2017 Player & Coach Comings and Goings - Who's Going Where?

[saviour01]

Dylan Roos apparently locked to play for St George 10 home games with flights covered to fly from Melbourne, could be wrong but this was what was mentioned

You shouldn't be listening to swans/hayres on this.

[saviour01]

Bomber if you have brought in 8 interstate walk up starts for your prems and have got back 3 from uni where will the so called kids fit in? The only balancing here is the cheque book imo as 5 of the 8 are costing you 40k +.

[Mug Punter]

Dylan Roos apparently locked to play for St George 10 home games with flights covered to fly from Melbourne, could be wrong but this was what was mentioned

Is he that good? I know he played in the U18 championships in some fair company but I'm not aware of him playing last season. Fly in - Fly Out players usually need to be very very good for the situation to work.

[Mug Punter]

I guess the other question that goes with all this is, is Premier Division, and Sydney AFL more broadly, a stronger comp than say 10 years ago?

We have had about 7 years of Swans and GWS Academy feeding players in to the comp, there has been a lot learnt in terms of better coaching techniques, 6 years of NEAFL, and player development and conditioning knowledge improves continually.

So are the players better? Are the coaches better? Is there more depth? Is The whole competition in Sydney stronger?

An important discussion topic I would have thought.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

An interesting discussion point.

My personal view is that the game is in the best shape it has ever been in Sydney and that this is largely due to the Academy system and thus indirectly due to the introduction of GWS. I still have my doubts about their longevity in a brutal sporting market, and I think most of the spinoff benefits at grassroots level have flown the Swans' way but only time will tell re them.

Having said that I think the SFL (i.e. Prem Div) is weaker than it was 10 years ago. And the reason for this is simply that 40 or so of the best players in Sydney are in NEAFL programs at Sydney Uni or as toppies at the Swans/GWS when they would be playing for their local sides. I know some NEAFL players at the Students would not be here at all in an SFL team (e.g. Xav would have gone home) but on the whole I think that argument holds.

That's not a criticism of the NEAFL or Sydney Uni because I actually think that having that third elite player pathway at Sydney Uni, who run a college like program, is very important long term. And I think in time Sydney Uni NEAFL will effectively become a Sydney rep team who are very very competitive against AFL programs because let's be honest here they are the only organisation that can fund the operation required to compete at that level. It just means that at this point in time it dilutes the SFL of it's elite level talent.

But in time, and I mean in 5 years, as the trickle of talent from the academies becomes surge, I expect that the SFL will increase quite quickly to a point where it is at its strongest ever standard.

I also think that this will reward strongly clubs with strong juniors like never before and punish those that don't.

Winners
Pennant Hills (Pennant Hills, Westbrook)
Baulko (once they get their house in order, traditionally a strong junior area)
North Shore (St Ives, Willoughby, Mosman plus kids coming through the private school system now they have a comp)
Manly (very strong juniors at Manly, Forest and Pittwater plus new clubs at Balgowlah and Wakehurst)
Easts (Maroubra and Easts are strong junior clubs plus kids coming through the private school system now they have a comp)
St George (traditionally very strong junior base)
Sydney Uni (Inner City junior clubs Newtown and Moore Park continue to grow plus kids coming through the private school system now they have a comp)

Losers or at Risk
UTS - no juniors, suspect their long term future is as a powerhouse of the lower divisions
Wests - small number of clubs and terrible demographics in the inner west (increasingly Asian and Arabic)
Balmain - Small junior base at this stage

As for all the western Sydney teams (Parramatta, Penrith, Hawkesbury, Camden, Liverpool, Campbelltown) I'd say they are all risk of becoming second class AFL areas in Sydney as the Swans Academy goes from strength to strength unless the GWS equivalents also start pulling their weight at a grassroots level in Sydney.

Other obvious areas of growth and improvement are the women's game (virtually non existent 10 years ago) and the quality of coaching.

The two other major areas, umpiring and administration, my impression is that any improvement is marginal.

[Mug Punter]

I stand corrected then! My information was from a couple of parents of 17 year old academy players who didn't get a run. It would not be fair to name them of course! My comments were more about the young players not the true 18/19 year olds, and you are right about those.

My main point was to balance up the debate from Manly's perspective, and thanks for acknowledging that.

Cheers

You guys are going great guns from a junior perspective these days. I believe you have a new team at Balgowlah because you had to stop turning kids away at Manly Bombers.

Plus you've got a new club at Wakehurst along with the old timers at Pittwater and Forest. Are there any more new clubs in the offing? Any chance of getting any of the local private schools like St Augustines getting an AFL program?

One thing that does seem crazy is that parents still have to drive such distances for games. Surely you could go back to the old North Shore Many JAFA with the following teams

* Manly
* Pittwater
* Balgowlah
* Wakehurst
* Mosman
* Forest
* Lane Cove
* Willoughby
* St Ives
* Hornsby/Berowra

[bomber.]

