Swans v hawks game day thread

[Ludwig]

Buddy might as well go for his GWS jumper presentation next week.

Best of all worlds: We are playing well, but keeping Hawthorn in the game. We just have to make sure we lose now. I figure we have a much better chance against a Buddyless Hawthorn than we do against the Cats.

Jesse doing well. Pleased that he is keeping up his form. It wasn't just the Tippett effect.

Also Bigg doesn't look out of place.

Probably not PC to quote yourself, but I couldn't be more pleased the way things went:

1. Our midfield was linking up well again. Will only be helped with Hanners back in. He's a big part of it.
2. I didn't count on Buddy (most likely) missing next week. Makes our loss all that more important.
3. The main reason for the loss was their inside 50 marking, especially Roughhead. I think this can be fixed, especially if Richards can take Roughy instead of Buddy.
4. White is good, but is not a pack-mark forward. He did well, but is better suited when the main marking assignment goes to Tippett.
5. Some good signs with Rohan, but still doesn't get enough possession. He gets out positioned too easily. I hope he improves with more game time. His tackling is valuable. And he does kick straight for goal.
6. McGlynn looked much more valuable up the ground. He should be a tagger.
7. Biggs was much better than I imagined he would be. Great first game.
8. Does Lamb get back in this side?
9. Big advantage to play next Friday. If we do lose, we will play the following week in Sydney with and extra day's rest.

I'm feeling a lot more positive than I did after last week's game. We didn't go 100%, but showed that if we do, it will take a big effort to beat us. At 3/4 time, I hoped Horse would tell the players to take it easy and not worry about the scoreboard. Just don't get hurt. And they did! We gave up 3 quick goals and took the 'tanking' pressure off us. Well played Swannies!

[The Big Cat]

In the article featuring Kizza in the Herald Sun today, it was suggested that opposition coaches have put our sluggishness over the past few weeks down to a heavy pre-finals training load. Maybe they are right as tonight they looked much fresher.

[Ratna]

Looked heaps better and will improve with changes - especially Hanners and Smithy.

My Question is, how do we incorporate Tippett into the side and maintain the options in attack we had tonight? While it is a no brainer that Tippett is best 22, when he is there we have often looked one dimensional. The players moving forward get the blinkers on and only look for one option. The hawthorn backs are great cutoff marks and cover well for each other especiallty when the ball is moving forward in a predictable fashion. IMO if we go in one dimensional next week kicking to Tippett all the time we will be worse off than tonight despite having better personnel.

Tonight especially early I thought we were really wasteful going in to forward 50 but this was often due to poor delivery (sometimes under pressure) rather than being predictable as we have been at times the last few weeks. Jesse has looked dangerous and been doing all the right things, Mummy is running into form and Myke has been excellent. Horse has a tough job to incorporate all the talls into the side and make it work offensively. I know it is not what was planned when we secured his signature but I would like to see Tippett spend time in the ruck and have a three way rotation especially as both Pykey and Mummy are dangerous forward too, and it would not let the defenders settle. I also think Tippett has good agility that would be an asset around the ruck/clearances. The only problem is having 2 ruckmen resting in the forward line is difficult as it gets top heavy and the ball is likely to come out way too easy when not marked. Potentially next week if Hawthorn play 2 ruckmen we may need to use one in defence?

Dilemnas, dilemnas.... regardless what a great loss tonight, we were competitive with a depleted team(even if hawthorn were resting a few too), I feel quietly confident going in to next week, we have exposed some youngsters to a finals like game and we don't have to meet Geelong who I think we don't match up on well at the moment. For the first time in a month i am looking forward to finals, time for the september specialists to do their thing.

[dimelb]

Probably not PC to quote yourself, but I couldn't be more pleased the way things went:

1. Our midfield was linking up well again. Will only be helped with Hanners back in. He's a big part of it.
2. I didn't count on Buddy (most likely) missing next week. Makes our loss all that more important.
3. The main reason for the loss was their inside 50 marking, especially Roughhead. I think this can be fixed, especially if Richards can take Roughy instead of Buddy.
4. White is good, but is not a pack-mark forward. He did well, but is better suited when the main marking assignment goes to Tippett.
5. Some good signs with Rohan, but still doesn't get enough possession. He gets out positioned too easily. I hope he improves with more game time. His tackling is valuable. And he does kick straight for goal.
6. McGlynn looked much more valuable up the ground. He should be a tagger.
7. Biggs was much better than I imagined he would be. Great first game.
8. Does Lamb get back in this side?
9. Big advantage to play next Friday. If we do lose, we will play the following week in Sydney with and extra day's rest.

I'm feeling a lot more positive than I did after last week's game. We didn't go 100%, but showed that if we do, it will take a big effort to beat us. At 3/4 time, I hoped Horse would tell the players to take it easy and not worry about the scoreboard. Just don't get hurt. And they did! We gave up 3 quick goals and took the 'tanking' pressure off us. Well played Swannies!

