2015 academy discussion thread (with some FS thrown in for good measure)

[dimelb]

It would be a worthwhile and illuminating study Meg, but I wouldn't hold my breath.

[Conor_Dillon]

If it comes to the crunch we probably need Dunkley more than Mills.

I can see where you're coming from but I'd take 1 Mills before I took 3 Dunkleys...the kid is an absolute jet and is worth selling the farm for. I know it's an outlandish statement but he's a mix of Selwood/Pendlebury...hard as nails but with plenty of time and awareness.

Also, not sure why Josh is listed as a defender...has played solely as a mid for the last couple of seasons at TAC Cup level and as a mid/half forward in the national champs.

[Pmcc2911]

From what I saw of the U18s last year with both Henney and (a bottom-aged) Mills, Heeney looked great and tough and obviously someone for us to get excited about, but Mills oozed class. He seemed to have the extra time real star players tend to have. I'm sure Dunkley's worth it too but Mills will be a great pick up for us next year.

Agree with your description of Mills, he does ooze class

[barry]

Is the afl ready for a state based draft.

Eg. First draft. Each team gets 2 picks from local state only.
second draft. Back to a national draft.
..for remaining players.

[royboy42]

Agree with your description of Mills, he does ooze class

I'm sure someone has posted a link to some Mill's video, but I cant find it..Any chance of a repost?

[0918330512]

Is the afl ready for a state based draft.

Eg. First draft. Each team gets 2 picks from local state only.
second draft. Back to a national draft.
..for remaining players.

I could just imagine Clubs trying to move young kids accross the boarders & into their draft pool ... like used to occasionally happen in the old Zoning days

[barry]

We should be poaching the best vic players into the academy!

[aardvark]

We should be poaching the best vic players into the academy!

They wouldn't come. It costs too much to live up there.

[jono2707]

They wouldn't come. It costs too much to live up there.

Plus the weather is much nicer in Melbourne.....

[Meg]

Eddie at it again.
Re equalisation:
"That is to have an uncompromised draft and not to have any of these other elements on the side, whether it's a cost-of-living component, or whether it's zones or whether it's academies, or anything else," he said.
Northern AFL clubs making draft unequal, says Eddie McGuire

[mcs]

Eddie at it again.
Re equalisation:
"That is to have an uncompromised draft and not to have any of these other elements on the side, whether it's a cost-of-living component, or whether it's zones or whether it's academies, or anything else," he said.
Northern AFL clubs making draft unequal, says Eddie McGuire

Cry me a river you old sookbag. I would of thought he would of shut up for five seconds given how well his team are going - but as the rest of us know, its only a red herring as they've played no one good yet.

[The Big Cat]

Eddie at it again.
Re equalisation:
"That is to have an uncompromised draft and not to have any of these other elements on the side, whether it's a cost-of-living component, or whether it's zones or whether it's academies, or anything else," he said.
Northern AFL clubs making draft unequal, says Eddie McGuire

This is another equalisation smoke screen for Eddie not wishing to acknowledge that his club has 80,000 members and the Bullies are aiming at 35,000 for the first time in their history. Or that his club has an annual income at least twice that of most of the other Melbourne clubs plus most of the interstate ones except for WCE. Or that his club has the most favourable fixture and playing times. It bugs him that no player of any demonstrated ability will come to Collingwood so they are totally reliant on the draft to force players to their spiritless carcass of a footy club which reels from one off field issue to another. I think the "Boy from Broady" who now sees himself too rich and powerful to even visit there is starting to realise that, as his star continues to wane, you have to talk louder and louder because less and less people take you seriously.

[Doctor]

As we wait for a decision from the AFL on the future draft system to apply to players from Academy (and F/S) backgrounds, I continue to be frustrated at the lack of understanding of the wider objectives of the academy system in the non-traditional states of NSW and Qld.

In June 2014 Andrew Pridham put out an excellent statement (link below) which covered some of these objectives but I feel this has not been followed up with sufficient and frequent background information. While Isaac Heeney's successful AFL debut is a great story, it is also a double-edged sword for the academy system because of the jealousies it has provoked against the Swans for the alleged 'steal' we got in drafting him.

In the June 2014 statement, Pridham said that in the 5 years since its commencement in 2010, the Swans Academy had trained around 1000 boys/young men from Sydney and its surrounds. We know that two of these - Brandon Jack and Isaac Heeney - have played senior AFL games. But what has happened to the rest?