Bomber if you have brought in 8 interstate walk up starts for your prems and have got back 3 from uni where will the so called kids fit in? The only balancing here is the cheque book imo as 5 of the 8 are costing you 40k +.

That's very funny!! Do I detect a deflection from the Dylan Roos chat!!

Thanks for your concern, but the kids will fit in fine, when not at the Swans or Sydney Uni and 8 walk up starts - really?

I do agree with you on one thing though - you shouldn't believe everything you hear, especially some of the stuff you're hearing.

I'm new to this site, but do we make a habit of repeating stuff that's absolutely untrue (eg 5 of 8 are costing you 40k +)?

The truth is that players are coming because the club is a lot better place to be at than it was. Nothing to do with $$$$.

[justabaraker]

Forget about '2017 player and coach comings and goings - who's going where ?"..................

........What's happened to our very own Norris Lurker - "the people's choice ?" Norris, are you to be replaced by five RWO online contributors?
There is such vast expertise at our little table of knowledge here but nothing could ever replace you, Norris - would it take a pay rise to keep you at our games with your trusty camera phone, notepad and two loyal assistants with pooch ?
Will it be put to the vote with an election and can we hand out how-to-vote cards for you ?

Could there be a few extra "bomber-bucks" thrown your way to keep you as our mentor ?

[saviour01]

That's very funny!! Do I detect a deflection from the Dylan Roos chat!!

Thanks for your concern, but the kids will fit in fine, when not at the Swans or Sydney Uni and 8 walk up starts - really?

I do agree with you on one thing though - you shouldn't believe everything you hear, especially some of the stuff you're hearing.

I'm new to this site, but do we make a habit of repeating stuff that's absolutely untrue (eg 5 of 8 are costing you 40k +)?

The truth is that players are coming because the club is a lot better place to be at than it was. Nothing to do with $$$$.

Is it untrue? The last mail I got out Camden way was obviously on the mark with no one able to say why they sacked a coach 6 weeks before a season (and a few months into a preseason after finishing first in 2015 and winning the flag in 2016).

8 interstate players because North Shore is better than it was? Nice.

[Giants]

Is it untrue? The last mail I got out Camden way was obviously on the mark with no one able to say why they sacked a coach 6 weeks before a season (and a few months into a preseason after finishing first in 2015 and winning the flag in 2016).

8 interstate players because North Shore is better than it was? Nice.

If Camdens ex Coach means so much to you why dont you reach out to Josh Leys (Club President) and ask him what his side of the story is. Ive always found him to be upfront and to the point. We are; rain permitting heading out there this weekend so i will ask a few questions for you as well Mudge.

[barracuda]

With 19's playing Prems I guess the overriding factor should the environment in which their going into and wether or not it will improve their football.

I am sure in many cases U/19's going into a Prems team because they are low on quality players and getting beaten most weeks is going to be a very different learning experience than playing in a winning, well structured team.

If I was an youngster looking for a taste of the big time I know a few games in the winning team is going to be better for my football than a season in a losing team.

Let's not forget that Manly finished 6th, with some of those 17 year olds being in the best players in games where Manly beat sides like North Shore and Penno. So your statement, if it relates to Manly, is not accurate.

[barracuda]

An interesting discussion point.

My personal view is that the game is in the best shape it has ever been in Sydney and that this is largely due to the Academy system and thus indirectly due to the introduction of GWS. I still have my doubts about their longevity in a brutal sporting market, and I think most of the spinoff benefits at grassroots level have flown the Swans' way but only time will tell re them.

Having said that I think the SFL (i.e. Prem Div) is weaker than it was 10 years ago. And the reason for this is simply that 40 or so of the best players in Sydney are in NEAFL programs at Sydney Uni or as toppies at the Swans/GWS when they would be playing for their local sides. I know some NEAFL players at the Students would not be here at all in an SFL team (e.g. Xav would have gone home) but on the whole I think that argument holds.

That's not a criticism of the NEAFL or Sydney Uni because I actually think that having that third elite player pathway at Sydney Uni, who run a college like program, is very important long term. And I think in time Sydney Uni NEAFL will effectively become a Sydney rep team who are very very competitive against AFL programs because let's be honest here they are the only organisation that can fund the operation required to compete at that level. It just means that at this point in time it dilutes the SFL of it's elite level talent.

But in time, and I mean in 5 years, as the trickle of talent from the academies becomes surge, I expect that the SFL will increase quite quickly to a point where it is at its strongest ever standard.

I also think that this will reward strongly clubs with strong juniors like never before and punish those that don't.

