Changes for Essendon (official teams named)

[ugg]

Very sunny across Sydney (I'm on the Lower North Shore)

Weather forecast says mid-afternoon showers. Similar to the Freo game

do you reckon a dry SCG and sunny weather will suit essendon?

They burned us with pace and quick ball movement in the corresponding game last year. Dry weather will suit that game plan.

I wonder if they'll swap O'Dwyer for Bevan now the weather has changed.

[erica]

It might be dry weather, but I doubt the ground is dry. Glorious morning, but mid afternoon showers forecast near the coast.

[Damien]

It might be dry weather, but I doubt the ground is dry. Glorious morning, but mid afternoon showers forecast near the coast.

The ground has a pretty good system now to deal with excess water so might be dryer than expected.

[erica]

The ground has a pretty good system now to deal with excess water so might be dryer than expected.

Yes, I thought that too, until I arrived at the ground for the Freo game and saw how much mud there was (and it hadn't rained all morning that day - the rain started again in the afternoon). The groundsmen had the big super-soaker rollers out, but there were still patches of excess water around the outer.

[Hartijon]

The bolded comment (which isn't necessarily accurate-- soccering, slapping and knocking the ball on are far more valuable in the wet than the dry, meaning that you don't have to take possession to move the ball to advantage) involves an agreement that some skills (e.g. precise kicking to position) are less important in the wet. There are particular basic skills which are more important to execute in the wet than the dry (uncontested marking particularly leaps to mind, because if the ball hits the ground your chances of recovering and retaining possession are far lower).

But when you talk about the entire range of skills executed by players across the ground, anyone who's watched Aussie rules played in all conditions over a period of years, and feels the need to maintain that more skilled sides' advantage over less skilled sides is accentuated in the wet, is in denial (or an amazingly poor judge). It's not just Richmond v Port Adelaide; I have seen dozens of times, sides that would have struggled on a dry day compared with their opponents, winning (and frequently winning handsomely, esp in a percentage sense) because they've been harder at the footy, harder at the man, have placed constant physical pressure on their opponents (further reducing the odds of a precise pass to advantage by hand or foot), and have taken advantage of the massive benefit conferred on spoiling defenders in the wet to annul their opponents' marking forwards.

To say 'skilled players aren't as much affected by the wet' is therefore far too broadbrush. It depends which skills the player excels at. Plugger Lockett remained as much of a threat in the wet as the dry (large number of his marks were chest marks, not dependent on massive aerobic ability beyond his pace on the lead), whereas when the greatest 10 matches ever played by Adam Goodes are compiled, I don't think that wet-trackers will feature too heavily in them.

Happy to be corrected, but from 2007-present I don't think our wet weather record would be much worse than our general W:L record. Prior to that there were a number of poor wet-weather results because we persisted mystifyingly long with the idea that you can stitch together 4-or-5-long chains of handpasses on slippery days.

This post should be saved as you have so many detailed points. Well done! The player I like was the one that can still get the ball and kick it when it is hailing.!!! :-) The main problem with hail is the stinging eyes when you look up and the slippery surface. Let's hope it doesn't hail today but have any ROW's watched a game in hail or played in it? Surely that's gotta be the most extreme weather condition?

[liz]

I am in the Eastern Suburbs, just a few kilometres from the SCG as the swan flies. Cloud cover has increased significantly in the last half an hour or so and sky is now predominantly grey. Few clear bits of sky westwards (ie SCG direction) but I suspect they will be gone soon.

[hammo]

I am in Randwick and it's lightly raining now

[Nico]

This post should be saved as you have so many detailed points. Well done! The player I like was the one that can still get the ball and kick it when it is hailing.!!! :-) The main problem with hail is the stinging eyes when you look up and the slippery surface. Let's hope it doesn't hail today but have any ROW's watched a game in hail or played in it? Surely that's gotta be the most extreme weather condition?

I recall an Under 18 game I played in between Clayton and Cheltenham many moons ago in the Federal League in Melbourne when it pelted rain all game (no hail). When the ball hit the ground it skidded and in many cases kicks fell short. Unless you got to the ball on the half volley it skidded well past you and on these days it is very hard to back peddle to follow up. I found these conditions were the one time where playing a metre behind your man was to your advantage. Often even if the player in front traps the ball it is easily spilled so you are there to contest or disposess. Kicking off the ground and slapping the ball on gains valuable ground and it is ground the opposition has to work hard on regaining. Players with good anticipation usually play better in the wet. They can read the surface, where the ball is going and poor kicks.

On the skills bit: I found blokes who were thumping kicks in the dry were the same in the wet. Someone on RWO said 2 handed players are better in the wet; well depends on what you mean by wet. I was good at one handed pick ups on the run on both sides of the body (back yard practice with a paper footy), and found it a big advantage in the wet because the ball has stopped and is not bobbing around. Wet as in a lot of rain with a lot of surface water is different from muddy. Try dragging yourself around a ground where you are ankle deep in mud. It requires a different midset and set of skills. Marking; we were always told that in the wet face the ball with open palms so the ball falls to the front of you for a second bite or if it spills you have first chance of possession or one of your team mates can gather.

Some people who might be stars on dry grounds become sooks in the wet. They just don't like it, so it becomes an above the shoulders issue. Port Adelaide have shown over a few seasons that they are sooks in the wet. IIRC a couple of years ago Brisbane came from nowhere at AAMI Stadium against them when the constant heavy rain set in.

On the skills level in the wet debate I think the very best still shine, with exceptions. Skilton, Bedford, Whitten, Carey, Teasdale etc were good no matter the conditions.

