Round 6 : Changes vs Melb

[Matt80]

Pft. I'm not sure what the point is? Are you suggesting that he wouldn't? Or are you suggesting that he was over-rated?
Comparisons across eras, more often than not, stikes me as a pointless waste of time. If Greg Williams TRAINED as they do today, how much better would he have been? We'll never know.
It's as much a waste of time as belittling Dawn Fraser's record in the pool saying even the 30th fastest girl in the pool today would beat her. SO WHAT?! If Dawn trained & competed today, how good would she be? Equally pointless question.

But to answer your hypothetical, Deasil's unparalleled peripheral vision, lightning quick hands, reading & anticipation of the play, and single-minded competitive intensity would offset his lack of footspeed & aerobic capacity as much today as it did back then. He was rated too slow back then & his persistence, determination & sheer football ability saw him dominate the game. You can't tell me he wouldn't get a game with the Dees? Pft, he could just about pull on the boots today & get a gig with them (ok that bit wasn't serious)

Come on it's fascinating comparing players of different eras. Jason Dunstall has a similar physical profile of height and weight to Josh Kennedy. Would Dunstall have been a champion midfielder in today's AFL where players of 196cm are chosen as power forwards compared to Dunstall at 188cm?

How would Lockett go against constant double teaming? How would a Ryan Griffin go against John Platton.

What about a battle of mobile ruckman of Jim Stynes v Dene Cox.

[Legs Akimbo]

Come on it's fascinating comparing players of different eras. Jason Dunstall has a similar physical profile of height and weight to Josh Kennedy. Would Dunstall have been a champion midfielder in today's AFL where players of 196cm are chosen as power forwards compared to Dunstall at 188cm?

How would Lockett go against constant double teaming? How would a Ryan Griffin go against John Platton.

What about a battle of mobile ruckman of Jim Stynes v Dene Cox.

Funny I was contemplating the height of KPFs today. G Ablett, A Jakovich, J Dunstall, T Lockett, T Modra, M Lloyd -none above 190cm. What they all had in common were (1) solidly built and strong (2) damned fast over the first 20m (3) stick hands (4) accurate kick (5) mercurial .

Compare to today's marquee forwards and next gen coming through - typically over 195 and yet none are really that good at marking. Only our Lance has really kicked a back full of goals. The closest of today's forwards to the old style would be Pavlich when he plays FF and he does it pretty well.

So what's changed - no leading space and no one on ones. Zone defence.

I can't help think that next year, if they do move to the 20m minimum kick distance or zoning, the return of the old style FF may just be possible. That would be awesome. One aspect of the game I really miss - guys kicking bags of goals, taking speccies and one on one

[Matt80]

Ha ha - glad you weren't picking the Swans Team of the Century Matt80 ... it'd only have players from the last decade, & guys like Pratt, Nash, Plugger & plodders like Williams wouldn't get a look in.

I meant no disrespect to any past Swans players with my comments. I was making the point that the modern game requires an incredible amount of athleticism and hard running. The game just evolves. In 20 years time midfielders of the size of Goodes will be mandatory, Key position players will average 204cm and Ruckman will average 210cm. They will probably all be able to run 800m in under two minutes.

[goswannies]

How would Lockett go against constant double teaming?

Seriously?! Are you kidding me?! He was double (and triple) teamed for most his whole career ... and nearly his whole time at the Swans.

While you're at it, how many goals would he have kicked in 1897 & I'd love to have seen Bobby Skilton play in the 1930s, take us to 4 consecutive Premierships and win 14 Brownlow medals.

[goswannies]

Funny I was contemplating the height of KPFs today. G Ablett, A Jakovich, J Dunstall, T Lockett, T Modra, M Lloyd -none above 190cm.

Lockett listed at 191cm

[Wardy]

There's going to be an all in box on in a minute!!

[Wardy]

C'mon umps this is bull@@@@!!! The way Buddy is being treated is appalling yet if he retaliates he cops it- hope Roos is happy with himself - if you haven't got a talented side - get them to play dirty.

[Legs Akimbo]

Lockett listed at 191cm

um..., I stand corrected.

[ernie koala]

Wonderful player and not disputing that, but how would he match up to someone like Josh Kennedy who is bigger, stronger, faster and probably a better endurance runner? Kennedy is the modern in and under player!

He'd match up just fine.....think Sam Mitchell...but much better.

[sharp9]

Some heights and (playing) weights according to the great God Wikipedia

Franklin 198 cm / 102 kg
Hawkins 197 cm / 105 kg
Petrie 197cm / 101kg
Cloke 196cm / 108kg
Kennedy 196 cm / 99 kg
Brown 195cm / 103kg
Cameron 195cm / 95kg
J. Riewoldt 195 cm / 93 kg
Hall 194cm / 104kg
Longmire 194cm / 102kg
Goodes 194cm / 100kg
Roughead 193cm / 100kg
N. Riewoldt 193cm / 96kg
Gunston 193cm / 81kg
Brownless 192 cm / 102 kg
Lloyd 192 cm / 96 kg
Lockett 191cm / 118 kg
Hird 188cm / 89kg
Roos 188 cm / 88 kg
Dunstall 188 cm / 100 kg
Jackovich 187cm / 98kg
Modra 188 cm / 95 kg
Brereton 186 cm / 93 kg
Ablett 185 cm / 97 kg
Coleman 185cm / 80kg
Demetriou 182 cm / 80 kg Everyone under 30 NOTE WELL!!!! Act before it's too late. :-)
Pratt 180 cm / 76 kg
Nash 175 cm

[Matt80]

It's incredible now to think that Dermott the best CHF of the 80s is now common midfield size (186cm).

[Legs Akimbo]

Thanks Sharp 9 - maybe my 190cm height limit was a bit undercooked, but my point is well illustrated by your statistics. Yes, players are getting taller generally, but it seems there is a tendency towards KPF who are tall. I am thinking of the latest batch being Tom Boyd (200/104), Jeremy Cameron (195, 95), Jonathan Patton (198, 103), Joe Daniher (201, 90), Jesse Hogan (195, 97), Cam McCarthy (195, 89).

Now let's look at this dude

14 days to the draft: Meet gun prospect Darcy Hourigan - AFL.com.au

Pretty sure he was not drafted. You could argue that Tim Membrey is the same type of player but perhaps lacking the size generally to be a KPF (188, 90). Nevertheless, I'd love to see him get into the senior team and kick a few bags as more of an 'old style' forward.

An interesting aside is that KPDs have not grown at the same rate - perhaps because the defensive structures are focused on zoning 2nd and third player jumping over the top.