Rnd 8 Vs Freo

[Melbournehammer]

Yes we are in 4th but the signs are not good,so many senior players look lethargic and well just slow and old.Maybe time too start putting some pressure on and if not dropping some of these guys at least making them sub once or twice.Yes we are missing players but its not so much even the wins/loses to me thats worrying at the moment its the lack of intent,desire,bloods spirit and dare that seem to be missing.We cant keep aspiring to do the bare minimum too win games.[/QUOTE]

My worry is that the core group of Jude, rok and goodes are just about done. Each are increasingly playing cameo roles rather than starring ones. Im not sure whether i am reading too much into it, but we simply dont look like a top four side and havent all season.

I worry that the match committee made some dumb decisions in the early rounds when they played the best 22 rather than kept playing the nab squad. I'm not saying take it easy but we really brought lamb white and Morton into games that were not easy where there were no kicks to get a bit of confidence. And each has been dropped or not played following matches where the senior core were thrashed.

On top of this we are slow - bird, Parker, rok, mcv, jpk, mummy, Walsh, pyke, Morton - not one of them has genuine speed. They all rotate through our crowded forward line and without Jetta bursting to the outside we look like we did two years ago. I said repeatedly then that Jetta is actually undroppable and I stick by that - he makes things happen and gives us chances to score. Too many others just get to the contest in time only to tackle.

Bold ish prediction - I think we will finish around 6-7 this season...I think tippett will help us but to expect him in to come in around round 12 having only had training and immediately do well is to create massive expectations which i dont think will be fulfilled.

we will drop some of the Carlton, essendon, port, adelaide west. Coast games - games that we didnt last year.

And I don't think it is lack of effort. It's just the game has evolved.

[Nico]

Pathetic. That is the only word for it. This effort was insipid and soft. We were spent by 15 min into the last quarter. somebody look at our fitness regime immediately. We are not running matches out. It was as though we wanted to save the game not win it. how can you protect a lead so small. Even 27 pts after we tried to protect a 15 pt lead in the third instead of trying to win the game. We bombed the ball down the flank to a contest constantly in the third and then in the last 15 min of the last. What was that all about? Why not honour the leads that were provided. There also seems to be a Senior player v new boys mentality happening. Jetts, Rampe, Parker etc lead time and again for Mal and he ignored them then kicked to Goodes in a contest against three Dockers. Reg can go home after this one. He was ordinary and got out-marked by a player 10cm shorter at one stage.

Very interesting comments about our fitness. The same was being said at the same time last year but we were able to win. Freo looks like they have gone up a notch. We beat them last year in a game that was similar in score line but we outlasted them. I reckon the 3 losses from our backline have been crucial, particularly Shaw. Mattner out makes 4. Hard to cover those loses. Are the mids working harder to cover our backline and we run out of puff. What I do know is both Walsh and White are not the answer. Just play Morton and leave him there. He is at least able to pull a goal out of his lemonade. Seriously can't believe they played an underdone Mumford. A big disappointment both on and off the field in 2013. In my mind he should have been playing reserves after his night on the piss.

[annew]

On Morton, it was said on Triple M broadcast that he was holding his thigh when he went off so maybe he was subbed because of injury or as a precaution. On ROK , seems that players can now anticipate the umpire instead of waiting for the actual play on call WTF? On Reid let's hope that mark gives him more confidence in the forward line and anyone calling for either him or Jetta to be dropped need to look at who is better to replace them. On this week's game can't see us beating Collingwood at the MCG but if we did I would be over last night's draw.

[liz]

too many times Reid has been beaten and had no other string to his bow.Im a massive fan but if it was Jessie White he would of been dropped or subbed many times by now.

.

Can you imagine Jesse even working his way to the defensive goal line in the dying seconds of the game, let alone marking the ball on the line? Reid has a long way to go before he becomes our forward line saviour, but he does work hard and has a big heart, and rarely drops his head. Remember the sitter he dropped on the wing earlyish in the game? Poor mistake but he buttered up straight away, laid a tackle, and at least forced a throw up.

This is not about knocking Jesse, per se. Just about why Reid keeps his spot in the team even when he's not contributing on the scoreboard.

[ernie koala]

Can you imagine Jesse even working his way to the defensive goal line in the dying seconds of the game, let alone marking the ball on the line? Reid has a long way to go before he becomes our forward line saviour, but he does work hard and has a big heart, and rarely drops his head. Remember the sitter he dropped on the wing earlyish in the game? Poor mistake but he buttered up straight away, laid a tackle, and at least forced a throw up.

This is not about knocking Jesse, per se. Just about why Reid keeps his spot in the team even when he's not contributing on the scoreboard.

Agree with you Liz. But as I keep banging on, IMO, he should be playing in defence...He would kill it.....Reid that is.

The one that shouldn't be in the team at present is Mummy. He's been poor all year...Maybe he's injured or maybe , looking at the porn look and Melbourne form, he's got ahead of himself.

Nothing a few weeks in Canberra, and a few sausage sizzles, couldn't fix.

[boroboy]

Can you imagine Jesse even working his way to the defensive goal line in the dying seconds of the game, let alone marking the ball on the line?

