Rd 3 vs Western Bulldogs @ Marvel - Pre-Game Thread

[i'm-uninformed2]

Paps will be out again, and JMac is touch and go

Swans goalsneak Tom Papley still sidelined, speedster Justin McInerney racing the clock

[bloodspirit]

I'm not sure I agree about Ladhams competing for McLean's spot. Ladhams would possibly be more like McDonald than McLean in that he is relatively mobile but not a noted contested marker.

I'm not expecting Papley to be back this week. I seem to remember they said 6-8 weeks. And these things can often turn out to be longer.... as we well know.

I get the logic of Buddy not flying to Perth but they won't necessarily want him to have a 16 day gap between games. And he may actually prefer to travel to Perth to be able to see family (or not, given they have little ones at home).

[Blood Relative]

I'd play it safe with both Jmac and Paps. Besides are any changes necessary to that side on Friday night?

Bulldogs might be more mobile and quicker than cats, so possibly McLean or McDonald make way for Fox, C.O.R. or Clarke??

An R.G.O. for Buddy is worth considering too.

[bloodspirit]

I'd play it safe with both Jmac and Paps. Besides are any changes necessary to that side on Friday night?

Bulldogs might be more mobile and quicker than cats, so possibly McLean or McDonald make way for Fox, C.O.R. or Clarke??

An R.G.O. for Buddy is worth considering too.

Apart from Papley and McInerney, next cab off the rank has to be Sheldrick. He really justified his selection R1 and I would love to see more of him. Otherwise, if we needed to bring in a tall, then I would consider Amartey or, more likely, Ladhams.

[Aprilbr]

Paps will be out again, and JMac is touch and go

Swans goalsneak Tom Papley still sidelined, speedster Justin McInerney racing the clock

Thanks for the update. Much appreciated! Minimal changes this week then.

[Bay View]

No change to the 22 I reckon. Roberts to debut as sub. He was terrific against Footscray on Friday....Sheldrick to have a run in the reserves.

[Meg]

No change to the 22 I reckon. Roberts to debut as sub. He was terrific against Footscray on Friday....Sheldrick to have a run in the reserves.

Horrible way to debut sitting on the bench hoping for an injury. Let Roberts play reserves until there is a spot for him to move straight into the senior team.

[Roadrunner]

No need to take any risks with JMac and it seems Paps may need another week. So if there are no other issues, we may as well leave the team unchanged. Wicks had a better game and if he improves his kicking it will help him to keep his spot- otherwise he should make way when Paps returns.

[O'Reilly Boy]

No need to take any risks with JMac and it seems Paps may need another week. So if there are no other issues, we may as well leave the team unchanged. Wicks had a better game and if he improves his kicking it will help him to keep his spot- otherwise he should make way when Paps returns.

Not sure that I like Paps for Wicks. Very different roles. Wicks cops a bit, but he is playing as a pressure forward, and does lots that does not pick up a stat (even 1%ers). Paps is an attacking weapon and crumber, waiting for the ball to be brought to ground by the big targets (and of course weaving his magic in other ways). Wicks has to position himself in other parts of the arc to block exits, and then close quickly to force errors and shut down angles, pushing defenders deep into pockets. I know that not everyone agrees with this, and I'm bracing for impact.

Rather than thinking like-for-like, the calculation will be about the balance of the forward six: how many talls, how many small play-makers, how many pressure forwards.

A forward line of Franklin, McLean, Hayward, Gulden, Papley and Wicks? With Parker and Heeney rotating forward? Is Hayward under pressure for his place in the team?

[barracuda]

Not sure that I like Paps for Wicks. Very different roles. Wicks cops a bit, but he is playing as a pressure forward, and does lots that does not pick up a stat (even 1%ers). Paps is an attacking weapon and crumber, waiting for the ball to be brought to ground by the big targets (and of course weaving his magic in other ways). Wicks has to position himself in other parts of the arc to block exits, and then close quickly to force errors and shut down angles, pushing defenders deep into pockets. I know that not everyone agrees with this, and I'm bracing for impact.

Rather than thinking like-for-like, the calculation will be about the balance of the forward six: how many talls, how many small play-makers, how many pressure forwards.

A forward line of Franklin, McLean, Hayward, Gulden, Papley and Wicks? With Parker and Heeney rotating forward? Is Hayward under pressure for his place in the team?

I was at the last two games. He did an excellent job with a hard, physical tag on whitfield (GWS), who had to be moved forward to get any ball. Against Geelong he was equal highest for swans tackles with Heeney, third highest for swans pressure acts, ran third highest distance for the swans, third highest total distance covered at high speed for swans and third highest average speed for swans.

Watching him, he is the one gut running to cover the opposition running half backs and preventing the slingshot goals. It has to be the least glamorous role in footy, and requires incredible discipline to sacrifice yourself.