Winners
Pennant Hills (Pennant Hills, Westbrook)
Baulko (once they get their house in order, traditionally a strong junior area)
North Shore (St Ives, Willoughby, Mosman plus kids coming through the private school system now they have a comp)
Manly (very strong juniors at Manly, Forest and Pittwater plus new clubs at Balgowlah and Wakehurst)
Easts (Maroubra and Easts are strong junior clubs plus kids coming through the private school system now they have a comp)
St George (traditionally very strong junior base)
Sydney Uni (Inner City junior clubs Newtown and Moore Park continue to grow plus kids coming through the private school system now they have a comp)

Losers or at Risk
UTS - no juniors, suspect their long term future is as a powerhouse of the lower divisions
Wests - small number of clubs and terrible demographics in the inner west (increasingly Asian and Arabic)
Balmain - Small junior base at this stage

As for all the western Sydney teams (Parramatta, Penrith, Hawkesbury, Camden, Liverpool, Campbelltown) I'd say they are all risk of becoming second class AFL areas in Sydney as the Swans Academy goes from strength to strength unless the GWS equivalents also start pulling their weight at a grassroots level in Sydney.

Other obvious areas of growth and improvement are the women's game (virtually non existent 10 years ago) and the quality of coaching.

The two other major areas, umpiring and administration, my impression is that any improvement is marginal.

Excellent summary Mug Punter. Now that the GWS has apparently lost the Murray as part of their zone perhaps they will put more effort into Sydney. It is a shame that their current under 18 squad has only 4 out of 40 from sydney. This is a complete contrast to the swans who have diligently worked to foster sydney talent, and also integrate coaches from most of the sydney clubs. In two weeks the swans under 18s square off against GWS for the first time in the Div 2 national championships. It will be Sydney vs Riverina with the swans definite underdogs. We couldn't be more proud of the effort and preparation Chris Smith and Jarrod Crouch have put into the team and they are doing ok. (they accounted for north shore prems by about 10 goals last weekend). Nearly every player in the squad is signed up with one of the prems clubs (including kids from out of sydney like jack hardman) so the swans academy is basically an under 18s sydney side.

- - - Updated - - -

You guys are going great guns from a junior perspective these days. I believe you have a new team at Balgowlah because you had to stop turning kids away at Manly Bombers.

Plus you've got a new club at Wakehurst along with the old timers at Pittwater and Forest. Are there any more new clubs in the offing? Any chance of getting any of the local private schools like St Augustines getting an AFL program?

One thing that does seem crazy is that parents still have to drive such distances for games. Surely you could go back to the old North Shore Many JAFA with the following teams

* Manly
* Pittwater
* Balgowlah
* Wakehurst
* Mosman
* Forest
* Lane Cove
* Willoughby
* St Ives
* Hornsby/Berowra

St Augustines is one of the most anti afl schools around. Even Shore school has now embraced AFL. It is getting so popular their that they will field two senior sides this year.

[bomber.]

Is it untrue? The last mail I got out Camden way was obviously on the mark with no one able to say why they sacked a coach 6 weeks before a season (and a few months into a preseason after finishing first in 2015 and winning the flag in 2016).

8 interstate players because North Shore is better than it was? Nice.

Is it untrue - yep!!

Sorry if I'm undermining your rally cry for round 1, but saying something that's untrue over and over doesn't make it true!! It's just boring.

Something else to agree with Barra on, Manly will be competitive. Plenty of good players there and a different voice to freshen them up. I reckon only 2 teams solid for prems top five, ECE and St G, with everyone else having a shot at the other 3 spots.

Makes it interesting!!

[5yearplan]

Sydney Uni will be interesting with the massive NEAFL list they have at their disposal, how many will go back to clubs? Or will they be strongly encouraged to play for Sydney Uni Prems

[bomber.]

Sydney Uni will be interesting with the massive NEAFL list they have at their disposal, how many will go back to clubs? Or will they be strongly encouraged to play for Sydney Uni Prems

Good point. Jarrod Irving was allocated to us last year, but didn't play and I see that other players that were allocated to other Sydney AFL clubs are still on the NEAFL list, so I wonder if the players get to choose the club they want to play at now, or are they are still allocated to the clubs they went to in the first place?

[barracuda]

Good point. Jarrod Irving was allocated to us last year, but didn't play and I see that other players that were allocated to other Sydney AFL clubs are still on the NEAFL list, so I wonder if the players get to choose the club they want to play at now, or are they are still allocated to the clubs they went to in the first place?

I thought the fact that the ex swans academy guys were on the uni neafl rookie list meant they were still registered with their original club. That way they would be permitted to play for uni neafl on a week by week basis. I think there are about 6 North Shore players in this group who, if I am right, would still be North Shore. On the other hand James Brain from Manly is listed in the main squad which tends to say something else.

Does anyone have the answer to this?