Thank you Liz. Beautifully sums up White in one sentence.

[liz]

Thank you Liz. Beautifully sums up White in one sentence.

Don't entirely agree with you. I think it sums Reid up.

I'm not quite as anti-White as you are, though I've gotten my hopes up high too often only to be disappointed when he doesn't impose himself on senior games. Watching him yesterday kick 10, and even allowing for the fact he didn't have much of an opponent, I marvelled at his athleticism. If only you could transplant the footy brain and heart of someone like Jared Moore into Jesse's body, you'd have a superstar.

There is an argument that White would have been of more value yesterday than Mumford. But arguments that Reid gets cut slack that Jesse doesn't doesn't wash with me.

[Auntie.Gerald]

its funny how Bazza and others like Cam Mooney said they didnt really become strong in the role of FF or CHF until they were around 24yrs of age now some of these guys are suddenly on the back of Sam reid

arguably Cam Mooney never really made it anyway

we wouldnt be worried much about Sammy if our midfield was dominating and our backline was as good as last year and our forwards pressuring the backline of the Hawks, Cats and Freeo

[Auntie.Gerald]

Question:

how did Freeo get so many more entries into the 50 then us ?

a better team would have smashed us with the amount of 50m entries that Freeo had

The HBF line at the Hawks and Freeo has really taken it to our forwards. Both weeks the backs of the Hawks and Freeo really pushed hard forward and caught us out big time when running thru and delivering 50m entries

[Melbournehammer]

That's unfair and wrong in any case and misses the sequence and both you and liz should know that. Reid was playing loose in defence at the time. It was his shocking floater after he had taken a good mark which actually led to the shot at goal. Reid as loose man at the back would always have gone back to the goal line, and it would have been his error as the last in the ten minute patch commencing with rok htb, goodes being outmarked by fife, grundy laying a good tackle and then undoing it with a stupid one, pyke being comprehensively out pointed in the centre sq by Clarke, bird centring the ball to a 3-1 and so on that led to us losing the game.

That list is made simply to show how many dumb errors were made in a seven minute period to go from 27 points to a draw. But reids was the last in that list so don't make it seem as though he was our saviour - because if he was he was also culpable.

In any case I've seen Jesse many times as a ruckman go back to the goal line and do what needed to be done.

Jesse may not have marked it. But he may not have criminally missed goodes as well. He is no world beater but like Morton and maybe walsh as well, he has become a convenient fall guy for our shocking performances.

I remember Roos going over the video of the last two minutes between Richmond and Gold Coast last year when Richmond lost conceding three goals in about 1.5 minutes. If such a video was shown of us it would embarrass a lot of the first team - and yet we can still find a way to castigate Jesse who wasn't even on the field !!!!

[barry]

To change tack a little, Ive noticed teams are trying to isolate Rampe a lot. Not a mark on the kid because he does a lot of good things, but they obviously see him as our weakest backman. Missing Shaw and now Matner is hurting us.

But our weakened defense is putting the spot light on our midfield. We seem to get smashed in clearences week in week out. With a sling shot defense that doesnt matter. But now it does. Why are our much hyped midfield failing to get first use of the footy?

[Cheer_Cheer]

Why are our much hyped midfield failing to get first use of the footy?

I wish I knew why too Barry.. I wonder what has happened to Kennedy.. He started the season as a gun and now just goes missing for large parts of the game.. He was our grunt..

[The Big Cat]

Do some of you knockers of Reid even watch the game? He took 11 marks! He had 17 disposals, not to mention his chasing and harassing. Just because he doesn't kick a goal doesn't make him disposable. He plays as a high CHF much in the Nick R. vein. He is the link coming out of our swarming defence.

[annew]

To change tack a little, Ive noticed teams are trying to isolate Rampe a lot. Not a mark on the kid because he does a lot of good things, but they obviously see him as our weakest backman. Missing Shaw and now Matner is hurting us.

But our weakened defense is putting the spot light on our midfield. We seem to get smashed in clearences week in week out. With a sling shot defense that doesnt matter. But now it does. Why are our much hyped midfield failing to get first use of the footy?

What is Mattner's injury?

[rojo]

We do not seem to have anyone in the team at the moment who can take the game by the scruff of the neck when the chips are down. With some of the regulars missing, the load is heavier on the mids and key players and they don't appear to have another gear for the dying stages. Mummy, Goodes, Jetta could, but they are not up for it at the moment.

I think Rampe is showing he has what it takes, I like his attitude that he is aiming not to be just a fill-in for AJ. I hope he continues to improve. I haven't written Walsh off yet. If he had played as many senior games as White and Everitt there would be reason to be critical. It would be good if he, as was the case with Armstrong, could be given a few games in a row to better judge whether there is a place for him going forward.

I'm not a great White fan but I agree that he would offer at least as much as Mummy at the moment. I don't understand why they keep on playing Mummy when he is not 100%. I know that many players play carrying injuries and I know we won the GF without much of a contribution from him but I would rather rest him for another month if it meant that he could get back to his very best for the end of the season. It would also give Jesse the opportunity to show us once and for all whether he can make it in the seniors.