he get. I suspect maybe 2 in the first half. His 2nd half was just as crap. I mixed him up with Mattner a couple of times. Has a cheek picking up his pay cheque this week. Has got to be the most insipid effort by a player I have seen in a long time. Not fit, not interested; who cares, get rid of this faded star who clearly dislikes a contest.Probably better off playing back at North Ringwood in the EFL 3rd Division.

    Moore - probably the real disappointment of the day. He has no idea reading the playing coming forward. He goes the wrong for goodness sake. He doesn't get to the feet of his forwards and I reckon today he didn't want to go to a couple of contests today. A very poor effort and is one young player given his chance and has blown it. The mid year review is on this week and I suspect this bloke is high on the agenda.

    Bevan - gee he was like treacle today. He was on Williams some of the time (3 goals) and Osbourne in the 3rd quarter who lead him a merry dance up the ground and around the forward line. He was instrumental in their quick run of goals in the 3rd Q.

    Jack - Liz loves this bloke but the Swans fans around was groaning with his poor and soft first half. Bateman wasn't on the ball, mainly HFF. Jack got caught, went the wrong way, didn't win a hard ball clearance until early 3rd Q, doesn't run to space and is not creative. This guy is marking time and like Moore has had more than enough chances to prove himself. Plays the odd good game, but is he a front runner.

    Why doesn't White get maximum ground time? He was so enthusiastic when he was on the ball and has great second efforts. He oozes enthusiasm, something we lack from most of the abovesaid.

    As other posters have said; the olds and bolds continue to produce the goods, it is the second tier that don't appear to be up to it.
    http://www.nostalgiamusic.co.uk/secu...res/srh806.jpg

    Comment

    • ugg
      Can you feel it?
      Site Admin
      • Jan 2003
      • 15970

      Sewell is Hawthorn's main tagger, he started on Jude because Goodes started up forward, but when Goodes moved into the middle, he was tagging Goodes instead.

      And I'm a bit bewildered about your Crouch comments. After Rioli went off injured, he squared off against McGlynn and came away with honours even IMHO.
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      • Nico
        Veterans List
        • Jan 2003
        • 11339

        Originally posted by ugg
        Sewell is Hawthorn's main tagger, he started on Jude because Goodes started up forward, but when Goodes moved into the middle, he was tagging Goodes instead.

        And I'm a bit bewildered about your Crouch comments. After Rioli went off injured, he squared off against McGlynn and came away with honours even IMHO.
        I will agree to disagree on Crouch.

        On Sewell, I have watched him the last 3 weeks and there is no way he is tagging. He is clearly their number 2 midfielder tight now. His possession rate is high and his clearance work is not that of a tagger. He was outstanding all day and his centre square work was simply top of the class. He is first to contests, runs to space, reacts quickly, has quick hands, tackles adnausium and wins an incredible amount of hard ball. Why he was free all day staggered all and sundry.
        http://www.nostalgiamusic.co.uk/secu...res/srh806.jpg

        Comment

        • Melbournehammer
          Senior Player
          • May 2007
          • 1815

          Originally posted by Bear
          there were about 20 on that level. pointing your finger at Goodes is ludicrous.

          blaming the umpires is equally a waste of time, when we wasted so many opportunities in attak and made silly errors in defence.
          goodes himself knew it. i was watching him afterwards and he sat on his haunches with his head in his hands. and it wasn't because bevan had just given a free away in our goal square.

          far from blaming the umpires i just think they are pathetic. two frees against jolly - one for a centre square infringement and one for holding the ball where he took one step after picking up a half volley were ludicrous. It is the sheer frustration of having some things plucked in the game and others not. I was sitting in the front row on the non members wing and mitchell was holding a swan in a marking contest right in front of me - not paid, but a moment later there was a holding call to goodes in front of our goal where the hold was there - but for the briefest moment - mitchell did it for just as long.

          the problem with the umpring is that in a game of so many contests and so much contested footy free possessions are critical. two frees which were paid - one to kirk and one to liam s (don't know his name) both led directly to goals - their one in the first quarter and kirk's in the last - and i reckon both of them if they were in the back there were 50 in the backs over the course of the game that were not paid.

