Expectations for 2021 season

[Ludwig]

Who in their right mind would suggest Mills not up to it ?

Someone did, but it wasn't you. These are just some of the names I think I recall of players bagged in recent weeks.

I wanted to see if we can construct our next premiership side from players that various RWO posters say are just not good enough, or something to that effect.

[Meg]

I'll get it started. Fill in the blanks:

Not Up To It Best 22

B Melican
HB Gould
C Rowbottom Hewett
HF Hayward
F Wicks
Foll Mills
Interchange

[emoji3046]

[NeonBible]

Just my OPINION. I dont see a place for Rowbottom right now. Who is he ahead of in the midfield ? Certainly not Joey, Parker or Mills. Hewett's the tagger. We need Blakey and Florents leg speed. Seventh place goes to .. ?? Unless you are planning on going with an EIGHT man midfield , theres only one spot in the side left for an inside mid. Two young mids RB and Warner. I dont give a rats ass what Rowbottom did last year. We are now in March 2021. Warner looks the form mid of the two atm. Rowbottom had a good game on Sunday but as what ? Barely touched it at the stoppages, failed to win it out of the centre, only made an impact in the forward 50 and collecting loose ball in general play. Maybe he gets a half forward spot, but whose he dislodging from the forward group ?? I'd like to see him in the VFL work on his midfield craft. Reading taps, winning clearances and most of all accumulating. these are things he needs to work on. Warner looked better in these areas which you need to be good in if you are to be an inside midfielder. With your response you make it seem like it is an outrageous assertion that a 3rd year player has things to work on and with competition for spots tightening it is best that these things are worked on in the VFL.

Wicks behind Papley and Gulden, doesnt have their class. Liked what I saw of young Errol, that snap around the body to hit Papley on the chest was textbook Errol. Saw him do that a lot when he played for the ES bulldogs. Cant see a world where Wicks is picked over Gulden.

I have lost track of the reasons why Rowbottom will not be playing rd 1.

He doesnt accumulate enough - debunked by Joey and Parker our leaders being the only 2 midfielders on the weekend to get 20+ touches. It would be great for them to have more support with the other midfielders also having 20+ and sharing the possessions around, but they are YOUNG and all on the upward curve. It will take some time!!

There isnt a place for him in the 22 - debunked by last year’s 7th place finish in the Skilton Medal ! Highly rated internally. David king said so on the broadcast. He is good mates with John Longmire he would know. Has spent the last 12-15 months shadowing none other than Joey Kennedy himself with the specific objective of becoming a future captain, which was initiated by Longmire himself with Brett Kirk and Dean Cox!

Poor summer break / 2021 preseason - debunked by his form! Solid in the practice match, outstanding in the official preseason match. Elevated himself as the games went up. Expect him to do it again when rd 1 comes knocking. Focused on his endurance over the summer. Joined my son’s track club. I would drop him off and Rowbottom had already been there for an hour. I would pick him up 2-3 hours later and Rowbottom would still be there. He looked different, he was sporting a ponytail of some sort but it was him. Met him and seemed like a highly impressive lad, talked at length to my young son who is a mad Swans fan and was frank that improving his fitness was a priority of his. Dedication from a young man entitled to enjoy his free time over the summer break. Very unfair the vitriol lobbed his way from armchair critics who nothing about him.

The same could be said for other common targets. Is it instinct to write Sam Wicks off because he was a cat b rookie ? Kinnear Beatson has a great record with rookie players, they become gems. Why can Sam not continue this tradition ? Or Melican. These players know how hard they have to work because of how hard they have to work just to get on the list at all!! Will hayward another. Two years with injuries that have always struck as hes finding form, and that is enough to throw him to the curb! Lets give these guys a chance to really show what kind of a career they can have. They are all so young.

Most importantly let us stop making sweeping character assessments and assassinations on information we do not have!! If there is evidence that Rowbottom lacks commitment, share it! As i have done on the contrary. If there is proof that Longmire doesnt rate Wicks or Hayward or Melican, like a soundbite from one of the coaches or a complaint from a family member of these players, share it ! Negativity over unknowns is what makes posters believe there is an element of hate or personal grudge in your posts. There are civil ways to raise doubts or concerns over players that can lead to healthy discussions instead of just a barrage of venom that achieves nothing !

[graemed]

Someone did, but it wasn't you. These are just some of the names I think I recall of players bagged in recent weeks.

I wanted to see if we can construct our next premiership side from players that various RWO posters say are just not good enough, or something to that effect.

