Match thread: Swans v Suns.

[Roadrunner]

Short breaks and a rigid training regime could explain listlessness to some degree. Horse hinted at this. However with only 7 games into the season, one would think the lads should be able to handle it, even given their young bodies. I hope they spend a fair amount of time this week analysing how to improve all aspects of their game. And if some need to have a stint in the ressies then so be it. Spots need to be earned but I’m not advocating wholesale changes as this tends to destabilise the side.

Poor play certainly reflects on the players first and foremost but Horse and co also need to look at what they can do better- the whole club needs to pull up their collective socks and earn our respect once again. We know they can play attractive, winning football- time they start showing it to us again.

[KTigers]

Crowd was flat from the get go , reckon we all knew this could be coming . Is what it is

Mccartins were excellent

Yes, I wasn't at the Suns game but I've noticed the SCG crowd rarely gets very worked up these days (with the exception of
the Buddy 1000 goal). By contrast we are in New York currently and went to the first NHL playoff game between the NY Rangers
and the Pittsburgh Penguins at Madison Square Garden on Tuesday night here and the 18,000 Rangers fans in the arena went
completely nuts for more than four hours as the game went into three overtime periods. The atmosphere and fan stress level
towards the end of the game was off the charts.

[TheBloods]

Yes, I wasn't at the Suns game but I've noticed the SCG crowd rarely gets very worked up these days (with the exception of
the Buddy 1000 goal). By contrast we are in New York currently and went to the first NHL playoff game between the NY Rangers
and the Pittsburgh Penguins at Madison Square Garden on Tuesday night here and the 18,000 Rangers fans in the arena went
completely nuts for more than four hours as the game went into three overtime periods. The atmosphere and fan stress level
towards the end of the game was off the charts.

Even for Buddy's 1000 th it was only worked up because of the occasion . Once he kicked it and all the neutrals had gone , crowd was halved i reckon . Very disappointing , great moment for him but was also a great win for the team and the stadium was only half full when the final siren blew . My entire row was cleared out !

My theory- i am a Victorian boy at heart but moved up to Sydney way back when . SMFC will be on my headstone , mark my words . But a lot of these people aren 't like that. They picked footy up in their 30s , 40s or only watch it or go to games casually , they only know Lance and possibly Joey or Heeney . That is ok , im not judging , but they dont have that same passion that the lifelong or diehard fans have . It 's a shame as in games like this when we were uphill all day , thats when they need the crowd to get behind them . But i cant talk i suppose, i havent jumped out of my seat at the footy since 98

[Ruck'n'Roll]

Some observations on Nico's extremely worthwhile Some observations.

Gulden does seem much wasted on the wing, I'd much rather him further forward.

Sides have worked out to play us one on one. It's the main reason why I prediced a less successfull H&A season this year.

Tortoise McLean as you refer to him, is very good above his head, and has been very accurate goalkicking previously. But as you say he is poor below his knees.
I think his skill with ground ball is what you'd expect from someone that's 6'9" or 10" - which brings me to the other issue. His place as the teams 2nd ruck. He doesn't have enough raw height or the spring to compensate for it's lack in the ruck. Nor does he have the ability (at this time) to compensate by acting as an extra midfielder or wrecking ball. He may develop them, or maybe sufficient ruck craft* with time, but right now I have more hopes for a Ladhams/Amarty partnership in the future and would like to see the latetr get some more time in the 1st's.

Agreed the forwards aren't the big problem, but I saw a lot of them looking pretty static at set plays. I'd like to be seeing all of them on the move, not waving and pointing. If such lacitude runs throughout the team then no wonder we got touched up in the midfield.

Yes, thank goodness we recruited P.Mccartin. However I'd suggest depending on him in the mlong term will not be a risk free strategy. I'd like us to get in a genuine key defender prospect, and preferably one about 6'ft6" to help deal with this new generation of supertall forwards. The little heretic in my head wonders whether a 2nd round free agency pick for LLoyd mightn't get us one?

"Ollie was ok but I now think that we miss his run in the midfield. Put him on the wing and Gulden forward." Agreed too - although I'd disagree about your Campbell being wasted down back. I'd like Campbell to take on a Malceski/McVeigh role. He and Blakey should be our primary outlets from the back half in our next premiership team.

Which brings me to

Lloyd should never take the kick outs. Blakey and Campbell can reach the centre with a bullet. I think teams allow Lloyd to kick the short one to the back pocket where we get locked in.

I'm puzzled as to why he takes he kick ins, it seems more on here are coming to recognise the limitations of his kicking, so why is it still happening?
The preassure of taking the kick in's can sometimes get to some players, maybe this phenomena is in effect?
Other than that, presumably the coaches see something many of us are missing, it must be something, because you don't win 2 B&F's unless you have a hugely compensatory upside.

[Ruck'n'Roll]

Such a shame by the sound of it Stevo. I’m kind of glad I didn’t watch as I would be awfully upset with an insipid display.
Let’s hope the lads take this to heart and not let it happen again. Maybe the 2012 team could have played instead?