          Comment

          • ugg
            Can you feel it?
            Site Admin
            • Jan 2003
            • 15970

            Originally posted by Nico
            I will agree to disagree on Crouch.

            On Sewell, I have watched him the last 3 weeks and there is no way he is tagging. He is clearly their number 2 midfielder tight now. His possession rate is high and his clearance work is not that of a tagger. He was outstanding all day and his centre square work was simply top of the class. He is first to contests, runs to space, reacts quickly, has quick hands, tackles adnausium and wins an incredible amount of hard ball. Why he was free all day staggered all and sundry.
            By classifying him as a tagger, I am not by any means denigrating his offensive skills. He has been fantastic this year, continuing from his breakout year last year. However, if you go ask any Hawks fan they will agree that he is their number one tagger. Despite what may appear to be the case after years of watching our beloved Swans, being a tagger and being a great midfielder are not mutually exclusive attributes.

            Want some stats to back it up? Number 1 Hawks tackler and 5th overall (totals), 2nd overall (averages) in the AFL before this round started. Had 5 at half time but none in the 2nd half (I only know this because I have him in FF )
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            • stellation
              scott names the planets
              • Sep 2003
              • 9720

              Originally posted by Nico
              Why doesn't White get maximum ground time? He was so enthusiastic when he was on the ball and has great second efforts. He oozes enthusiasm, something we lack from most of the abovesaid.
              I thought that was the best game I've seen him play; stats wise he's had games where he's had more disposals, hitouts, goals etc. but I thought his second efforts today were phenomenal. There was one play on the wing where he swooped at full flight and we saw just how much speed that big boy has got, showed a lot of toe to get nicely onto his right.

              I agree he needs more game time, but the guy is playing as an undersized ruckman and that really must take a hell of a lot of out of you physically; each time he contests a centre bounce he looks to be jumping a mile higher than his opponent, and whilst he obviousy can jump high for a big bloke doing it consistently through a game must take its toll.
              I knew him as a gentle young man, I cannot say for sure the reasons for his decline
              We watched him fade before our very eyes, and years before his time

              Comment

              • Lohengrin
                On the Rookie List
                • Jul 2008
                • 641

                Originally posted by Melbournehammer
                just to be the voice of the devil's advocate...

                there were three turning points today.

                1. buchanan running inside 50 in the third quarter with no-one within 20 metres of him kicking the ball to the advantage of the one hawk inside 50 - they kicked goals back to back from that and we went into the 3/4 quarter time break about 10 points down instead of closing the gap. (by the way his failure to mark the ball from a chest pass from bolton in the second quarter was simply embarassing)

                2. goodes turning back onto his left foot after taking a good mark centre wing and getting caught with the ball leading to a pathetic handpass which led to the hall 150

                3. the hall 150.

                goodes deserves high recognition for getting us back into the game and keeping us there - but it was such bad decision making at a critical moment.

                anyway having been at the game the umpiring was appalling - and once again showed how influential decisions can be
                The Buchanan one - the Hawks had just missed two easy goals themselves immediately before and that was in the 3rd qtr. Stupid by Buchanan, but I don't think a turning point.

                I think the 3 turning points are 2. and 3 above plus Bevan's free on Williams. They all happened within a few minutes of each other. Swans had all the momentum, Hawks were exhausted and had stopped (down an important player and lots of nonmatchfit players - shows how bad we were going).

                Comment

                • Triple B
                  Formerly 'BBB'
                  • Feb 2003
                  • 6999

                  Originally posted by Swans500
                  And I don't wanna hear sick excuses from Roos about the jerk either!!!
                  You sure got your wish there.

                  I reckon Roos was way harsh in the post match and would not surprise to see him back pedal on OTC tonight.
                  Driver of the Dan Hannebery bandwagon....all aboard. 4th April 09

                  Comment

                  • Nico
                    Veterans List
                    • Jan 2003
                    • 11339

                    Originally posted by stellation
                    I thought that was the best game I've seen him play; stats wise he's had games where he's had more disposals, hitouts, goals etc. but I thought his second efforts today were phenomenal. There was one play on the wing where he swooped at full flight and we saw just how much speed that big boy has got, showed a lot of toe to get nicely onto his right.