It occurs to me that I may have inadvertently given oxygen to some arguments regarding RB through my observations during a recent intraclub match.
At the time, I believed he struggled to exert the same influence on games that he had toward the conclusion of last year.
Surely his recent form in both practice matches against genuine opposition cement him in the top 22 and that the match I witnessed was nothing more than a blip on the radar of a stellar career.
Wicks, too, can rest assured that last weeks form was more than coincidental. His form last year clearly established him as someone that the club has faith in.

[Mark26]

I have lost track of the reasons why Rowbottom will not be playing rd 1.

He doesnt accumulate enough - debunked by Joey and Parker our leaders being the only 2 midfielders on the weekend to get 20+ touches. It would be great for them to have more support with the other midfielders also having 20+ and sharing the possessions around, but they are YOUNG and all on the upward curve. It will take some time!!

There isnt a place for him in the 22 - debunked by last year’s 7th place finish in the Skilton Medal ! Highly rated internally. David king said so on the broadcast. He is good mates with John Longmire he would know. Has spent the last 12-15 months shadowing none other than Joey Kennedy himself with the specific objective of becoming a future captain, which was initiated by Longmire himself with Brett Kirk and Dean Cox!

Poor summer break / 2021 preseason - debunked by his form! Solid in the practice match, outstanding in the official preseason match. Elevated himself as the games went up. Expect him to do it again when rd 1 comes knocking. Focused on his endurance over the summer. Joined my son’s track club. I would drop him off and Rowbottom had already been there for an hour. I would pick him up 2-3 hours later and Rowbottom would still be there. He looked different, he was sporting a ponytail of some sort but it was him. Met him and seemed like a highly impressive lad, talked at length to my young son who is a mad Swans fan and was frank that improving his fitness was a priority of his. Dedication from a young man entitled to enjoy his free time over the summer break. Very unfair the vitriol lobbed his way from armchair critics who nothing about him.

The same could be said for other common targets. Is it instinct to write Sam Wicks off because he was a cat b rookie ? Kinnear Beatson has a great record with rookie players, they become gems. Why can Sam not continue this tradition ? Or Melican. These players know how hard they have to work because of how hard they have to work just to get on the list at all!! Will hayward another. Two years with injuries that have always struck as hes finding form, and that is enough to throw him to the curb! Lets give these guys a chance to really show what kind of a career they can have. They are all so young.

Most importantly let us stop making sweeping character assessments and assassinations on information we do not have!! If there is evidence that Rowbottom lacks commitment, share it! As i have done on the contrary. If there is proof that Longmire doesnt rate Wicks or Hayward or Melican, like a soundbite from one of the coaches or a complaint from a family member of these players, share it ! Negativity over unknowns is what makes posters believe there is an element of hate or personal grudge in your posts. There are civil ways to raise doubts or concerns over players that can lead to healthy discussions instead of just a barrage of venom that achieves nothing !

Great post Neon. Thank you.

[longmile]

Personally I see the ladder roughly falling into these 3 categories this season:

Top 6: Brisbane, Richmond, Port, Geelong, St Kilda, Bulldogs

Middle 6: Collingwood, Cartlon, Demons, Giants, Dockers, Eagles

Bottom 6: Hawthorn, Essendon, Adelaide, North, Swans, Suns


While I think the Swans are seriously improving I cant see us making the 8. However, I think we're the best of the bottom 6 teams alongside the Suns. But while, a case could be made for any of the Giants, Demons, Carlton and Collingwood also slipping into the bottom 6, I think realistically we just miss the 8. I'm happy to be wrong.

[mcs]

Personally I see the ladder roughly falling into these 3 categories this season:

Top 6: Brisbane, Richmond, Port, Geelong, St Kilda, Bulldogs

Middle 6: Collingwood, Cartlon, Demons, Giants, Dockers, Eagles

Bottom 6: Hawthorn, Essendon, Adelaide, North, Swans, Suns


While I think the Swans are seriously improving I cant see us making the 8. However, I think we're the best of the bottom 6 teams alongside the Suns. But while, a case could be made for any of the Giants, Demons, Carlton and Collingwood also slipping into the bottom 6, I think realistically we just miss the 8. I'm happy to be wrong.

Pretty fair assessment, although I would swap Suns with Giants, and Eagles with Bulldogs. We should improve, but I doubt will show enough consistency to be any serious challenge to make finals. Like you - very happy to be wrong.

Had to laugh at the 'AFL experts' on their predictions for the season. One had us as the biggest 'sliders' by finishing 1 position lower than last season

- - - Updated - - -

I have lost track of the reasons why Rowbottom will not be playing rd 1.

