Team selection: round 10 v Carlton

[MattW]

Yes, Sheldrick needs a run of games so we can assess where he’s at. No point bringing him in and out or even being a constant sub. Adams needs another week in the VFL and then maybe back afterwards as sub. If Amartey and Mills are ready to return:

Ins: Mills, Amartey, Ladhams.
Out: Paton, Hamling, Francis.

If either Amartey or Mills not ready, then Francis stays and someone from the two’s- any suggestions guys?

Enjoyed the conversation on the List Management thread, but moving it to a bespoke thread.

I think Sheldrick should get a run of games in the 22. We need dudes who can win contested ball and stick a tackle. He's looked good as sub, and I've appreciated him nailing some set shots. Reckon he needs a steady run of full games games to build confidence.

If Amartey is in for Hamling, we don't need Ladhams in too. Ok with Francis. Happy to go with the coaches re whether Mills starts in the firsts or Adams is ready to play as sub, either coming in for Paton.

[Roadrunner]

Enjoyed the conversation on the List Management thread, but moving it to a bespoke thread.

I think Sheldrick should get a run of games in the 22. We need dudes who can win contested ball and stick a tackle. He's looked good as sub, and I've appreciated him nailing some set shots. Reckon he needs a steady run of full games games to build confidence.

If Amartey is in for Hamling, we don't need Ladhams in too. Ok with Francis. Happy to go with the coaches re whether Mills starts in the firsts or Adams is ready to play as sub, either coming in for Paton.

The thing is, I think McLean needs to be left at CF where he can be quite effective. If he has to take turns in the ruck to. relieve Grundy, his forward work suffers- that’s why I’d bring in Ladhams. With due respect to Hamling I think Ladhams can bring more to the team.

What about Buller? Is he worth a try- if not now, when?

[UUaswan]

Amartey straight in, a game in the 2s isn't required when Hamling and Francis did nothing as fwds, if he can run play him and keep him deep.

If Mills can run play him too, who is keeping him out ? Most of the guys that are getting it arent using it anyway.

Ladhams is required against De Konning, Grundy won't be able to keep up. TDK looked like Jackson when the ball hit the ground.

Paton, Hamling, Francis.

Adams could as sub and drop Corey.

Could also see Hamling playing as a defender otherwise we are undersized. Maybe for Lloyd and put Bice on the Wing.

[Roadrunner]

Amartey straight in, a game in the 2s isn't required when Hamling and Francis did nothing as fwds, if he can run play him and keep him deep.

If Mills can run play him too, who is keeping him out ? Most of the guys that are getting it arent using it anyway.

Ladhams is required against De Konning, Grundy won't be able to keep up. TDK looked like Jackson when the ball hit the ground.

Paton, Hamling, Francis.

Adams could as sub and drop Corey.

Could also see Hamling playing as a defender otherwise we are undersized. Maybe for Lloyd and put Bice on the Wing.

Hate to say it but it maybe time to drop Lloyd- I’m afraid it seems his best is past him. Don’t think he’s done much this year. Agree using Bice on the wing instead.

[dejavoodoo44]

Enjoyed the conversation on the List Management thread, but moving it to a bespoke thread.

I think Sheldrick should get a run of games in the 22. We need dudes who can win contested ball and stick a tackle. He's looked good as sub, and I've appreciated him nailing some set shots. Reckon he needs a steady run of full games games to build confidence.

If Amartey is in for Hamling, we don't need Ladhams in too. Ok with Francis. Happy to go with the coaches re whether Mills starts in the firsts or Adams is ready to play as sub, either coming in for Paton.

Yes, I think Sheldrick deserves to be in the starting side. His form and disposal efficiency seems to have improved recently. I also think it would take some pressure off Heeney and Warner, who might be spending a bit too much time bashing away as inside mids.

If Amartey is fit, I'd definitely bring him in and probably move Hamling to defence and Paton back to the VFL. I'm less keen on Mills coming straight in. He's played limited game time over the last couple of years, and when he came back last season, he was pretty rusty. So, I'd prefer him to get a bit of touch back in the VFL. I also thought that Adams was just okay last week, so I'd prefer that he was also in the VFL squad.