                    I agree he needs more game time, but the guy is playing as an undersized ruckman and that really must take a hell of a lot of out of you physically; each time he contests a centre bounce he looks to be jumping a mile higher than his opponent, and whilst he obviousy can jump high for a big bloke doing it consistently through a game must take its toll.
                    I can see where you are coming from but he is a big fit young man playing at elite level. I haven't seen him puffing at all.

                    Try this one on; last week Grundy had 7 possessions and 83% game time = 98.4 minutes, White had 4 possessions and a paltry 37% game time = 44.4 minutes.

                    This week Grundy had 13 possessions and 80% game time = 96 minutes and was ordinary at the very, very best, White had 6 possessions and 46% game time = 55.2 minutes and a lot of that was in the 2nd quarter when he had 5 possessions and gave us a spark.

                    White hardly gets time to get warmed up. I just don't get it. He is much quicker than Grundy and is likely more versatile but will we ever find that out.

                    I would like to see the TOG reversed and see what happens. If that means run him the ruck a bit and move him backward or forward so we can see whether he has the goods. You don't improve your game getting splinters, and we all know we lack height all around the ground.
                    http://www.nostalgiamusic.co.uk/secu...res/srh806.jpg

                    Comment

                    • stellation
                      scott names the planets
                      • Sep 2003
                      • 9720

                      I can't agree with you more Nico, I was really just playing devil's advocate- I do think it'd take a lot out of him, but at the same time I don't think he'd overly mind either!
                      I knew him as a gentle young man, I cannot say for sure the reasons for his decline
                      We watched him fade before our very eyes, and years before his time

                      Comment

                      • liz
                        Veteran
                        Site Admin
                        • Jan 2003
                        • 16770

                        Originally posted by Nico
                        White had 6 possessions and 46% game time = 55.2 minutes.

                        Surprises me that he had so little game time - on two counts. One - agreeing with you - it seems daft to use him so little. When Hall has three defenders hanging off him, O'Loughlin is being kept quiet and we are screaming out for a target at CHF, seems strange not to plonk him there for a bit and see what happens. He can take a grab and has shown he has a good long kick on him. And if he just crashes the packs and makes a few more Hawks sorer, nothing wrong with that.

                        Second reason is that he seemed to be in the play a lot. Got quite a lot of time in the ruck. Must have made the most of the limited time he was granted.

                        Comment

                        • stellation
                          scott names the planets
                          • Sep 2003
                          • 9720

                          Originally posted by liz
                          Second reason is that he seemed to be in the play a lot. Got quite a lot of time in the ruck. Must have made the most of the limited time he was granted.
                          He did quite well in the ruck too, he won more contests than either Hawks ruckman.
                          I knew him as a gentle young man, I cannot say for sure the reasons for his decline
                          We watched him fade before our very eyes, and years before his time

                          Comment

                          • liz
                            Veteran
                            Site Admin
                            • Jan 2003
                            • 16770

                            Originally posted by stellation
                            He did quite well in the ruck too, he won more contests than either Hawks ruckman.
                            I think the combined ruck hit-outs of Renouf and Taylor were 30. Jolly got 35 on his own, while White collected 19. Now if only we had someone capable of taking advantage...

                            Comment

                            • 31 hard at it
                              Regular in the Side
                              • Mar 2008
                              • 550

                              The Bucky spray into the forward line from 48 out was bad.
                              He was clear and could have run another 5 metres and either drilled it or drawn the player.
                              Very disappointing to sit there and watch a senior player waste such an opportunity when they worked so hard to stay in the contest.

                              Comment

                              • Nico
                                Veterans List
                                • Jan 2003
                                • 11339

                                Originally posted by liz
                                I think the combined ruck hit-outs of Renouf and Taylor were 30. Jolly got 35 on his own, while White collected 19. Now if only we had someone capable of taking advantage...
                                19 hitouts and such a short time on the ground. Liz I kept looking for him in the second half but alas almost no show. He looks a real show as a footballer, why not unleash him now. If he was at any other club he would be right in the fray. I dare say if he was put up for trade 16 clubs would be after him. The queue would be from Melbourne to Geelong.
                                http://www.nostalgiamusic.co.uk/secu...res/srh806.jpg

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