We need someone to fill the hole in front of him, as Marty used to do so effectively. Perhaps Dre? Or ROK could drop back now and then?

[ShockOfHair]

In the article featuring Kizza in the Herald Sun today, it was suggested that opposition coaches have put our sluggishness over the past few weeks down to a heavy pre-finals training load. Maybe they are right as tonight they looked much fresher.

During the game tonight I worked up the theory that Geelong last week was our way of resting the whole team. We looked a lot sharper and more competitive against the Hawks. A finals-like game, and with four or five players having barely 40 games between them an impressive effort.

I know Tippett's been great (and White was pretty good tonight) but with our forward entries being the way they are Tippett's presence makes us crapulously predictable. We go to him 40% of the time. Without him our wayward entries make us almost unplayable for the opposition. If our midfield has their skates on, it ends up with us having a spread of goalscorers.

[MightyBloods]

Looked heaps better and will improve with changes - especially Hanners and Smithy.

My Question is, how do we incorporate Tippett into the side and maintain the options in attack we had tonight? While it is a no brainer that Tippett is best 22, when he is there we have often looked one dimensional. The players moving forward get the blinkers on and only look for one option. The hawthorn backs are great cutoff marks and cover well for each other especiallty when the ball is moving forward in a predictable fashion. IMO if we go in one dimensional next week kicking to Tippett all the time we will be worse off than tonight despite having better personnel.

Tonight especially early I thought we were really wasteful going in to forward 50 but this was often due to poor delivery (sometimes under pressure) rather than being predictable as we have been at times the last few weeks. Jesse has looked dangerous and been doing all the right things, Mummy is running into form and Myke has been excellent. Horse has a tough job to incorporate all the talls into the side and make it work offensively. I know it is not what was planned when we secured his signature but I would like to see Tippett spend time in the ruck and have a three way rotation especially as both Pykey and Mummy are dangerous forward too, and it would not let the defenders settle. I also think Tippett has good agility that would be an asset around the ruck/clearances. The only problem is having 2 ruckmen resting in the forward line is difficult as it gets top heavy and the ball is likely to come out way too easy when not marked. Potentially next week if Hawthorn play 2 ruckmen we may need to use one in defence?

Dilemnas, dilemnas.... regardless what a great loss tonight, we were competitive with a depleted team(even if hawthorn were resting a few too), I feel quietly confident going in to next week, we have exposed some youngsters to a finals like game and we don't have to meet Geelong who I think we don't match up on well at the moment. For the first time in a month i am looking forward to finals, time for the september specialists to do their thing.

This is the big question in my opinion. What to do with White,Tippett, Pyke and Mumford? The Hawk backs looked uncomfortable with our huge bodies deep near the goalsquare. They struggled to pick us off with their 3rd man up due to the pure size of our guys. I like White and Pyke deep forward. Mumford taking most of the ruck with assistance from Pyke and Tippett. Tippett to take the resting Hawk ruck forward (Bailey/Hale). Richards to Roughead (assuming Buddy is suspended). Grundy to Gunston. This splits our 4 main talls (2 up forward, we cant afford 3), 1 on ball and 1 helping to defend. It takes the pressure off both Teddy and Reg who then can take bodies more their size. Also, it give our forward line some unpredictability.
Finally, Mitchell must be hard tagged...Benny McGlynn is just the player...strong and agressive and has pace to hurt Mitchell on the rebound.

...and one simple instruction for every player. Go "one on one" with them all over the ground. Don't sit off or their smarts and skills will kill us (ie Mitchell, Hodge, Birchall, Lewis, Burgoyne). If we can create a contest everywhere we can get them on the counter attack. Their backs like to go off their man so quick counters hitting the mark can really split them open. Tonight was ok....but some wrong match ups. I hope Horse is keeping the big moves up his sleeve...possibly Gary down back providing extra pressure/run.

...and with 9 or 10 premiership players out tonight and to produce that performance..well I'm very happy.

[rojo]

We need someone to fill the hole in front of him, as Marty used to do so effectively. Perhaps Dre? Or ROK could drop back now and then?

I have been thinking for some time now that that something we have been missing in our back line this year, despite Rampe and McVeigh playing so well, is a Mattner replacement. I have to admit that I really underestimated the importance of the role he played.

I am one of the ones yet to be convinced that Everitt gives enough. It would be great if he could chop out for Grundy and Teddy but I don't think that's his game, he seems more to replicate Mal's style and neither of them are so great defensively. Lewie we need you!

[MightyBloods]

I have been thinking for some time now that that something we have been missing in our back line this year, despite Rampe and McVeigh playing so well, is a Mattner replacement. I have to admit that I really underestimated the importance of the role he played.