I would expect the Swans to retain contact details for every young man that has gone through the Academy (and I assume these details would include email addresses). It would therefore be easy enough to engage a professional survey firm to conduct an electronic survey to find out what impact the Academy has had for the large number who are not playing at the AFL level.

Why did they apply to take part in the Swans Academy? How much did the fact that the Academy was run by the Swans influence their decision to apply? Would they have applied if the Academy had been run by the AFL and had not been associated with an individual club? Did they play Australian Rules football before they trained in the Academy? How many years did they train in the Academy? Are they still playing? If so, where and at what level? If not, why not (for example, have they chosen another sport instead)? If they are not playing, do they have any other involvement in AR - coaching, administration, umpiring, running the drinks etc.? Has their involvement in the Academy had any wider impact on the support or involvement in AR of their families, friends, schools etc.? What general comments do they have to make about about the time and training they spent in the Academy?

If the answers to questions along these lines told a positive story for the academy system as a way of fostering AR participation and a following of AR in non-traditional areas, then that would be a very strong selling point and serve as a warning not to risk damage by diluting the incentive for the Swans (and the other three clubs) to continue to run the academies. And if the survey results were negative, then the cost/benefit of the resources invested would need to be questioned. And in either case, similar surveys run in future years would assist to build a longer-term picture of the influence of the Academy.

It is of course possible that someone has already done such a survey and not publicised the results. If that were the case however it would suggest the results are not encouraging.

QBE Sydney Swans Academy explained

Some good questions Meg but a couple of things to consider in response. Firstly, many of the boys you refer to are still in the Academy system. Boys who were recruited when it first started up are only now in the 15s or 16s. Those who were older when it started are obviously no longer in the system and would be the kind of ex-academy kids you're referring to, but that would be a small minority.

Secondly, the Academy reduces numbers as the years go on, particularly at U16s level. Many of the boys would be cut at 15 rather than exiting at 18. What they do from that age on is quite varied, but many continue on at club level and will presumably continue to lift the standard of Sydney football at U19s and then senior level. From what I have seen the standard is appreciably higher now than it was 10 years ago, and the Academy lads (and the training they get) have a lot to do with that.

Thirdly, I have a son in the Academy as some of you know and I can guarantee you that he would not be playing footy without it. He was a rep level soccer player who trialled without ever having played footy cos he loves the game and was accepted on potential. The fact that it was run by the Swans was why he trialled, and why we were happy for him to do so. I'm sure there are many other kids who fall into that category.

[S.S. Bleeder]

Eddie at it again.
Re equalisation:
"That is to have an uncompromised draft and not to have any of these other elements on the side, whether it's a cost-of-living component, or whether it's zones or whether it's academies, or anything else," he said.
Northern AFL clubs making draft unequal, says Eddie McGuire

So he wants everything to be equal? It's never going to be equal because the NSW and Qld clubs are severely disadvantaged by the go home factor. He wasn't making any comments in our favour when players like Grant, Gasper and Rocca were wanting to return to Victoria.

[liz]

So he wants everything to be equal? It's never going to be equal because the NSW and Qld clubs are severely disadvantaged by the go home factor. He wasn't making any comments in our favour when players like Grant, Gasper and Rocca were wanting to return to Victoria.

Eddie - and he is not alone on this - is incapable of understanding the concept that equalisation measures are designed to counterbalance inbuilt inequalities within the competition, whether due to historical circumstances or geographical factors, so that all clubs can compete on something approaching a relatively even playing field. Lost in all the discussion about COLA, for example, is the fact that it is considerably more expensive to live in Sydney than other Australian cities. It wasn't a free hit for the NSW clubs. It was a measure to counterbalance that inbuilt competitive disadvantage. While I acknowledge the old COLA lacked transparency and was possibly too blunt an instrument to best address the underlying inequality, it remains that that inequality existed (and still exists). It may not impact the Buddys and Tippos of this world, but it certainly impacts those on more modest wages. Even Eddie once acknowledged that the COLA was justified, strangely enough while he was actually living in Sydney.

I doubt he really has much of a clue how different list management is for clubs when 75% of their list is from a different state. You would think that the Lions' recent experience would have provided him with something of a clue, but apparently not.