It was interesting to see the 2012 teams reaction to the game, they just don't seem all that into it. I remember observing the same unresponsiveness during the 2005 teams 10 year reunion game - And yes both were horrid losses but the preiership team players seem to behave more like the stiffs that inhabit the corporate boxes than fans.
Some of these guys literally blead for their team during their playing days, but 10 years later they don't even cheer. Have they forgotten the opening line of the team song, d they feel inhibited or does plaing the game at that level somehow disable the fan within?

I'd love to hear others thouhts

[Ludwig]

Yes, I wasn't at the Suns game but I've noticed the SCG crowd rarely gets very worked up these days (with the exception of
the Buddy 1000 goal). By contrast we are in New York currently and went to the first NHL playoff game between the NY Rangers
and the Pittsburgh Penguins at Madison Square Garden on Tuesday night here and the 18,000 Rangers fans in the arena went
completely nuts for more than four hours as the game went into three overtime periods. The atmosphere and fan stress level
towards the end of the game was off the charts.

I had season tickets to the Rangers games when I lived in New York. Ice Hockey is really enjoyable watching live. Hockey fans are nuts. It was truly dangerous being an opposition team supporter at the MCG for hockey games, which was different from what I experienced in other American sports. There were always fights at the games. Things would go on in the stands that caught the attention of the players and distracted them from the game, because there would be loud booing or cheering that had nothing to do with what was happening on the ice.

I remember my friend turning to me during one game saying: "This is not a place for women and children."

[Ludwig]

Interesting that horse was questioning their training approach with six day breaks in the press conference. Not too put their effort all on that but it’s concerning that the club hasn’t changed their approach at all? We have a history of losing to lesser teams after the short breaks.

The thing Longmire hates the hear the most in life is "Why didn't you listen to Ludwig?" He's going to be very cranky this week.

[TheBloods]

It was interesting to see the 2012 teams reaction to the game, they just don't seem all that into it. I remember observing the same unresponsiveness during the 2005 teams 10 year reunion game - And yes both were horrid losses but the preiership team players seem to behave more like the stiffs that inhabit the corporate boxes than fans.
Some of these guys literally blead for their team during their playing days, but 10 years later they don't even cheer. Have they forgotten the opening line of the team song, d they feel inhibited or does plaing the game at that level somehow disable the fan within?

I'd love to hear others thouhts

They are human beings with lives . When they play footy as a career the swans are top 3 most important things to them along with partners and parents . When its over and you work in a different profession , the swans still matter to them but gets knocked down to about 6th or 7th most important , behind their partners , kids , parents, new jobs, mates , and new hobbies they picked up in retirement .

Some of them also cant cheer for us because they are still involved at other clubs . McGlynn and Hannebery are at St kilda , Mumford at GWS , Etc.

[giant]

They are human beings with lives . When they play footy as a career the swans are top 3 most important things to them along with partners and parents . When its over and you work in a different profession , the swans still matter to them but gets knocked down to about 6th or 7th most important , behind their partners , kids , parents, new jobs, mates , and new hobbies they picked up in retirement .

Some of them also cant cheer for us because they are still involved at other clubs . McGlynn and Hannebery are at St kilda , Mumford at GWS , Etc.

All reasonable points - looking at the Insta posts of 2012 heroes, the overriding theme seemed to be about how good it was to catch up with mates, not how great it was to be back watching the team play.

I also thought the acknowledgment was pretty light on - ragtag lap of honour 20 mins before the game that was destined to have our smallest crowd all year. Seemed a strange choice.

- - - Updated - - -

Have to agree. Today seemed to be a reality check didn't it? Truth is, we haven't been playing well for the past month imo. There were times today that I wished we had those two back.

In brighter news, my Missus was out and I gave myself license to let every single expletive known to humanity rip at the top of my voice. When I heard the front door open I quickly composed myself. She walked back in during the fourth quarter after a stint at the shops and asked how we were going. My reply was not too good in a surprisingly demure voice.

Side note: she always thinks I get way too invested to the point where a loss like today affects my mood for the weekend.

Second side note: she's right. As if that's debatable!

You'd think I'd feel better after some swearing therapy, but felt flat at our lack of fight and poor skill execution. I'm lowering my expectations for the year after that performance and think if we scrape into the finals, we'll be fortunate. Only the boys' actions on the field now can change that. Let's see if they respond next week.

This could be an extract from my memoirs. Thanks for sharing.

[Agent 86]

So, for the past month, I think we look like a side that was near the bottom of the ladder two years ago, have started a rise but are still prone to flat spots and inconsistencies.

A few of the young guys looked a bit cooked today. Gulden was given a lesson by Ellis today, it was the first time I’d say Campbell had been beaten this year, McInerney was ok but will need to get used to being tagged and McDonald still flashes in and out of games.

As for our field kicking, the lack of synchronicity with the intended target was way off - even amongst our better kicks. How much that was on the head of the kicker or the target not reading the cue of the kicker, hard to tell off the television. But we need to sort it out pronto as it has been a consistent issue.

