Melbourne-based fans deserved better

[treespirit]

Originally posted by hemsleys
I don't mind where the games are played as long as we have the opportunity to see them, without having to subscribe to bloody Foxtel.

Something on which we can all agree!!

[BAM_BAM]

I agree with Lizz, and yes I expect them to mentally go into a game perpared to win at all costs, every time

Do you think a surgen goes into his job not 100% prepared and expecting to fail?

Regardless of what profession you belong to, you should commit yourself 100%, this may not always end up with the results you want, but if you went down swinging then that should be enough.

As I originally said, I thought it was a bad choice of words, I have no Sydney v Melbourne problem. It was Melbourne afterall who gave us our team and our game. Would I feel the same as you in the same circumstance (ie having my team relocated), the answer is yes, but my view that I expect 100% effort each time would not change, no matter where they play.

[treespirit]

On the games in Melbourne issue -

I have NEVER commented on the number of games in Melbourne before, because I don't hold the club responsible. Even in this thread, the gripe, apart from the performance, is that it took until R6 for them to get here. Scheduling is an AFL issue and they are ripping our club off.

I would have no gripe with 5 games in Melbourne, as long as none were at Optus or the cattery. When we are getting so few, we should not have to put up with these inferior, less accessible grounds.

[treespirit]

On the performance issue -

As I said previously, I DO believe that teams can put in a 'special' effort.

So, if the Footy Fairy (Billy Brownless?) came to me and said, "I will guarantee that, for any three home and away games you choose, your team will put in a very special effort", I would choose -
1. First home game
2. First Melbourne game at the 'G or Docklands
3. split round 'blockbuster' v wobbles at Homebush

[JF_Bay22_SCG]

Originally posted by treespirit
Do you three choose to take EVERY comment from Melbourne as anti-Sydney?

I stick by my words. For the first game in Melbourne they should have put in a special effort. Of course Sydney based fans deserve better than that, and, thankfully for you, you will usually get it within a week or 2 after a poor performance.

True mate. I know what you are saying in writing this, as I tried very hard to try and put myself in the shoes of the Melbourne-based Swans supporters I sat with in the Cheer Squad on Saturday. It is simply hard to fathom the emotions involved if you are not directly involved; imagine having a footy season start in April but not being able to have a slice of the proverbial cake until a month after everyone else. The sentiments I heard from most I spoke to was a mixture of resentment, frustration and overall lethargy.

Just like the atmosphere at the Dockers match at the SCG was kinda flat, being the first match of the year, the mood in the Cheer Squad was kinda the same on Saturday. Many in the Cheer Squad had not seen a match since the Dees match last August; the 'rustiness' amongst many was plain to see. It was generally as dead as a dodo and would have been worse had the ever-cheerful types from up north (and Simon from Hobart!!!!) tried to liven up proceedings just a tad.

However Tree, you have to see things from the perspective of the players. Do you honestly think they had the Victorian-based supporters in their thoughts in the lead up to the match? Many of the ex-pat Vic players might have been thinking, "Gee it is a long time since I saw my family." I myself have mused that it seemed like ages since I was last in Melbourne,watching the footy and savouring pizza (and not necessarily in that order either! ) But the players would most probably just have been thinking that they were going to be travelling to a big away match that just happened to be in Melbourne.

I can understand both people's vantage points, because I pretty much am a supporter of the team in both states. But the Sydneysider in me did react to what many of us (perhaps hastily) constrewed that the Melbourne-based supporters were in some way more deserving of a win against Essendon as we were against Melbourne etc etc.

But I know exactly where you are coming from TS. Sydneysiders, put yourselves in the shoes of our Melbourne fans for 30 seconds. And Imagine what it is like to have to wait until May to dust off your coat, get your scarf out of the cupboard, and even pick up your red membership cap!!! Whilst we've had them for well over a month up here. These are some of the emotions I think TreeSpirit is trying to share with us.

JF

[Nico]

Originally posted by treespirit
Do you three choose to take EVERY comment from Melbourne as anti-Sydney?

I stick by my words. For the first game in Melbourne they should have put in a special effort. Of course Sydney based fans deserve better than that, and, thankfully for you, you will usually get it within a week or 2 after a poor performance.

They played dumb, unaccountable footy for the first game in Melbourne for more than 6 MONTHS, not 1 week. Yes, we all deserved better, but this should have been treated as more important than a 'normal' game. Who would be inspired to buy a membership after that? Let alone the effect on our ladder position, which should have been enough motivation.

Is Tony Morwood a selector? Of course not. Why would you make such an insulting comment? He is the club's man in Melbourne so I see him as representing the Melbourne members to the club, so I expect him to take our feelings to the players and the club.

I am with you Treespirit. I can't see how anyone could take your comments as derogatory towards Sydney. It is funny isn't it that we in Melbourne always seem to be on the wrong end of the stick from interstaters. Sydney people love to call us Mexicans and want to get off on always trying to show they are superior to Melbournians in all aspects of life - who cares who is better than the next.

