2021 trading, drafting and list management: players and personnel

[Mark26]

I really can’t see us being too active in the trade period this year. A KPD would be our highest priority.

I think our need for a second ruck has dissipated with the emergence of Amartey. Medium term we will need a ruck but I’m happy to stick with a depth chart for 2022 of Hickey, Amartey, Sinclair, McLean, McAndrew.

Agree with most of this, but think don't think Sinkers is up to it. I'd prefer another young ruck prospect in his place, but ultimately, KB and the coaches know what they're doing.

[Aprilbr]

I really can’t see us being too active in the trade period this year. A KPD would be our highest priority.

I think our need for a second ruck has dissipated with the emergence of Amartey. Medium term we will need a ruck but I’m happy to stick with a depth chart for 2022 of Hickey, Amartey, Sinclair, McLean, McAndrew.

The following are my views on our current ruck depth for what its worth:

Amartey is a genuine athletic talent who has improved markedly. Definitely worth preserving with but still has plenty to learn.

McLean has shown little to indicate he is a good second ruck option. He has a good pair of hands though. I suspect he will ask to be traded at the end of the season if he cannot get a regular senior game. I think one or two clubs may chase him for his marking ability.

McAndrew is very raw. Its far too early to tell whether or not he will make it. It could take several seasons for him to develop as he is still learning the game.

Sinclair is unlikely to be offered another contract unless for pure depth purposes.

[Auntie.Gerald]

If Hickey went down for a season and Amartey was our no1 ruck...........would that affect a few wins becoming losses due to having much less impact in the ruck ?

My gut feeling is that we have been in a much better position most games because of Hickey and our mids have functioned better also...........we could honestly be 2 or 3 less wins without Hickey in 2021

ie 8th to 13th on the ladder are tied for 8 wins and that could have been us without Hickey and as it turns out again Bud. Take one or both of these guys out for significant parts of the season and we are a 8 win team in my humble opinion. They have serious impact on our results.

I wonder if we need to replace Sinkers with another emerging genuine ruck that may have played 10 to 30 games in Snrs?

[Auntie.Gerald]

It tends to be a web of events that work for for you and or against you

for me my top3 impacts for 2021 are:

1. The Don joining and influencing our new style of play with faster kids complimenting our rugged mids etc........the style fits like a glove so far. It may not win a GF but it is a step in the right direction

2. Bud kicking goals and playing regularly is just huge........the guy pings goals that others can not do regularly as he does......I mean take Tom Hawkins out of Geelong and they would struggle to win as consistently

3. Hickey massive difference in the ruck and opportunity for our mids galore to prosper

[i'm-uninformed2]

I wonder if the issue with Sinkers is less about us choosing for him, but him choosing for us.

Don’t get me wrong here: the guy has been a terrific servant. He joined as a forward-ruck, but was tasked with playing as the primary ruck for a couple of seasons and did it fantastically.

But, his body has been battered and he looks it. He might decide he’s had enough.

[AB Swannie]

It is true that Hickey would be a big loss if he went down for the season and we had to ruck one of our backups. However, the same would be true for almost every other AFL team. Plan B will always be worse than plan A.

It is very hard to recruit an AFL caliber ruck when they will be relying on an injury to be first choice.

[Roadrunner]

It is true that Hickey would be a big loss if he went down for the season and we had to ruck one of our backups. However, the same would be true for almost every other AFL team. Plan B will always be worse than plan A.

It is very hard to recruit an AFL caliber ruck when they will be relying on an injury to be first choice.

Agreed, but the ruck position is the one most prone to injury. Hence it requires the most cover. That’s why I think we need another genuine ready made ruckman and then rotate them so they all get a certain number of games. This way, we would also minimise the risk to injury. Someone like Choi would be great!

[Goal Sneak]

Didn't we get Hickey as a back up for Naismith? If so, it makes sense that we would now be looking for a back up for Hickey

[AB Swannie]

I’d be happy to recruit a back up ruck but I think it would be best if they were pure ruck. Mabior is a fwd/ruck and we already have a few of those. A pure ruck like Lloyd Meek, Max Lynch, or Sam Hayes would be nice. Perhaps they would be happy to come here with a greater chance to get games in 2022 and particularly 2023 rather than being behind Darcy, Grundy, or Lycett respectively.

[Ruck'n'Roll]

Agreed, but the ruck position is the one most prone to injury. Hence it requires the most cover. That’s why I think we need another genuine ready made ruckman and then rotate them so they all get a certain number of games. This way, we would also minimise the risk to injury. Someone like Choi would be great!

Can you think of any successfull examples of a pair of genuine ready made ruckman rotating in and out of the side? I can't at the moment.
I'm not saying it can't happen, but like unicorns and a successfull coaching succession plan, they're not very common.

FWIW I think that scarcity is due to the intrinsic nature of ruckmen. One of them has to be #1 and until that is determined to their satisfacion, they will keep on contesting, and sometimes get hurt doing so, sort of like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gKHUZ1K3JHY.

The ruck remains the last truly atavistic position left in AFL.

Even when damaged they usually try to play hurt rather than yeld their pre-eminance even temporarily. Ian Stewart once commented that if a doctor declared Barry Round dead, he would seek a second opinion. Round had to play because in his mind the next best ruckman at the club was never going to be as good as he was even when injured - even if that other ruckman had a Brownlow medal. There's a bit of that in all genuine ruckmen.