[crackedactor 01]

Yes, I think Sheldrick deserves to be in the starting side. His form and disposal efficiency seems to have improved recently. I also think it would take some pressure off Heeney and Warner, who might be spending a bit too much time bashing away as inside mids.

If Amartey is fit, I'd definitely bring him in and probably move Hamling to defence and Paton back to the VFL. I'm less keen on Mills coming straight in. He's played limited game time over the last couple of years, and when he came back last season, he was pretty rusty. So, I'd prefer him to get a bit of touch back in the VFL. I also thought that Adams was just okay last week, so I'd prefer that he was also in the VFL squad.

I would not mind seeing Amartey in the firsts and Mills in VFL. Maybe have Ladhams as the sub this week as a back up for Amartey and Grundy.

[dejavoodoo44]

The thing is, I think McLean needs to be left at CF where he can be quite effective. If he has to take turns in the ruck to. relieve Grundy, his forward work suffers- that’s why I’d bring in Ladhams. With due respect to Hamling I think Ladhams can bring more to the team.

What about Buller? Is he worth a try- if not now, when?

I think the Buller of 2023, would be worth a try, but I think he's slowly regaining form and match fitness, after an injury interrupted preseason. Which might be a little harsh, because he's currently not getting good service from the midfielders. To me, he's looked better when roaming around the ground as a backup ruck.

[imuninformedtwo]

Part what I think should/ will happen.

Paton and one of Francis/Hamling out. The one that stays goes to defence. Ladhams and Amartey in. Grundy will need help in the ruck. Also gives us better marking targets against a good intercepting defence.

Gus starts.

Ollie out for Hanily. Ollie’s form has deserted him. We need a reasonable small forward and Hanily best option.

Corey Warner sub.

[Bay View]

I think Snell deserves a game this week. He did well in the reserves.

[liz]

I think Snell deserves a game this week. He did well in the reserves.

I'll be surprised if he gets a game yet. Cox was specifically asked about Snell and Edwards in his mid-week press conference last week. It wasn't great timing by the journalist who asked the question because Snell had missed the prior week through illness, while Edwards had come up sore after that game (and now seems to have joined our injured list for an unspecified period). Irrespective of these interruptions, Cox was unequivocal in his "not yet" response. In the case of Snell, he had an interrupted start to the season before his hiccup last week, so I imagine they'll want to give him plenty of time to build up his game before they think about exposing him at AFL level.

[liz]

Part what I think should/ will happen.

Paton and one of Francis/Hamling out. The one that stays goes to defence. Ladhams and Amartey in. Grundy will need help in the ruck. Also gives us better marking targets against a good intercepting defence.

Gus starts.

Ollie out for Hanily. Ollie’s form has deserted him. We need a reasonable small forward and Hanily best option.

Corey Warner sub.

Florent isn't in great form, but if you judge him against what Hanily has provided rather than against what we wish Florent were providing (and know he is capable of providing), I think you pick Florent every day. I don't think our VFL team is good enough (certainly not at the moment) for it to be a useful context for out of form players to find some form. It's ok for returning players to build up fitness before being considered for senior selection, but not to hone running patterns or gain confidence.

Hanily probably could do with a few weeks to reflect on what he learned in the senior team. I know that's a bit of a contradiction, in the sense I'm arguing that Hanily can consolidate in the VFL side while Florent won't gain much. But my argument is mostly based on Florent, even an out of form Florent, contributing more (at the moment) than Hanily. Papley's not back for several weeks yet, so there will be further opportunities in the near future to give Hanily another run in the senior team.

I'm not sure why people are down on Warner. He's not setting the world on fire, but I think he's playing a challenging, low-profile role decently well, and better than anyone in reserve (including Hanily). He's contributing nearly a goal a game, which in a team badly struggling to score, isn't to be sniffed at. He's also capable of running out a game in a way neither Hanily nor Sheldrick can do at the moment.

