Andrew Lovett

[CureTheSane]

What is also perverse is that these bad and terrible footy players are assumed to be guilty by some just because they are footy players. They can't even go out for a beer now because if there is an incident the public assume the players are at fault.

It's also perverse but a fact of life unfortunately that in the court system the accused is presumed innocent until proven guilty but is the exact opposite in the court of public opinion.

+1

[CureTheSane]

Perhaps you favour a country where people cannot form their own informed opinions?

Yes. Yes, that is exactly what I think. You've nailed it. I thought I was being vague, but you've interpreted my comment very accurately.... *sarcasm mode turned off*
Let me try again.
I'm sorry that you don't like our judicial system. I hope that you find a way of remaining in this country and being able to deal with it to some degree somehow, or that you are able to facilitate some wholesale changes to it somehow.
It's too bad that being involved in then case as you say (which could mean anything) that you weren't lucky enough to be a juror.

You might also note that Lovett already did take action against St Kilda, and reached a settlement, long before this outcome.

Yes, I do recall that now. Silly boy. Silly advisers. He should have waited. Loss of earnings, etc etc

In the end. It doesn't matter what you or I or anyone else thinks.
He was found not guilty. Which is the same as being innocent of the crime in my book and should berespected that way.

[Panttz]

Goodesy would sort him out quick smart. I still think he has something to offer an AFL club.

[Nico]

I think as a footballer he has too much form regards unreliability and discipline, both at Essendon and St Kilda. Roos said on OTC last night that he has already been out of football for 18 months, and his experience is that players in that situation find it difficult to get back the touch and fitness levels required, and almost exclusively don't make it. On that front his age doesn't help his cause.

Watching him playing, to me he is very inconsistent and in a nutshell overrated.

Regardless of what people think of the court case outcome, I would think he is way outside the criteria required for the culture of our club.

Let some other club try to make a silk purse out of him.

[Donners]

I'm sorry that you don't like our judicial system. I hope that you find a way of remaining in this country and being able to deal with it to some degree somehow, or that you are able to facilitate some wholesale changes to it somehow.

It's too bad that being involved in then case as you say (which could mean anything) that you weren't lucky enough to be a juror.

I'm not sure if you are attributing this position to me as a strawman argument, or simply because you misunderstand. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume the latter.

I respect the outcome. If I were on the jury, I may well have gone the same way. Reasonable doubt is a very difficult hurdle to overcome, and never more so than in these circumstances. There are also issues with the law involved, which I will not bore you with here.

My position is that the mere fact that the jury reached this outcome does not mean that I regard him as a person who is an appropriate part of the club I support. The verdict is by no means an endorsement of the morality of his actions on that night, and I have formed my own views of those. Even had the charges been dropped, or had I heard details of the events without charges ever being laid, I would have had the same reaction.

Those views are further supported by his past behaviour, which includes an intervention order taken out against him by an ex-girlfriend (alleging violence) and a breach of that order, not to mention numerous examples of unprofessional behaviour as a player.

That's even before you get into football issues about age and time out of the game.



Perhaps I am simply naive. Perhaps there are many, many more stories along these lines regarding footballers which simply don't get out. I have no doubt that such things were covered up by clubs in the past. However, I would feel a little bit sick every time I saw him run out in Sydney colours.

[707]

Not wanted at the Swans, multiple lapses of discipline, too much hard work for the coaches and distraction for the players.

Good fit at somewhere like ....... Richmond. Might propel them up to their god given correct position on the ladder - 9th!

[ScottH]

Well, there is a surpirse!!


GWS ponder Lovett - AFL.com.au

[AnnieH]

On Tuesday, AFL CEO Andrew Demetriou re-affirmed the League's stance that it had no issue with the 29-year-old nominating for the draft.

"His desire is pretty clear, that he would like to play AFL football again and if a club is willing to take him, then he'll be welcomed back into the competition," Demetriou said

Even the AFL's forgiven him!!
He'll be very well behaved from now on. He wouldn't risk it after the crap I imagine he's been through.
Bloody GWS. Just because I said I wanted him first ...

[ShockOfHair]

I think as a footballer he has too much form regards unreliability and discipline, both at Essendon and St Kilda. Roos said on OTC last night that he has already been out of football for 18 months, and his experience is that players in that situation find it difficult to get back the touch and fitness levels required, and almost exclusively don't make it. On that front his age doesn't help his cause.

Watching him playing, to me he is very inconsistent and in a nutshell overrated.

Regardless of what people think of the court case outcome, I would think he is way outside the criteria required for the culture of our club.

Let some other club try to make a silk purse out of him.

+1


Dave Misson (former Swans and now Saints medic on Lovett's (non-) work ethic:

"Andrew revealed he had been for two runs in nine weeks of the off-season, despite being given a structured off-season program the week after he was traded to the Saints. "

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/af...-1226102409452

[swannielady]

You completely missed my point.

Also I find it offensive that you infer that I treat footy as more important than the issue of sexual assault and you should take it back.

