Are the Swans headed for the spoon in 2019?

[Blood Fever]

How many players did John bring into the team? It was pretty much Roosy's team. John tweaked the game plan (and did a great job in doing so) but the longer he has coached the more the team becomes his as players drafted/traded under Roosy leave.

With John it started with a bang and has become a whimper.

The simple question is, even taking into account our injuries, are we the worst list in the AFL. I would say no we are bottom 8 but not as bad as we are going.

Integral part of the coaching team as senior assistant to Roos and was instrumental in getting the best out of our forwards and midfield during that time. His finals record is superior to Roos- 3gfs, multiple prelims etc. Too many quick to turn on him as soon as we struggle. Embarrassing to witness as a Swans fan. He has overachieved with sides that he has coached.

[Wardy]

I don’t think we’ll be wooden spooners probably finish about 10th -hope I’m wrong and we win all remaining games (which is highly unlikely - doesnt hurt to hope!!)

[aardvark]

Integral part of the coaching team as senior assistant to Roos and was instrumental in getting the best out of our forwards and midfield during that time. His finals record is superior to Roos- 3gfs, multiple prelims etc. Too many quick to turn on him as soon as we struggle. Embarrassing to witness as a Swans fan. He has overachieved with sides that he has coached.

His record is better than Roos only because Roos spent 3 years rebuilding Melbourne. I agree re fair weather supporters, I saw one final in the first 35 years of my life and it never stopped me attending games. I'm not a huge fan of Longmire's defensive mindset or the way he handles new players but he is a decent coach.
I disagree he has overachieved. He should have won in '14 and '16.

[Roadrunner]

Yes, Horse can be too defensive. But injuries and lack of form in our backline have contributed to that. When you’re under pressure to win/ be competitive it is difficult to give new players a run of games if they are slow to perform. This year will test him and if he can’t improve us then he should go and we can then start with a new approach. That said, I hope he can!

[Agent 86]

I disagree he has overachieved. He should have won in '14 and '16.

I didn't know he was playing then?

I don't like to think about the '14 GF too much, but the Hawks were just ON & we were OFF. Guess you can blame the coach for not singing enough songs to get them fired up, but i reckon the hard part is getting a team to the big stage. Once they're out there on the day, it's simply up to the players.

We could've / should've won in '16, but a few things went against us. &… Guess you can blame the coach for not singing enough songs to get them fired up, but i reckon the hard part is getting a team to the big stage. Once they're out there on the day, it's simply up to the players.

[KTigers]

Paranoia is starting to occur with the Melbourne media after watching an exchange between Julian de Stupid & John Ralph on Vic biased AFL tonight on Fox Footy,where they implied Vic clubs would be distraught if Swans finished last thereby gaining access to either one of two highly rated draft kids who are regarded as better than Sam Walsh.

Well, if they feel really strongly about it, they can start deliberately losing games against us to ensure we don't get the spoon.
Starting this Friday at the SCG. C'mon Essendon, you know you are not going to win the flag this year. What's the difference between
coming 10th and 12th on the ladder, it's all about stopping the Swans from getting the number one draft pick.
I guess these clowns have just nothing else to talk about.

[AnnieH]

His record is better than Roos only because Roos spent 3 years rebuilding Melbourne. I agree re fair weather supporters, I saw one final in the first 35 years of my life and it never stopped me attending games. I'm not a huge fan of Longmire's defensive mindset or the way he handles new players but he is a decent coach.
I disagree he has overachieved. He should have won in '14 and '16.

Did he play in either game, I can't recall?
Hawks were just better in 14; and the umpires were even more better in 16.

[Blood Fever]

His record is better than Roos only because Roos spent 3 years rebuilding Melbourne. I agree re fair weather supporters, I saw one final in the first 35 years of my life and it never stopped me attending games. I'm not a huge fan of Longmire's defensive mindset or the way he handles new players but he is a decent coach.
I disagree he has overachieved. He should have won in '14 and '16.

Hawks had far superior list to us from 2012-2015. It showed when we got hammered in 2014 although we had a shocker. 2016 was disappointing but a lot of people jumped on board bulldogs, including umps and we had little luck. GWS pantsed us in qualifying and had a far superior list as did ,arguably, the cats,who we hammered in prelim. No way we and the coach underachieved.

[aardvark]

No way we and the coach underachieved.

I see losing two grand finals we were favoured to win as an underachievement. Winning 3 in 5 years would have been an over achievement.

[KTigers]

Hawks had far superior list to us from 2012-2015. It showed when we got hammered in 2014 although we had a shocker. 2016 was disappointing but a lot of people jumped on board bulldogs, including umps and we had little luck. GWS pantsed us in qualifying and had a far superior list as did ,arguably, the cats,who we hammered in prelim. No way we and the coach underachieved.

I think GWS were even more unlucky (if that's what it is) than us in the year of the bulldog fairytale. They only lost
their prelim by 6 pts, and were done in by the umps 13-23 in the free kick count. It's hard to see us winning the
16 GF against them (GWS), after that shellacking we took in the QF at ANZ, but we'll never know for sure. If someone
had offered you a GF appearance in 16 at the end of the 15 season, you'd take it in a heartbeat. So, in that sense,
we overachieved in 16. There are 15 games left this season and I think we'll win 5 or 6 of them, leaving Carlton to
add another wooden spoon to their growing collection of them. Best be positive methinks.

[Blood Fever]

I think GWS were even more unlucky (if that's what it is) than us in the year of the bulldog fairytale. They only lost
their prelim by 6 pts, and were done in by the umps 13-23 in the free kick count. It's hard to see us winning the
16 GF against them (GWS), after that shellacking we took in the QF at ANZ, but we'll never know for sure. If someone
had offered you a GF appearance in 16 at the end of the 15 season, you'd take it in a heartbeat. So, in that sense,
we overachieved in 16. There are 15 games left this season and I think we'll win 5 or 6 of them, leaving Carlton to
add another wooden spoon to their growing collection of them. Best be positive methinks.