I'd include Sheldrick in the team and aim to give him some meaty minutes as a true onballer, with a view that he can be subbed out (or moved forward) if he flags. I'd then play Heeney predominantly as a forward. According to the commentators, Cox had indicated before last week that Heeney would play more time forward but he seemed to be in the midfield a lot against Essendon.

My rationale is twofold. Firstly, we're clearly lacking class in our forward line, and Heeney is the classiest, most capable forward we have. Secondly, and just as importantly, I'm pretty sure he's carrying something. I know some see it as a convenient excuse to blame an injury whenever a player isn't in the top form. But the reality is that it is more often than not the reason. And in the case of Heeney, I think there are things we can see. He's falling over a lot, and he's one of the worst offenders in not chasing. He's also not timing his marks as well as usual. His leap seems a little muted. I don't think he's a one-way player, so I interpret his lack of chasing and tackling as evidence that he's struggling a bit physically, especially added to other hints that his body is causing him angst. He can still, however, pick up a ball in one movement, get it to his boot, and hit a leading target on the chest. So I'd be mixing him up between deep forward, centre-half forward (where his ability to kick into the forward line comes into the equation), with maybe five minutes or so each quarter on ball. Or unleash him onball later in the game when everyone else is a bit tired and he's still fresh.

[Roadrunner]

Florent isn't in great form, but if you judge him against what Hanily has provided rather than against what we wish Florent were providing (and know he is capable of providing), I think you pick Florent every day. I don't think our VFL team is good enough (certainly not at the moment) for it to be a useful context for out of form players to find some form. It's ok for returning players to build up fitness before being considered for senior selection, but not to hone running patterns or gain confidence.

Hanily probably could do with a few weeks to reflect on what he learned in the senior team. I know that's a bit of a contradiction, in the sense I'm arguing that Hanily can consolidate in the VFL side while Florent won't gain much. But my argument is mostly based on Florent, even an out of form Florent, contributing more (at the moment) than Hanily. Papley's not back for several weeks yet, so there will be further opportunities in the near future to give Hanily another run in the senior team.

I'm not sure why people are down on Warner. He's not setting the world on fire, but I think he's playing a challenging, low-profile role decently well, and better than anyone in reserve (including Hanily). He's contributing nearly a goal a game, which in a team badly struggling to score, isn't to be sniffed at. He's also capable of running out a game in a way neither Hanily nor Sheldrick can do at the moment.

I'd include Sheldrick in the team and aim to give him some meaty minutes as a true onballer, with a view that he can be subbed out (or moved forward) if he flags. I'd then play Heeney predominantly as a forward. According to the commentators, Cox had indicated before last week that Heeney would play more time forward but he seemed to be in the midfield a lot against Essendon.

My rationale is twofold. Firstly, we're clearly lacking class in our forward line, and Heeney is the classiest, most capable forward we have. Secondly, and just as importantly, I'm pretty sure he's carrying something. I know some see it as a convenient excuse to blame an injury whenever a player isn't in the top form. But the reality is that it is more often than not the reason. And in the case of Heeney, I think there are things we can see. He's falling over a lot, and he's one of the worst offenders in not chasing. He's also not timing his marks as well as usual. His leap seems a little muted. I don't think he's a one-way player, so I interpret his lack of chasing and tackling as evidence that he's struggling a bit physically, especially added to other hints that his body is causing him angst. He can still, however, pick up a ball in one movement, get it to his boot, and hit a leading target on the chest. So I'd be mixing him up between deep forward, centre-half forward (where his ability to kick into the forward line comes into the equation), with maybe five minutes or so each quarter on ball. Or unleash him onball later in the game when everyone else is a bit tired and he's still fresh.

Great post Liz. Yes, Ollie is out of form but still better than anyone currently in the ressies. My beef is with Lloyd, but once again, no point dropping him but his place is in jeopardy when Errol and Paps come back, though that could be 4-6 weeks away. Corey is still learning the game but surely we are entitled for more consistency from Wilbur.

Our boys just need to apply pressure across 4 Quarters- easier said than done as we really haven’t been able to do that in any game I can recall. I guess it’s a combination of experience, fitness and mental toughness. We just have to be patient guys, but at least let’s try to cover some of our weaknesses at the selection table.