He doesnt accumulate enough - debunked by Joey and Parker our leaders being the only 2 midfielders on the weekend to get 20+ touches. It would be great for them to have more support with the other midfielders also having 20+ and sharing the possessions around, but they are YOUNG and all on the upward curve. It will take some time!!

There isnt a place for him in the 22 - debunked by last year’s 7th place finish in the Skilton Medal ! Highly rated internally. David king said so on the broadcast. He is good mates with John Longmire he would know. Has spent the last 12-15 months shadowing none other than Joey Kennedy himself with the specific objective of becoming a future captain, which was initiated by Longmire himself with Brett Kirk and Dean Cox!

Poor summer break / 2021 preseason - debunked by his form! Solid in the practice match, outstanding in the official preseason match. Elevated himself as the games went up. Expect him to do it again when rd 1 comes knocking. Focused on his endurance over the summer. Joined my son’s track club. I would drop him off and Rowbottom had already been there for an hour. I would pick him up 2-3 hours later and Rowbottom would still be there. He looked different, he was sporting a ponytail of some sort but it was him. Met him and seemed like a highly impressive lad, talked at length to my young son who is a mad Swans fan and was frank that improving his fitness was a priority of his. Dedication from a young man entitled to enjoy his free time over the summer break. Very unfair the vitriol lobbed his way from armchair critics who nothing about him.

The same could be said for other common targets. Is it instinct to write Sam Wicks off because he was a cat b rookie ? Kinnear Beatson has a great record with rookie players, they become gems. Why can Sam not continue this tradition ? Or Melican. These players know how hard they have to work because of how hard they have to work just to get on the list at all!! Will hayward another. Two years with injuries that have always struck as hes finding form, and that is enough to throw him to the curb! Lets give these guys a chance to really show what kind of a career they can have. They are all so young.

Most importantly let us stop making sweeping character assessments and assassinations on information we do not have!! If there is evidence that Rowbottom lacks commitment, share it! As i have done on the contrary. If there is proof that Longmire doesnt rate Wicks or Hayward or Melican, like a soundbite from one of the coaches or a complaint from a family member of these players, share it ! Negativity over unknowns is what makes posters believe there is an element of hate or personal grudge in your posts. There are civil ways to raise doubts or concerns over players that can lead to healthy discussions instead of just a barrage of venom that achieves nothing !

Thankyou Neon for that summary, which highlights I think the frustrations of many of us. I'm sure there are more reasons to come in coming weeks as to why he isn't AFL standard.

- - - Updated - - -

It occurs to me that I may have inadvertently given oxygen to some arguments regarding RB through my observations during a recent intraclub match.
At the time, I believed he struggled to exert the same influence on games that he had toward the conclusion of last year.
Surely his recent form in both practice matches against genuine opposition cement him in the top 22 and that the match I witnessed was nothing more than a blip on the radar of a stellar career.
Wicks, too, can rest assured that last weeks form was more than coincidental. His form last year clearly established him as someone that the club has faith in.

No issue Graeme with saying he isn't having the best day or anything like that, as you did. Very different to exceedingly unrelaistic expectations that\ he has to outpeform it seems the best players in the game week in, week out to just prove he is at an AFL standard, and that's just in pre-season!

[wolftone57]

I have lost track of the reasons why Rowbottom will not be playing rd 1.

He doesnt accumulate enough - debunked by Joey and Parker our leaders being the only 2 midfielders on the weekend to get 20+ touches. It would be great for them to have more support with the other midfielders also having 20+ and sharing the possessions around, but they are YOUNG and all on the upward curve. It will take some time!!

There isnt a place for him in the 22 - debunked by last year’s 7th place finish in the Skilton Medal ! Highly rated internally. David king said so on the broadcast. He is good mates with John Longmire he would know. Has spent the last 12-15 months shadowing none other than Joey Kennedy himself with the specific objective of becoming a future captain, which was initiated by Longmire himself with Brett Kirk and Dean Cox!

Poor summer break / 2021 preseason - debunked by his form! Solid in the practice match, outstanding in the official preseason match. Elevated himself as the games went up. Expect him to do it again when rd 1 comes knocking. Focused on his endurance over the summer. Joined my son’s track club. I would drop him off and Rowbottom had already been there for an hour. I would pick him up 2-3 hours later and Rowbottom would still be there. He looked different, he was sporting a ponytail of some sort but it was him. Met him and seemed like a highly impressive lad, talked at length to my young son who is a mad Swans fan and was frank that improving his fitness was a priority of his. Dedication from a young man entitled to enjoy his free time over the summer break. Very unfair the vitriol lobbed his way from armchair critics who nothing about him.