On our current team I think Lewis Jetta has an aversion to wet conditions, maybe because of his stature.

The debate continues.......

[nicko18]

There are rainbows and heavy clouds as I look south towards the CBD and it's drizzling up here on the northern beaches, but the BOM has a cell coming from the south that may miss the city and drift over the ocean

[Matty10]

The bolded comment (which isn't necessarily accurate-- soccering, slapping and knocking the ball on are far more valuable in the wet than the dry, meaning that you don't have to take possession to move the ball to advantage) involves an agreement that some skills (e.g. precise kicking to position) are less important in the wet. There are particular basic skills which are more important to execute in the wet than the dry (uncontested marking particularly leaps to mind, because if the ball hits the ground your chances of recovering and retaining possession are far lower).

But when you talk about the entire range of skills executed by players across the ground, anyone who's watched Aussie rules played in all conditions over a period of years, and feels the need to maintain that more skilled sides' advantage over less skilled sides is accentuated in the wet, is in denial (or an amazingly poor judge). It's not just Richmond v Port Adelaide; I have seen dozens of times, sides that would have struggled on a dry day compared with their opponents, winning (and frequently winning handsomely, esp in a percentage sense) because they've been harder at the footy, harder at the man, have placed constant physical pressure on their opponents (further reducing the odds of a precise pass to advantage by hand or foot), and have taken advantage of the massive benefit conferred on spoiling defenders in the wet to annul their opponents' marking forwards.

To say 'skilled players aren't as much affected by the wet' is therefore far too broadbrush. It depends which skills the player excels at. Plugger Lockett remained as much of a threat in the wet as the dry (large number of his marks were chest marks, not dependent on massive aerobic ability beyond his pace on the lead), whereas when the greatest 10 matches ever played by Adam Goodes are compiled, I don't think that wet-trackers will feature too heavily in them.

Happy to be corrected, but from 2007-present I don't think our wet weather record would be much worse than our general W:L record. Prior to that there were a number of poor wet-weather results because we persisted mystifyingly long with the idea that you can stitch together 4-or-5-long chains of handpasses on slippery days.

Excellent post.

I wonder also if Eade's comments were directed more to his own players at the time (although I am not sure when he made it). He may have just been reassuring his more skilled team that they should win against a more poorly skilled team - even in the wet. It would be the same way that Hardwick said that he smiled and thought that they were a chance against Port when he saw the weather conditions (which I assume he also passed on to his players).

Coaches will often say whatever they can if it helps the mindset of their team. Having said that though I also recall Eade (at the Swans) making comments prior to the finals that we were just making up the numbers - which certainly would not have helped their confidence.

[Hartijon]

I recall an Under 18 game I played in between Clayton and Cheltenham many moons ago in the Federal League in Melbourne when it pelted rain all game (no hail). When the ball hit the ground it skidded and in many cases kicks fell short. Unless you got to the ball on the half volley it skidded well past you and on these days it is very hard to back peddle to follow up. I found these conditions were the one time where playing a metre behind your man was to your advantage. Often even if the player in front traps the ball it is easily spilled so you are there to contest or disposess. Kicking off the ground and slapping the ball on gains valuable ground and it is ground the opposition has to work hard on regaining. Players with good anticipation usually play better in the wet. They can read the surface, where the ball is going and poor kicks.

On the skills bit: I found blokes who were thumping kicks in the dry were the same in the wet. Someone on RWO said 2 handed players are better in the wet; well depends on what you mean by wet. I was good at one handed pick ups on the run on both sides of the body (back yard practice with a paper footy), and found it a big advantage in the wet because the ball has stopped and is not bobbing around. Wet as in a lot of rain with a lot of surface water is different from muddy. Try dragging yourself around a ground where you are ankle deep in mud. It requires a different midset and set of skills. Marking; we were always told that in the wet face the ball with open palms so the ball falls to the front of you for a second bite or if it spills you have first chance of possession or one of your team mates can gather.

Some people who might be stars on dry grounds become sooks in the wet. They just don't like it, so it becomes an above the shoulders issue. Port Adelaide have shown over a few seasons that they are sooks in the wet. IIRC a couple of years ago Brisbane came from nowhere at AAMI Stadium against them when the constant heavy rain set in.

On the skills level in the wet debate I think the very best still shine, with exceptions. Skilton, Bedford, Whitten, Carey, Teasdale etc were good no matter the conditions.

On our current team I think Lewis Jetta has an aversion to wet conditions, maybe because of his stature.

The debate continues.......

Good post and great understanding of the game. I played one game in freezing conditions in the Adelaide Hills and just before 1/2 time it hailed. We stayed on coz there was just a few minutes to go to 1/2 time and the ball came to me in the goal square and shielding my eyes to the last seconds I managed some how to mark it 10 metres out right in front. My team mates were ecstatic.I went back and lined it up walked in and the moment I lifted my leg off the ground to kick i fell flat on my arse,slipped like i was on ice.On the way down my leg accidently met the ball and it went through for a point. When I got up the siren went and everybody from the umpires to all the players were all laughing.I felt like a goose!

[Nico]

I was boundary umpiring a junior game in the late 90's on the Montrose game which is at the base of the Dandenong Ranges. It was cold enough before half time but when we came out it had dropped about 5 degrees and was hailing. The hands were almost numb. The umps looked at each other and the boys and said lets go before we freeze. We didn't go off, in true footy form, and once we got going it was OK. The thighs copped a hiding from the hail for a good 5 minutes. Not one of the Under 14 boys complained.