Good call re GWS and the rest of the season, KT.

[Sandrevan]

I think GWS were even more unlucky (if that's what it is) than us in the year of the bulldog fairytale. They only lost
their prelim by 6 pts, and were done in by the umps 13-23 in the free kick count. It's hard to see us winning the
16 GF against them (GWS), after that shellacking we took in the QF at ANZ, but we'll never know for sure. If someone
had offered you a GF appearance in 16 at the end of the 15 season, you'd take it in a heartbeat. So, in that sense,
we overachieved in 16. There are 15 games left this season and I think we'll win 5 or 6 of them, leaving Carlton to
add another wooden spoon to their growing collection of them. Best be positive methinks.

In the 2016 prelim final GWS vs Bulldogs - we played the Friday night game and were already in the GF when GWS played bulldogs on Saturday. The umpires shafted GWS in that game; the VFL old boys club simply could not allow 2 Sydney teams to play of in the AFL GF at the MCG. It's just not cricket old boy. It was bad enough in 2006/6 when 2 non-Vic teams were in the GF

[chalbilto]

I think GWS were even more unlucky (if that's what it is) than us in the year of the bulldog fairytale. They only lost
their prelim by 6 pts, and were done in by the umps 13-23 in the free kick count. It's hard to see us winning the
16 GF against them (GWS), after that shellacking we took in the QF at ANZ, but we'll never know for sure. If someone
had offered you a GF appearance in 16 at the end of the 15 season, you'd take it in a heartbeat. So, in that sense,
we overachieved in 16. There are 15 games left this season and I think we'll win 5 or 6 of them, leaving Carlton to
add another wooden spoon to their growing collection of them. Best be positive methinks.

According to Jon Ralph in an article in the he states that "It would be a classic Sydney drafting manoeuvre - missing finals for the first time in a decade and snaring No1. overall draft pick....... Further he also states "rivals would br filthy if Sydneys' one trip down the bottom allowed them to secure a player with extraordinary junior resume" The player referred to is Oakleigh Chargers star Matt Rowell.
Would the same rivals also be filthy if Carlton finish bottom again and secure this player after getting Sam Walsh last year, if they had the opportunity to do so? Would the same rivals be filthy if Richmond or Hawthorn snared this player?
Sydney was slapped with a ban, lost cola when they followed the rules. Gil was quoted as saying that Sydney can't have everyone, obviously he was wrong and should have said that you can't have anyone. This makes my blood boil.

[liz]

According to Jon Ralph in an article in the he states that "It would be a classic Sydney drafting manoeuvre - missing finals for the first time in a decade and snaring No1. overall draft pick....... Further he also states "rivals would br filthy if Sydneys' one trip down the bottom allowed them to secure a player with extraordinary junior resume" The player referred to is Oakleigh Chargers star Matt Rowell.
Would the same rivals also be filthy if Carlton finish bottom again and secure this player after getting Sam Walsh last year, if they had the opportunity to do so? Would the same rivals be filthy if Richmond or Hawthorn snared this player?
Sydney was slapped with a ban, lost cola when they followed the rules. Gil was quoted as saying that Sydney can't have everyone, obviously he was wrong and should have said that you can't have anyone. This makes my blood boil.

So clearly "Ralphy" thinks this is a one-off off-season for the Swans, are we are destined to jump straight back up the ladder, bolstered by our "unfair" acquisition of a good young player by devious means.

What on earth he thinks he means by "a classic Sydney drafting manoeuvre" I have no idea. Can he point to the other instances when the Swans have done this? (I suggest he'll struggle given we haven't missed the finals in a decade, and only three times - I think - in two decades.)

BTW, can you provide a link to the article from which you take Ralph's comments so that we can read it in context?

[chalbilto]

Hi Liz,
I couldn't copy the link, but I have copied and pasted the content below.

Swans dive may pay with swoop for ‘complete’ draft pick
JON RALPH


Matt Rowell.

IT would be a classic Sydney drafting manoeuvre — missing the finals for the first time in a decade and snaring a No.1 overall draft pick who is reminiscent of club legend Paul Kelly.

Sydney’s slump to the bottom of the ladder after seven rounds has them in contention for a player who would instantly rebuild their midfield, Oakleigh Chargers star Matt Rowell.

Rowell’s Chargers coach Leigh Clarke yesterday described midfielder Rowell in one word: “Complete.”

A man who has seen Jordan de Goey, Shaun Higgins and Darcy Moore come through at Oakleigh said he was consistently blown away by Rowell’s consistency and will to win.

Sydney stole Isaac Heeney for pick 18 in the 2014 national draft before securing Callum Mills and Nick Blakey as exceptional academy talent.

Rivals would be filthy if Sydney’s one trip down to the bottom of the ladder allowed them to secure a player with such an extraordinary junior resume.

“With his attributes and traits he is as complete as I have seen,” Clarke said. “He just never gets beaten. As a coach you would never doubt him.

“The biggest comparison I make of him comes from having grown up watching Paul Kelly from the Swans.

“Speaking to Swans recruiters and other players who played against him, Kel would just say, ‘Come on mate, you are having a bad day I will do it for you’.

“He has been best-on-ground in every game at the highest level. He was best-on in the grand final last year, then an Australian (academy) game on AFL grand final day, then beston in an Australian game again (against Casey) last month.”

Rowell had 31 possessions in the TAC Cup final and has this year averaged 159 ranking points in the NAB league.