Last year the swans ran with only two forward talls. This year they are running with three. If they keep the taller structure then wicks will make way for papley, however someone will need to step up to play the defensive forward role (which papley would never do) or the swans will be very vulnerable on turnover.

[bloodspirit]

Thanks for those insightful posts, O'Reilly Boy and barracuda. Maybe it will be Papley for McDonald or McLean when the time comes. We might be running the extra tall because? Papley is unavailable.

[i'm-uninformed2]

I was at the last two games. He did an excellent job with a hard, physical tag on whitfield (GWS), who had to be moved forward to get any ball. Against Geelong he was equal highest for swans tackles with Heeney, third highest for swans pressure acts, ran third highest distance for the swans, third highest total distance covered at high speed for swans and third highest average speed for swans.

Watching him, he is the one gut running to cover the opposition running half backs and preventing the slingshot goals. It has to be the least glamorous role in footy, and requires incredible discipline to sacrifice yourself.

Last year the swans ran with only two forward talls. This year they are running with three. If they keep the taller structure then wicks will make way for papley, however someone will need to step up to play the defensive forward role (which papley would never do) or the swans will be very vulnerable on turnover.

Papley wouldn't do it, and nor should he.

With a three tall structure, what you correctly outline about Wicks' role and effort actually makes him even more valuable.

[SwanSand]

I was at the last two games. He did an excellent job with a hard, physical tag on whitfield (GWS), who had to be moved forward to get any ball. Against Geelong he was equal highest for swans tackles with Heeney, third highest for swans pressure acts, ran third highest distance for the swans, third highest total distance covered at high speed for swans and third highest average speed for swans.

Watching him, he is the one gut running to cover the opposition running half backs and preventing the slingshot goals. It has to be the least glamorous role in footy, and requires incredible discipline to sacrifice yourself.

Last year the swans ran with only two forward talls. This year they are running with three. If they keep the taller structure then wicks will make way for papley, however someone will need to step up to play the defensive forward role (which papley would never do) or the swans will be very vulnerable on turnover.

We are a better team than many give us credit for because of role players like Wicks. Completely agree with what you have to say. This is also the reason why Lewis Taylor is not getting a game as Wicks is doing heaps more than what Taylor can do without the ball. The only knock on Wicks is that by his own standards his disposals efficiency and kicking for goals is down this year compared to last. And he needs to get better at it for the teams sake.
I don’t think you can swap Wicks out. It probably would be Kennedy/Campbell/Stephens/Rowbottom who get squeezed out once Mcinerney and Papley are back. I think it would end up being - Campbell and Stephens will go to the bench. Or in NM game it may end up being Kennedy on the bench.

I know that some of you have mentioned about Hayward not going well. But is that role one of the most difficult roles to play. Unlike Wicks, with whom we are happy with pressure acts, we want the medium forward to do everything - kick goals, stop intercepts, provide pressure and also get ground balls and probably chop out in defence. I am not sure how he is going but the coaching seem to be ok with how he is going.

[Auntie.Gerald]

if players like Campbell keep moving on the same trajectory it will be impossible to keep them out of the 22.

Its one thing to have a good pressure forward but if your backline is so creative and rebounding so quick than it makes the forward pressure roles so much easier and less dependent on one pressure forward.

There is an opportunity cost for every role on the field.........but it is very possible in the near future we may rotate that pressure role with a bunch of mids rotating thru the forward line......ie 10mins at a time only via Parker, Warner, Ollie etc

i completely respect the advantages a team gains via minimising the impact of a dangerous HBF ....... but curtailing their impact does not have to be achieved via one player alone

[TheBloods]

We are a better team than many give us credit for because of role players like Wicks. Completely agree with what you have to say. This is also the reason why Lewis Taylor is not getting a game as Wicks is doing heaps more than what Taylor can do without the ball. The only knock on Wicks is that by his own standards his disposals efficiency and kicking for goals is down this year compared to last. And he needs to get better at it for the teams sake.
I don’t think you can swap Wicks out. It probably would be Kennedy/Campbell/Stephens/Rowbottom who get squeezed out once Mcinerney and Papley are back. I think it would end up being - Campbell and Stephens will go to the bench. Or in NM game it may end up being Kennedy on the bench.

I know that some of you have mentioned about Hayward not going well. But is that role one of the most difficult roles to play. Unlike Wicks, with whom we are happy with pressure acts, we want the medium forward to do everything - kick goals, stop intercepts, provide pressure and also get ground balls and probably chop out in defence. I am not sure how he is going but the coaching seem to be ok with how he is going.

Campbell and Stephens will play every week unless they need a rest . They are in our best 22 and are showing it now . Kennedy as well ,Horse would rather use him in different positions than drop him. He wont be dropped , end of .