The same could be said for other common targets. Is it instinct to write Sam Wicks off because he was a cat b rookie ? Kinnear Beatson has a great record with rookie players, they become gems. Why can Sam not continue this tradition ? Or Melican. These players know how hard they have to work because of how hard they have to work just to get on the list at all!! Will hayward another. Two years with injuries that have always struck as hes finding form, and that is enough to throw him to the curb! Lets give these guys a chance to really show what kind of a career they can have. They are all so young.

Most importantly let us stop making sweeping character assessments and assassinations on information we do not have!! If there is evidence that Rowbottom lacks commitment, share it! As i have done on the contrary. If there is proof that Longmire doesnt rate Wicks or Hayward or Melican, like a soundbite from one of the coaches or a complaint from a family member of these players, share it ! Negativity over unknowns is what makes posters believe there is an element of hate or personal grudge in your posts. There are civil ways to raise doubts or concerns over players that can lead to healthy discussions instead of just a barrage of venom that achieves nothing !

I am sick of player assassination too. The people who do it should look in the mirror and ask themselves 'Is what I see there the real me or is there another, darker, more malicious me just under the surface?'. What is gained by making @@@@ up about players except to satisfy petty hatreds that have no place in any footy club. If a person continually bags a player, any player, they should seriously examine their motivation.

Quite frankly I wish Bruce had not told us Rowie was Big B's nephew. I think this has a lot to do with the Rowbottom hatred and vitriol I see here and on Big Footy. Only from a few fans yes. But enough for me to be totally disgusted that these people denigrate our players with no evidence what so ever. That they are allowed to perpetuate untruths, like his lack of dedication. Cobblers. That's what it is. Cobblers.

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[MightyBloods]

I am sick of player assassination too. The people who do it should look in the mirror and ask themselves 'Is what I see there the real me or is there another, darker, more malicious me just under the surface?'. What is gained by making @@@@ up about players except to satisfy petty hatreds that have no place in any footy club. If a person continually bags a player, any player, they should seriously examine their motivation.

Quite frankly I wish Bruce had not told us Rowie was Big B's nephew. I think this has a lot to do with the Rowbottom hatred and vitriol I see here and on Big Footy. Only from a few fans yes. But enough for me to be totally disgusted that these people denigrate our players with no evidence what so ever. That they are allowed to perpetuate untruths, like his lack of dedication. Cobblers. That's what it is. Cobblers.

Sent from my JAT-L29 using Tapatalk

I posted a similar post about a week ago but it didn't make it past the auditor-in-chief. I guess my mistake was calling out the specific people and I admit I was a little more direct. I've never really enjoyed people with a glass half empty approach and fake facts annoy the heck out of me.

[TheBloods]

I have lost track of the reasons why Rowbottom will not be playing rd 1.

He doesnt accumulate enough - debunked by Joey and Parker our leaders being the only 2 midfielders on the weekend to get 20+ touches. It would be great for them to have more support with the other midfielders also having 20+ and sharing the possessions around, but they are YOUNG and all on the upward curve. It will take some time!!

There isnt a place for him in the 22 - debunked by last year’s 7th place finish in the Skilton Medal ! Highly rated internally. David king said so on the broadcast. He is good mates with John Longmire he would know. Has spent the last 12-15 months shadowing none other than Joey Kennedy himself with the specific objective of becoming a future captain, which was initiated by Longmire himself with Brett Kirk and Dean Cox!

Poor summer break / 2021 preseason - debunked by his form! Solid in the practice match, outstanding in the official preseason match. Elevated himself as the games went up. Expect him to do it again when rd 1 comes knocking. Focused on his endurance over the summer. Joined my son’s track club. I would drop him off and Rowbottom had already been there for an hour. I would pick him up 2-3 hours later and Rowbottom would still be there. He looked different, he was sporting a ponytail of some sort but it was him. Met him and seemed like a highly impressive lad, talked at length to my young son who is a mad Swans fan and was frank that improving his fitness was a priority of his. Dedication from a young man entitled to enjoy his free time over the summer break. Very unfair the vitriol lobbed his way from armchair critics who nothing about him.

The same could be said for other common targets. Is it instinct to write Sam Wicks off because he was a cat b rookie ? Kinnear Beatson has a great record with rookie players, they become gems. Why can Sam not continue this tradition ? Or Melican. These players know how hard they have to work because of how hard they have to work just to get on the list at all!! Will hayward another. Two years with injuries that have always struck as hes finding form, and that is enough to throw him to the curb! Lets give these guys a chance to really show what kind of a career they can have. They are all so young.