My point throughout the whole thread is about fairness. It is not fair for ANYONE to be assumed to be guilty before it's been proven.

You obviously have had bad experiences with the legal system and for that I'm genuinely sorry but please don't tar me with the same brush as the Neanderthals that you state would back a footballer no matter what. It's not my go and I'm sure the people I've met through this site would back me up.

This post is for Big Al... I wish to publically apologise for my comments to you and sorry if you felt I had painted you with the Neaderthal tag. I find the subject of sexual assault very distressing and my emotions get the better of me. It is very difficult to be rational and philosophical when people tend to be flippant to downright disgusting about the whole thing. My point in my saying the reactions of football fans is perverse, is not about them going out drinking, which they can do as they like. It is when one is charged with sexual assault, fans come out before it goes to court and denigrate the alleged victim. It is not a football matter but a criminal matter and should be treated as such. There have been a few posts on here which unfortunately show general idea that women ask for these attacks. I cannot do anything about peoples perceptions, I should not even try as I end up feeling like the lone black in a Klu Klux Klan meeting lol. Once again Big Al your arguement was about fairness and I do apologise unreservedly for attacking your character and values.

[CureTheSane]

This post is for Big Al... I wish to publically apologise for my comments to you and sorry if you felt I had painted you with the Neaderthal tag. I find the subject of sexual assault very distressing and my emotions get the better of me. It is very difficult to be rational and philosophical when people tend to be flippant to downright disgusting about the whole thing. My point in my saying the reactions of football fans is perverse, is not about them going out drinking, which they can do as they like. It is when one is charged with sexual assault, fans come out before it goes to court and denigrate the alleged victim. It is not a football matter but a criminal matter and should be treated as such. There have been a few posts on here which unfortunately show general idea that women ask for these attacks. I cannot do anything about peoples perceptions, I should not even try as I end up feeling like the lone black in a Klu Klux Klan meeting lol. Once again Big Al your arguement was about fairness and I do apologise unreservedly for attacking your character and values.

I know that post was 'for Big al' however I will address it as you openly generalised about posts made here which may include mine.
1. Nobody was flippant about this matter before he was found not guilty. Nobody was flippant about it after it went to court either. But he was found not guilty, so now deserve to be treated as such. I am sure that everyone here finds sexual assault to be a very serious matter.
2. I would suggest that when something like this occurs, the 'denigrating of the alleged victim' is done by an incredibly small minority, so small that I have never encountered it and would most likely be restricted to the family and close friends of the alleged perpetrator.
3. It has been treated as a criminal matter, and nobody has suggested that 'women ask for these attacks'. Was it consensual? who knows, but saying that it wasn't (after a trail) is just taking the side of the he said/she said argument, and it is equally valid to take the 'he said' side. I don't take any side. simply, he was tried, and found not guilty, so he is not guilty.

This is one individual case which is being commented on and generalisations about perceptions of what people think is best left alone.

You shouldn't feel like 'the lone black in a Klu Klux Klan meeting'. You presented your point of view, and that is you right. I'm sure you will find that everyone here finds sexual assault, domestic violence and the like abhorrent.

[Big Al]

This post is for Big Al... I wish to publically apologise for my comments to you and sorry if you felt I had painted you with the Neaderthal tag. I find the subject of sexual assault very distressing and my emotions get the better of me. It is very difficult to be rational and philosophical when people tend to be flippant to downright disgusting about the whole thing. My point in my saying the reactions of football fans is perverse, is not about them going out drinking, which they can do as they like. It is when one is charged with sexual assault, fans come out before it goes to court and denigrate the alleged victim. It is not a football matter but a criminal matter and should be treated as such. There have been a few posts on here which unfortunately show general idea that women ask for these attacks. I cannot do anything about peoples perceptions, I should not even try as I end up feeling like the lone black in a Klu Klux Klan meeting lol. Once again Big Al your arguement was about fairness and I do apologise unreservedly for attacking your character and values.

Thank you swannielady, apology accepted.

The idea that victims ask for assault is disgusting in the extreme. On the other side it's also disgusting when the alleged attacker is hung out to dry by the court of public opinion. The tabloids in this country fall over themselves when a footy player is involved with any incident. They are judged by different standards as the rest of us and I think that is totally unfair.

As you rightly said when something like sexual assault is involved it's a criminal matter that transcends football and both sides should be treated fairly while the facts are presented to a court of law.

Again thank you for apologizing, it was a very classy act for you to do so.

[SwansFan1972]

We may all disagree at times but this site certainly doesn't go to the gutter like other sites. Except when there is a "Brad Dick" thread where we just can't help ourselves.

+1

Using a sporting analogy, this is very much a play the ball not the man (or woman) site - and all involved should be commended.

It is rather unique and refreshing really, in this era of faceless and occasionally very careless and reckless communication via this strange invention we call the internet!

[SwansFan1972]

In football terms, Lovett probably carries more negatives than positives.

But unlike most players who have had their commitment questioned, he has had it all taken away from him for a significant period of time. If that doesn't motivate a change in attitude (along the scared straight line of thinking) heaven knows what would!