One year too long...

[chuckie]

I stated when rating Kirk's 2009 season that he would struggle this year, with everything he has been able to achieve in football he has always put the club first, I think it is time to do that again and retire now.

[DST]

I've got no idea, but I never liked this succession plan, seems way to narrow and inward looking for mine. Lets just hope it's not more of the same.

Considering that success in the AFL has generally come from stability at club level (most notably within the football deparment) I found this statement some what bemusing.

DST

[Go Swannies]

I stated when rating Kirk's 2009 season that he would struggle this year, with everything he has been able to achieve in football he has always put the club first, I think it is time to do that again and retire now.

You had me go looking for some stats. Kieren Jack has been playing quite well so I thought I'd compare Kirk who is 10 years older.

Kirk (Jack)
Disposals 17.1 (19.2)
Tackles 5.2 (5.3)
Goals 0.6 (0.8)
Clearances 3.3 (4.4)
Contested possessions 8.6 (10.1)
Uncontested 11.9 (10.6) 1% 4.4 (4.9)

Kirk is below Jack but far enough below to dump him. He's ALWAYS been slow.

Personally I'd prefer him to retire with dignity at the end of the season and I'm pretty sure that's what will happen.

[The Goodes]

Within two months Roos and Kirk will be gone and the Swans 2005 Premiership era is really over. I wonder who will lift the team to the next Premiership - if anyone?

Horse.

Hannebery. Jack. Rohan. Grundy. Mcglynn. Mattner. Tiger. Kennedy. Jetta. LRT. O'Keefe. Mumford. Goodes. Seaby. Shaw. Bradshaw. Pyke. Moore. Plus a whole bunch of people Roos has shied away from playing...including, Heath, Vez, MOD, TDL, Meredith et al. And who knows what we get at the end of the season player-wise when the ND and PSD comes around.

It's not like we're AFL basket-case material.

[Reggi]

You had me go looking for some stats. Kieren Jack has been playing quite well so I thought I'd compare Kirk who is 10 years older.

Kirk (Jack)
Disposals 17.1 (19.2)
Tackles 5.2 (5.3)
Goals 0.6 (0.8)
Clearances 3.3 (4.4)
Contested possessions 8.6 (10.1)
Uncontested 11.9 (10.6) 1% 4.4 (4.9)

Kirk is below Jack but far enough below to dump him. He's ALWAYS been slow.

Personally I'd prefer him to retire with dignity at the end of the season and I'm pretty sure that's what will happen.

I described to Dr J and BBB earlier in the year that this is The Unmentionable everyone has gone past that. Stats are one thing, it's that at face value he seems to run out of legs in the second half. He was discussed on SEN after comments by Mick Malthouse over the weekend, SEN commentatros have called time on Kirky's career a few times this year. MArk Robinson did say however he as a journalist did not feel entitled to make comment on it before Kirk himself declared career over

Mick Malthouse said it was a very difficult time, he has to say to players do you really want to be remembered for how you are going now when you are really struggling?

Maybe this thread should be retitled "People Who would consider shooting Bambi"

[goswannie14]

I actually expected to be hung, drawn and quartered when I posted the thread, but it appears I am not alone.

[sharp9]

Unless a) player is absolutely terrible or b) premiership is a possibilty if player is dropped for (say) O'Dwyer or Vez or Meredith then there is absolutely nothing to be gained by staining the career of a legend.

We're not going to win the cup this year....Kirky should be encouraged to play his heart out for the rest of the year....results are irrelevant.

[Mr Magoo]

Unless a) player is absolutely terrible or b) premiership is a possibilty if player is dropped for (say) O'Dwyer or Vez or Meredith then there is absolutely nothing to be gained by staining the career of a legend.

We're not going to win the cup this year....Kirky should be encouraged to play his heart out for the rest of the year....results are irrelevant.

I disagree. Results are still relevant. We are still in the eight , we have some very winnable games ahead and kirky should consider whether he is able to contribute in the best 22. At the moment I still think he probably is in the best 22 but he is definitely looking like he is struggling to his past form and it wouldnt hurt the side as badly now for him to leave as it might have twelve months ago. Unfortunately I still dont think any of the younger midfielders have yet shown that they can fill the gap. They maybe competng with Kirks current stats but how many are actually regularly exceeding them?.