I love JMac, but he was a turnstile on a number of occasions. Wasn’t alone, I’m truth, but must compete harder on the defensive side.

The lack of energy was a real downer as was the countless kicks to the non-red jumpers. I can’t remember a game with this many turnovers from poor kicks.

The last few weeks we’ve been smashed in and around the contest - and teams have worked out this is how to beat us on the SCG. Basically, turn it into a game of rugby.

Regardless, wouldn’t have mattered where we played if this is the intensity we bring to the game. A better team would have beaten us by 20 goals.

[Bexl]

Well no matter how pathetic we were in this last match next game we're playing a team we always seem to have close games with lately who just had a 8 goal was last quarter. somebody's got to lift.

[Kafka's Ghost]

Some observations on Nico's extremely worthwhile Some observations.

Gulden does seem much wasted on the wing, I'd much rather him further forward.

Sides have worked out to play us one on one. It's the main reason why I prediced a less successfull H&A season this year.

Tortoise McLean as you refer to him, is very good above his head, and has been very accurate goalkicking previously. But as you say he is poor below his knees.
I think his skill with ground ball is what you'd expect from someone that's 6'9" or 10" - which brings me to the other issue. His place as the teams 2nd ruck. He doesn't have enough raw height or the spring to compensate for it's lack in the ruck. Nor does he have the ability (at this time) to compensate by acting as an extra midfielder or wrecking ball. He may develop them, or maybe sufficient ruck craft* with time, but right now I have more hopes for a Ladhams/Amarty partnership in the future and would like to see the latetr get some more time in the 1st's.

Agreed the forwards aren't the big problem, but I saw a lot of them looking pretty static at set plays. I'd like to be seeing all of them on the move, not waving and pointing. If such lacitude runs throughout the team then no wonder we got touched up in the midfield.

Yes, thank goodness we recruited P.Mccartin. However I'd suggest depending on him in the mlong term will not be a risk free strategy. I'd like us to get in a genuine key defender prospect, and preferably one about 6'ft6" to help deal with this new generation of supertall forwards. The little heretic in my head wonders whether a 2nd round free agency pick for LLoyd mightn't get us one?

"Ollie was ok but I now think that we miss his run in the midfield. Put him on the wing and Gulden forward." Agreed too - although I'd disagree about your Campbell being wasted down back. I'd like Campbell to take on a Malceski/McVeigh role. He and Blakey should be our primary outlets from the back half in our next premiership team.

Which brings me to

I'm puzzled as to why he takes he kick ins, it seems more on here are coming to recognise the limitations of his kicking, so why is it still happening?
The preassure of taking the kick in's can sometimes get to some players, maybe this phenomena is in effect?
Other than that, presumably the coaches see something many of us are missing, it must be something, because you don't win 2 B&F's unless you have a hugely compensatory upside.

Both years he won the B&F we were smashed by injury. Whilst it allowed us to fast-track development in youth, it also meant quite a number of players were not taking votes from a consistent, albeit not overly brilliant, player like Lloyd.
Regarding crowds “not so engaged”, it’s hard to be engaged when you’ve got your fingers in your ears. As for crowd numbers themselves, perhaps just because our msm and pollies don’t want to talk about it, the >100,000 cases and >100 deaths per week of Covid might be affecting peoples’ decision to attend the footy. We haven’t been since the Geelong game and are not likely to attend again given these issues.


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[TheBloods]

Did anyone see RB to Lance , again

Has to be a bet on surely

[royboy42]

People are catastrophizing.

Pull yourselves together.

Record is 5-3. Only 7 more wins to play finals.

The world has not caved in.

The boys will regather themselves this week and focus positively ahead.

Didn't I see you say that you hadn't seen the game?
You dont hold back with 'knowlegable' comments for someone who doesnt watch every game.
If that's right, it might be better to hold back and let those who do have their say?

[giant]

I love JMac, but he was a turnstile on a number of occasions. Wasn’t alone, I’m truth, but must compete harder on the defensive side.

The lack of energy was a real downer as was the countless kicks to the non-red jumpers. I can’t remember a game with this many turnovers from poor kicks.

The last few weeks we’ve been smashed in and around the contest - and teams have worked out this is how to beat us on the SCG. Basically, turn it into a game of rugby.

Regardless, wouldn’t have mattered where we played if this is the intensity we bring to the game. A better team would have beaten us by 20 goals.

Nice work Max. I share your love for JMac and our despair at his game yesterday. IU2 blamed Guilden for letting Ellis off the leash but at least early it was JMac who gave him way too much space - Ellis had 7 touches in a blink of an eye. Mind you, Fiorina was doing much the same on the other wing.

The problem seems to be that even the worst sides seem to think they're a chance against us (and they are) and are clearly setting themselves as they see a possible scalp. So we have these teams like North and GC, incapable of matching it with much of the competition, knowing that if they make it a scrap, they may well catch us on the hop. The only way to counter it is to go just as hard and make sure you make them pay when they do make the inevitable skill errors.