Croweaters just hate us because we are simply Victorian, for whatever reasons, who knows. And WA is not far behind them.

When it comes to the topic of footy, you rarely hear a Victorian bagging an intertstate side just because they are from interstate. We just love talking footy down here. As a matter of fact Melbournians tend to have a soft spot for the Swans, Eddie excluded. We embrace the national comp because it is our national game that all states can share in.

So lets not let this interstate rivalry mar this site. For goodness sake we are all Swans supporters, all Aussies and all love our game.

And I agree we played dumb unaccountable footy. What happened to our running in numbers and making a contest.

Hopefully some of you Sydney-siders can stop being so sensitive.

[treespirit]

Thanks JF for your thoughtful comments.

Originally posted by JF_Bay22_SCG
However Tree, you have to see things from the perspective of the players. Do you honestly think they had the Victorian-based supporters in their thoughts in the lead up to the match?

My point exactly! I'm sure they did not, but I think they should have.

[lescygnes]

why dont you all put yourself in Cher's shoes. Only ONE game where she lives all year, if that!

and none for me up here!! he he he

Cheers
John

ps-i'll give it a month before this Syd v Melb thing starts up again on here......

[Bart]

Originally posted by treespirit
On the performance issue -

As I said previously, I DO believe that teams can put in a 'special' effort.

So, if the Footy Fairy (Billy Brownless?) came to me and said, "I will guarantee that, for any three home and away games you choose, your team will put in a very special effort", I would choose -
1. First home game
2. First Melbourne game at the 'G or Docklands
3. split round 'blockbuster' v wobbles at Homebush

If I felt that this was true for a second and that this is how the players were being mentally prepared for a game then I'd give it all away.

It is ridiculous to suggest that the players should put in any different level of effort for this weekend's crucial match against Richmond compared to last weeks match.

I can't believe some of you subscribe to this nonsense.

[ScottH]

Agree fully. If players don't go out to every game with the attitude that they <S> can </S> will win this game they should hang up there boots now.

Steve Waugh would hang his head in shame at this type of attitude. He never quit and would not let his team quit, no matter what level.

I heard a story when his local team had there backs to the wall in a game. He told them "if anyone thinks that we can't win, don't bother coming out of the change rooms". Surprisingly they won.

I think AFL players at that level should be out there to give 110% every game, or should be just players.

[treespirit]

Originally posted by hemsleys
I heard a story when his local team had there backs to the wall in a game. He told them "if anyone thinks that we can't win, don't bother coming out of the change rooms". Surprisingly they won.

Which proves my point. They made the extra mental effort, because they had a reason to give them extra focus.

This is all about the mind. I don't suggest that the physical effort or preparation isn't the same, I am saying that it is possible to, in fact inevitable that, different games are treated differently by players in their minds.

[treespirit]

Originally posted by Bart
If I felt that this was true for a second and that this is how the players were being mentally prepared for a game then I'd give it all away.

Give it away then, because you'll be shocked to learn that the players are humans, not robots.

We hear coaches talk about using past performances as part of mental preparation. Motivational speakers are used. Different things are tried when teams are in a slump. Players talk about certain games being particularly important to them or the team. Its part of the game.

I never suggested that teams are prepared to fail, but that sometimes they are more than normally focussed on success.

[Bart]

Originally posted by treespirit
Which proves my point. They made the extra mental effort, because they had a reason to give them extra focus.

This is all about the mind. I don't suggest that the physical effort or preparation isn't the same, I am saying that it is possible to, in fact inevitable that, different games are treated differently by players in their minds.

Treespirit you are clutching at straws here. Of course individual's mental preparation is going to differ from match to match, as is their physical condition.

What you are saying is that the entire team should pick and choose which matches to be really up for, particularly the first match in Melbourne. This of course is nonsense.

[Old Royboy]

Originally posted by Bart
Of course individual's mental preparation is going to differ from match to match, as is their physical condition.

I believe our mental state is why we have underperformed this year (not just last week) so far. Look at our imm past. Last year, no expectation, new coach and we went for it. This year pressure of expectation, coach and players are feeling it, and it shows. The best coaches are those who can unlock their players minds and have them at their mental peak when it counts. Roosy is finding that it is no easy gig, but I have confidence that he will find the answers. He is still a rookie coach, and a bloody smart one at that.

[Bart]

Originally posted by Old Royboy
I believe our mental state is why we have underperformed this year (not just last week) so far. Look at our imm past. Last year, no expectation, new coach and we went for it. This year pressure of expectation, coach and players are feeling it, and it shows. The best coaches are those who can unlock their players minds and have them at their mental peak when it counts. Roosy is finding that it is no easy gig, but I have confidence that he will find the answers. He is still a rookie coach, and a bloody smart one at that.

Agree. Someone mentioned earlier that we seem to play up or down to the perceived level of the opposition. And the mental side of coaching must be tougher than the physical side. I believe Leigh Matthews is the master at this and the Lions last quarter against us in the prelim final is probably an example of side that was mentally tough enough.