Most importantly let us stop making sweeping character assessments and assassinations on information we do not have!! If there is evidence that Rowbottom lacks commitment, share it! As i have done on the contrary. If there is proof that Longmire doesnt rate Wicks or Hayward or Melican, like a soundbite from one of the coaches or a complaint from a family member of these players, share it ! Negativity over unknowns is what makes posters believe there is an element of hate or personal grudge in your posts. There are civil ways to raise doubts or concerns over players that can lead to healthy discussions instead of just a barrage of venom that achieves nothing !

Hi NB, thank you for a level headed response . I see my thoughts on Rowbottom have not been well received, have led to anger. That is not my intent. It is common on RWO to see Swans players discussed as missing out on the 22 or needing to improve majorly in parts of their game . I f i had a dime for every negative or critical thing said about Sam Reid or Jake Lloyd or Melican or Hayward or Ryan Clarke i would be able to buy a place in Rose Bay. They are commonly debated types and so you say something negative about them and it is given a blind eye . I so happen to consider Rowbottom to be at that stage as a player. When hes on he is very good I have said this too many times to count . But he has major areas that he needs to improve on to be a lock in the 22 and to keep his status as one of our premium young players. Saying these things does not mean i am saying he will be delisted by 2024. i just want to see him improve, and he shouldnt be above criticism. You dont see it that way , more power to you. I just call it as i see it and you dont have to agree with it.

Maybe that i am not completely sold on his ability means i see everything he does through a critical lense. It appears that because you are sold on his ability you see everything he does through a glowing lense. Eg. Im unsure that he is unique for doing some kind of personal training regime on the side . I think there would be dozens hundreds even in the AFL doing the same type of programs in their off-seasons. & your anecdote about him being primed for future captaincy ?? Huh? Evidence ?? I doubt Longmire told you this himself.

I will call a truce on Rowbottom because he is obviously a much loved player by the Swans fans and i am not out to denigrate the character of any Bloods player past or present . I have faith he will be a good servant for our great club like many before him and hopefully i have clarified that there is no personal vendetta against him OR his uncle but i just dont view him as highly as the majority do and so if i am mentioning him it is because i see him in that contentious group worth discussing and not YET a safe bet who we know will perform every week to justify his selection in our best side.

[Scottee]

I'm not angry with you TheBloods.I just think you are a terrible judge of a player.

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[Thunder Shaker]

Had to laugh at the 'AFL experts' on their predictions for the season. One had us as the biggest 'sliders' by finishing 1 position lower than last season

That shows a lack of imagination and knowledge of history. It's normal for two or three sides that made the finals one year to miss out on the next. Here's what the experts actually did with the top eight in their ladder predictions:

Damian Barrett: 7 of last year's top 8. Sydney in, Collingwood out.
Riley Beveridge: 8 of last year's top 8.
Sarah Black: 8 of last year's top 8.
Mitch Cleary: 8 of last year's top 8.
Cameron Noakes: 6 of last year's top 8. Fremantle and Melbourne in, Collingwood and St Kilda out.
Nathan Schmook: 7 of last year's top 8. Fremantle in, Collingwood out.
Callum Twomey: 7 of last year's top 8. Carlton in, St Kilda out.
Michael Whiting: 7 of last year's top 8. GWS in, Collingwood out.

So read that again: Collingwood made the finals in eighth by half a game last year, butchered their player management, and most of these experts are picking Collingwood to make the finals again with six other sides breathing down their necks? That is not going to happen.

[Thunder Shaker]

My top 8:
* Brisbane
* Port Adelaide
* Richmond
* Western Bulldogs
* Melbourne
* Geelong
* St Kilda
* Carlton

(Sydney to finish 11th)

[barry]

If your second thought indicates your opinion, how do you reconcile your first?
I'm puzzled.

Allir went to Port Adelaide, not the Adelaide crows.

[barry]

Personally I see the ladder roughly falling into these 3 categories this season:

Top 6: Brisbane, Richmond, Port, Geelong, St Kilda, Bulldogs

Middle 6: Collingwood, Cartlon, Demons, Giants, Dockers, Eagles

Bottom 6: Hawthorn, Essendon, Adelaide, North, Swans, Suns
.

Good analysis. I would actually swap the Sun's (into middle) because stewy dew is about to deliver, and Collingwood (into bottom) because the implosion has plenty to play out yet.

Port will be very hard to beat.