[dimelb]

I disagree. Results are still relevant. We are still in the eight , we have some very winnable games ahead and kirky should consider whether he is able to contribute in the best 22. At the moment I still think he probably is in the best 22 but he is definitely looking like he is struggling to his past form and it wouldnt hurt the side as badly now for him to leave as it might have twelve months ago. Unfortunately I still dont think any of the younger midfielders have yet shown that they can fill the gap. They maybe competng with Kirks current stats but how many are actually regularly exceeding them?.

I'd like to see Bird playing in the centre all the time. Not yet a Kirk but in the meantime he'll do fine.

[Plugger46]

Unless a) player is absolutely terrible or b) premiership is a possibilty if player is dropped for (say) O'Dwyer or Vez or Meredith then there is absolutely nothing to be gained by staining the career of a legend.

We're not going to win the cup this year....Kirky should be encouraged to play his heart out for the rest of the year....results are irrelevant.

I wouldn't drop him either but results are very relevant.

[Jewels]

I stated when rating Kirk's 2009 season that he would struggle this year, with everything he has been able to achieve in football he has always put the club first, I think it is time to do that again and retire now.

I was going to answer the above quote with something very similar to the below quote. I don't however, think results are irrelevant, but I think Kirks involvement is not going to make any great difference to our results for the remainder of the year.

Unless a) player is absolutely terrible or b) premiership is a possibilty if player is dropped for (say) O'Dwyer or Vez or Meredith then there is absolutely nothing to be gained by staining the career of a legend.

We're not going to win the cup this year....Kirky should be encouraged to play his heart out for the rest of the year....results are irrelevant.

Will it be Horse?....Will he sweep through the club with fresh ideas and enthusiasm?...Will he change some of the assistants and support staff?..
I've got no idea, but I never liked this succession plan, seems way to narrow and inward looking for mine. Lets just hope it's not more of the same.

So, instead of the coach retiring and having the input into appointing his successor, said successor having (in all probability) a say in the hiring of his future co-coachesand all these people working together so that the transition is seamless for all parties involved, you would prefer more of a Essendon, North, Richmond, Carlton et al scenario?

[Melbourne_Blood]

I see what your saying Jewels, but i think Ernie's point is valid too. When a position as important as this becomes available, there should ideally be a process in which many potential candidates are interviewed for said position. This is the process that got St. Kilda Ross Lyon. No one is saying Horse will be no good, or that he'll be a Roos Clone, just that it would be nice to see the club take a more open approach to finding the right person to take this club we all love to its next premiership. By all rights that person might very well be Longmire, he might prove an outstanding coach, who knows? But at least show the supporters you take the appointment seriously by opening the doors to people who believe they can take on the job and listening to what they have to say.
Longmire's credentials are probably as good as anybody out there's, i understand that. However, i can also understand that perhaps the fact he has been with us so long may not neccesarily be a positive. We'll find out soon enough anway, and i hope I'm on here in a years time singing the praises of Horse as a visionary and bold risk taker. We'll see

[UglyDuckling]

I see what your saying Jewels, but i think Ernie's point is valid too. When a position as important as this becomes available, there should ideally be a process in which many potential candidates are interviewed for said position. This is the process that got St. Kilda Ross Lyon. No one is saying Horse will be no good, or that he'll be a Roos Clone, just that it would be nice to see the club take a more open approach to finding the right person to take this club we all love to its next premiership. By all rights that person might very well be Longmire, he might prove an outstanding coach, who knows? But at least show the supporters you take the appointment seriously by opening the doors to people who believe they can take on the job and listening to what they have to say.
Longmire's credentials are probably as good as anybody out there's, i understand that. However, i can also understand that perhaps the fact he has been with us so long may not neccesarily be a positive. We'll find out soon enough anway, and i hope I'm on here in a years time singing the praises of Horse as a visionary and bold risk taker. We'll see

interesting example considering that St Kilda didnt go through a proper process when appointing ross lyon. From memory they didnt interview him in the initial stages then just pulled him out of left field and gave him a job without going through an extensive process. Quite different from the way Richmond appointed Damien Hardwick but just as successful

[Melbourne_Blood]

I wasn't aware of that, i thought he was just not even considered a chance compared to the other candidates but blew the panel away with his presentation to them and subsequently blew all the other candidates out of the water

[Mr Magoo]

I dont agree with the "throw it open to the field approach". If Horse has shown all of the right credentials to become a senior coach , has the necessary experience and has the support of those around him then he should be appointed. Many successful companies do this in promoting executives and it is usually quite successful . It shouldnt be left to a decision made on the basis of who does the best presentation at an interview or who has a better reputation.