I am one of the ones yet to be convinced that Everitt gives enough. It would be great if he could chop out for Grundy and Teddy but I don't think that's his game, he seems more to replicate Mal's style and neither of them are so great defensively. Lewie we need you!

Rampe is our new Marty. ...and I agree with you on Everitt. I would prefer a hunter (agressive pacy small) to help us with team balance when the ball hits the ground).

[Melbournehammer]

I have been thinking for some time now that that something we have been missing in our back line this year, despite Rampe and McVeigh playing so well, is a Mattner replacement. I have to admit that I really underestimated the importance of the role he played.

I am one of the ones yet to be convinced that Everitt gives enough. It would be great if he could chop out for Grundy and Teddy but I don't think that's his game, he seems more to replicate Mal's style and neither of them are so great defensively. Lewie we need you!

I am constantly amazed how few people realized just how critical Marty was to making Ted and reg look quality. He wad quick and reasonably fearless and often just stuck a hand in there when needed.

Everitt, unlike Marty and somewhat surprisingly aj, is very man conscious - if his man doesn't kick it then he is ok. This is often a product of being worried about your place in the team. The mark hale took which was uncontested was one he had to fly for. But he was so worried about Franklin that he thought it better to stay on the ground. I think the team would have preferred him to play selflessly.

Marty was always standing in the hole and taking the hit and he was deserving of far more praise and respect than he ever got on these forums.

[longmile]

Hope Morton remains as sub for next week, liked his late come in role with an exciting goal.

[wolftone57]

Rampe is our new Marty. ...and I agree with you on Everitt. I would prefer a hunter (agressive pacy small) to help us with team balance when the ball hits the ground).

I don't know why you are knocking Everitt he played pretty well in fact. I thought the main problem tonight was when Mal got the bloody basll and just bombed it again and again. Macca panicked on several occasions too, especially that shot for goal when he had space and just panicked. He was even being given the green light by a team-mate.

The ones who panicked again tonight were the experienced players. A bit annoying as they are supposed to be the calming influence on the young blokes. About the young blokes led by the pied piper from Balmain, Kizza. They were super tonight, Luke Parker is a really very serious mid. Young Shane Biggs in his first game kept Luke Beuist to 2.1 and had 18 possies against Bruist's 11. Bruist had 5 score assists though but the kid played really well on him. Bird played on a wing tonight and wasn't moved when Burgoine got loose and started hurting us, funny that, he nullified Burgione in the GF when he came on the ball. I think horse will do that in the final.

Finally, if we kick to Jesse like we did in the first half he will kick a bag of goals. The problem was we had no alternative when they dropped players into the spot. With Tippett we have a two forward option. Tippett taking the big grabs and leading one way and Jesse leading the other way. I thought Jesse beat Gibson and Lake tonight, it was our delivery that killed him in the second half, dreadful is what I'd call it. The rucks beat Lake too.

[Bloody Hell]

A few caveats for these comments:

1. I started watching a live stream just before half time.
2. I thought the Swans we going to be smashed.
3. 2. occured before I knew Tippett or even Smith were out.
4. I thought it would be a dead rubber.
5. I stopped watching the match halfway through the last quarter (as I was satisfied and felt 2. had been proven wrong whatever the result.)
6. I have watched a replay from the corner of my eye (whilst possibly under the influence.)

- Bigg looked ok.
- Cunningham will be a player.
- Buddy will miss at worst 3 down to 2, at best 2 down to 1. (though I'd like to see him get another week for the elbow on Grundy.)
- I think this demonstrates we have 1 tall too many. Reid is OK as he can play as a big HFF, while White plays as an OK CHF.

I hope we aren't flirting with form.

I could say more, but like the Australian 1st XI, I have no idea what our line up will be next week.

We need reinforcements to be a contender.

- - - Updated - - -

In addition I would like to say this was the biggest game of misinformation I have seen.

Both Coaches knew they would be playing each other next week in the game that counts, and neither was showing their hand....next week will be infinitely more interesting.

[hot potato]

I told Her Indoors I was going to see The Swans get flogged, so in Horse speak, it was very pleasing to see the much improved movement by the boys.
Both teams can score goals like grease lightning, with the Hawks somewhat better at it than us (27 scoring shots to 20).
They can win without Franklin though, don't worry about that, especially with Rioli back.


.

[ernie koala]

IMO, that was the perfect result last night...Spirited, sharp performance....No injuries....Buddy reported....Hawks win....we play them again.

Obviously next week will be a whole different kettle of fish, but we have some goods in's, they may have a big out.

The contrast in our teams energy was palpable...It certainly gives the heavy, pre finals, training load theory plenty of credence.

[Triple B]

Bird and Jesse are having cracking games

Really?

I love Birdy and not suggesting for a minute he be dropped, but I thought it was the worst game I've seen from him for ages. He fumbled it most of the night and when he managed to grab it he handballed or kicked it straight to a Hawk.