[imuninformedtwo]

Florent isn't in great form, but if you judge him against what Hanily has provided rather than against what we wish Florent were providing (and know he is capable of providing), I think you pick Florent every day. I don't think our VFL team is good enough (certainly not at the moment) for it to be a useful context for out of form players to find some form. It's ok for returning players to build up fitness before being considered for senior selection, but not to hone running patterns or gain confidence.

Hanily probably could do with a few weeks to reflect on what he learned in the senior team. I know that's a bit of a contradiction, in the sense I'm arguing that Hanily can consolidate in the VFL side while Florent won't gain much. But my argument is mostly based on Florent, even an out of form Florent, contributing more (at the moment) than Hanily. Papley's not back for several weeks yet, so there will be further opportunities in the near future to give Hanily another run in the senior team.

I'm not sure why people are down on Warner. He's not setting the world on fire, but I think he's playing a challenging, low-profile role decently well, and better than anyone in reserve (including Hanily). He's contributing nearly a goal a game, which in a team badly struggling to score, isn't to be sniffed at. He's also capable of running out a game in a way neither Hanily nor Sheldrick can do at the moment.

I'd include Sheldrick in the team and aim to give him some meaty minutes as a true onballer, with a view that he can be subbed out (or moved forward) if he flags. I'd then play Heeney predominantly as a forward. According to the commentators, Cox had indicated before last week that Heeney would play more time forward but he seemed to be in the midfield a lot against Essendon.

My rationale is twofold. Firstly, we're clearly lacking class in our forward line, and Heeney is the classiest, most capable forward we have. Secondly, and just as importantly, I'm pretty sure he's carrying something. I know some see it as a convenient excuse to blame an injury whenever a player isn't in the top form. But the reality is that it is more often than not the reason. And in the case of Heeney, I think there are things we can see. He's falling over a lot, and he's one of the worst offenders in not chasing. He's also not timing his marks as well as usual. His leap seems a little muted. I don't think he's a one-way player, so I interpret his lack of chasing and tackling as evidence that he's struggling a bit physically, especially added to other hints that his body is causing him angst. He can still, however, pick up a ball in one movement, get it to his boot, and hit a leading target on the chest. So I'd be mixing him up between deep forward, centre-half forward (where his ability to kick into the forward line comes into the equation), with maybe five minutes or so each quarter on ball. Or unleash him onball later in the game when everyone else is a bit tired and he's still fresh.

One of the footy shows had a list of the best five players in the comp for hitting a target coming inside 50. Isaac is number one.

Just to be clear on my Warner to sub comment, it's not a knock on him. I think he gets the most out of himself and whilst his ability to hit the right kick at times is still a work in progress, he's done reasonably well with the role he's been given. It was more a function of him being the best option for sub with the need to give Gus a run from the first bounce, and other changes this week.

I don't disagree that Ollie is contributing a 'bit' more than Hanily, but it's all relative, and I do think we need a small forward. (Cleary is playing the high half forward/defensive role.) Hanily is our best choice right now. And unless Ollie is being moved to that role, which he's not, then someone has to make way - and right now, his form, pressure and disposal are way off. If we had a fit list, he'd be out. Ollie seems to be lacking a clear role in the side, or he's performing the one he's been given poorly. I'm leaning to the latter. I hope he comes good, because we need his dancing feet, run and the best of his kicking skills. We're getting none of them at the moment at a time we desperately need them.

[liz]

One of the footy shows had a list of the best five players in the comp for hitting a target coming inside 50. Isaac is number one.

That surprises me not one bit. My suggestion of Isaac to play more forward wasn't a knock on him as a midfielder, though I think his inability (or unwillingness - which I doubt) to chase and tackle in that role is hurting a bit. (Not that there aren't others guilty of it too.) It was more a thought bubble about how to a) inject a bit of class into our forward third; and b) maybe protect his body if, as I suspect, he's more sore than normal at the moment. Every opponent knows what he's capable of, and he's made to "pay" every time he's bumped into or tackled.

[KSAS]

Just heard on SEN TDK will be an out for tomorrow night.