That competativeness also applies with playing two genuine ruckmen in the same team. Harmonious co-existance depends on an unassailed pecking order being established. And even then it usually results in the 2nd ruckman performing at less that their full capability - most often by trying to pass themselves off as a key forward (a bit like painting stripes ona Giraffe and telling it that it's a zebra).

The only exeptions I can think of seems to be if one ruckman is close to retirement (Jolley/Ball). Or if the second ruck is not a serious challenge to #1 (Mummy/Pike).

Hickey will be 31 by the start of next season, so we could bring in another genuine ready made ruckman and have them coexist - if he was young enough (early 20's) and confident that his time was immanent.

[Aprilbr]

"The ruck remains the last truly atavistic position left in AFL."

Nice word, Ruckn Roll! I would be pretty confident that this is the first time that word has ever been used on this forum!

The current trend is clearly for teams to play just one genuine ruckman with a backup forward option. Its been that way for several seasons now. However, trends change and who knows what will be rhe case down the yack? Two rucks were certainly common one decade ago.

[bloodspirit]

"The ruck remains the last truly atavistic position left in AFL."

Nice word, Ruckn Roll! I would be pretty confident that this is the first time that word has ever been used on this forum!

I couldn't resist checking. It turns out you're nearly right. The same word was used by the RnR in July 2004, also in a trading context:

"I think discussions of player trades brings out the most atavistic comments from Swans fans,
Just imagine what the fans of Richmond, Collingwood etc. must be like in this mode."

[bloodspirit]

I'm in the camp that thinks we need to bring in at least one more ruck. And maybe two if Sinclair departs.

I also agree that we should favour a pure ruck over a ruck-forward like Chol. We should only draft a ruck-forward if we first draft a pure ruck and the other recruit is better than Amartey. I think Chol is better than Amartey.

I like various of the names that have been thrown up (like those AB mentioned). I don't think that Ceglar is a daft suggestion but a younger, heir-apparent type would be preferable.

Also agree that KPP is another strong need. Again, I'd be glad if we got more than one e.g. a trade in plus Paddy McCartin.

I am not convinced we will be insignificant in the trade period again this year. While we certainly will be relying primarily on the team we have built, I think now is the time to start topping up and refining it. Importantly this means thinking about who, with currency, we might be prepared to trade out - not just who we would like to get in.

Hewett is one name that has been thrown up - but we would be looking a bit unprepared to face JPK's retirement if we don't also get another strong inside player in. Florent is a fine player but perhaps not indispensable? I'd be a bit nervous about trading him because he hasn't hit his ceiling yet but I'm mindful that you've got to give something to get something. Plus our team is a little light on for experience and we can't easily afford to be giving up a player who is approaching 100 games.

[i'm-uninformed2]

I'm in the camp that thinks we need to bring in at least one more ruck. And maybe two if Sinclair departs.

I also agree that we should favour a pure ruck over a ruck-forward like Chol. We should only draft a ruck-forward if we first draft a pure ruck and the other recruit is better than Amartey. I think Chol is better than Amartey.

I like various of the names that have been thrown up (like those AB mentioned). I don't think that Ceglar is a daft suggestion but a younger, heir-apparent type would be preferable.

Also agree that KPP is another strong need. Again, I'd be glad if we got more than one e.g. a trade in plus Paddy McCartin.

I am not convinced we will be insignificant in the trade period again this year. While we certainly will be relying primarily on the team we have built, I think now is the time to start topping up and refining it. Importantly this means thinking about who, with currency, we might be prepared to trade out - not just who we would like to get in.

Hewett is one name that has been thrown up - but we would be looking a bit unprepared to face JPK's retirement if we don't also get another strong inside player in. Florent is a fine player but perhaps not indispensable? I'd be a bit nervous about trading him because he hasn't hit his ceiling yet but I'm mindful that you've got to give something to get something. Plus our team is a little light on for experience and we can't easily afford to be giving up a player who is approaching 100 games.

So let's talk about Ollie. Personally, I'd keep him. He had some good games, particularly early in the year, and has otherwise been ok - but no more.

I'd like the coaches to find a way to get more out of his talent. They seem to have stopped throwing him into the centre square (where he didn't look comfortable). As an outside player, he doesn't break the lines the way a JMac or even Blakey is starting to. He's also yet to truly impose himself on a big game.

Depending on list management etc, here's the competition for midfield spots come 2023 (post Kennedy): Parker, Mills, Heeney, Hewett, Chad, JB, Dawson, Gulden, JMac, Stephens, maybe Sheather, maybe Campbell (only say maybe on those two as haven't played seniors there), even Blakey back on a wing. Plus, whatever comes in next two drafts. So the pressure is on.

But you watch what Parish and Merrett did yesterday, or what JMac does on a weekly basis now, and hope that is what Ollie aspires to. Parish himself is evidence some blokes take longer than others, so there is still time, and he has a lot to offer if he gets it right. And I hope he succeeds. I just sometimes find him a little frustrating because I think he can be even better.

[Faunac8]

Just wanting to confirm something I have seen a couple of posters use JB as an abbreviation for one of our players now on first seeing it I assumed James Bell but it appears this may be in fact be intended to a reference to James Rowbottom ?
If so is it just a typo or am I missing something obvious ?