Hawthorn racism review

[Matty10]

I'll give you one reason why the Hawthorn players mightn't have wanted their names bandied about. Adam Goodes.

Of course. But there is a difference between public and private anonymity.

[KTigers]

.... and in Breaking News.... the Sydney Swans meet the Geelong Cats at the MCG tomorrow to decide the 2022
AFL Premiership....

[liz]

This is a footy forum. Discuss the Hawks report and ABC article if you wish, but please take your analysis of the Australian media landscape to Open Chat.

[KTigers]

There's a good article by Stan Grant on the ABC Grandstand (or is just the ABC) site. Hopefully the mention of these
three capital letters won't send everyone off the deep end again. Because shooting (or defending) the messenger is not
really the point.
I suspect in the end with this Hawthorn saga we'll be reminded that there are some really blurry lines in the
already very unequal coach-player "relationship". And some equally fuzzy lines in what is acceptable behaviour in the
quest for football's holy grail.

[707]

I've sat on the sidelines during this but we were chatting on the plane about the upcoming AFL enquiry. How can this possibly have an outcome that doesn't mortally wound Clarko & Fagan coaching careers?

In one corner we have at least three Hawthorn players who have given harrowing accounts of their treatment at the club at the hands of the coaching staff.

In the other corner we have Clarko & Fagan & others likely saying this didn't happen.

It becomes a he said versus he said.

If the inquiry finds in the players favour, careers overs and lifelong shame. If the inquiry finds in Hawks favour, players were lying to the media and Hawks own inquiry.

AFL would be rightly worried, will be working very hard, as they do, to manufacture an 'all smells roses' outcome. Fascinating watch from here

[stevoswan]

I've sat on the sidelines during this but we were chatting on the plane about the upcoming AFL enquiry. How can this possibly have an outcome that doesn't mortally wound Clarko & Fagan coaching careers?

In one corner we have at least three Hawthorn players who have given harrowing accounts of their treatment at the club at the hands of the coaching staff.

In the other corner we have Clarko & Fagan & others likely saying this didn't happen.

It becomes a he said versus he said.

If the inquiry finds in the players favour, careers overs and lifelong shame. If the inquiry finds in Hawks favour, players were lying to the media and Hawks own inquiry.

AFL would be rightly worried, will be working very hard, as they do, to manufacture an 'all smells roses' outcome. Fascinating watch from here

It wonn't necessarily imply that as fact.....it could just mean the 'inquiry' was a sham to save face for the league, the club and two 'respected' figures in the game, to which your last sentence alludes.

[Blood Fever]

I've sat on the sidelines during this but we were chatting on the plane about the upcoming AFL enquiry. How can this possibly have an outcome that doesn't mortally wound Clarko & Fagan coaching careers?

In one corner we have at least three Hawthorn players who have given harrowing accounts of their treatment at the club at the hands of the coaching staff.

In the other corner we have Clarko & Fagan & others likely saying this didn't happen.

It becomes a he said versus he said.

If the inquiry finds in the players favour, careers overs and lifelong shame. If the inquiry finds in Hawks favour, players were lying to the media and Hawks own inquiry.

AFL would be rightly worried, will be working very hard, as they do, to manufacture an 'all smells roses' outcome. Fascinating watch from here

Notice that Clarkson has released another more detailed statement denying the allegations. When confidential material is leaked and the journos create a trial by media environment, it wrecks the chances of a fair hearing for both the claimants and the defendants.

[stevoswan]

Notice that Clarkson has released another more detailed statement denying the allegations. When confidential material is leaked and the journos create a trial by media environment, it wrecks the chances of a fair hearing for both the claimants and the defendants.

Clarkson and Fagan were offered 24 hrs + a 6 hr extension to respond to these allegations. They chose not to while knowing this story was going to be published, effectively condemning themselves to trial by media.

[i'm-uninformed2]

The Newbold stuff is damning for him and his excuse pathetic.

"The response, even though it was marked as being sent from my iphone, wasn't written or seen by me and wasn't from my phone."

Oh please.

[Blood Fever]

Clarkson and Fagan were offered 24 hrs + a 6 hr extension to respond to these allegations. They chose not to while knowing this story was going to be published, effectively condemning themselves to trial by media.

They didn't break confidentiality and leak the report nor did they publish it.

[KTigers]

I just don’t think this thing is going to be as simple as “he said v he said”. The role of the
senior coach goes beyond just football. In some respects they can become almost like
father figures to young players sometimes. Especially when there is an absence of them
in the players lives. And as such the coaches will get involved and offer advice in aspects
of the players lives outside of footy.
I’m sure Clarko or Fagan didn’t tell Young Player A to tell his partner to have a termination
and offer to drive her down to the clinic. But they might have have said, “Hey mate, your
game is really starting to gel right now and over the next period it’s very important
you focus 100% on footy without distractions and be the very best player you can be”.
And absolutely I can see how Young Player A might have read this advice in the way
they have stated. We can just take Young Player A at their word. Only they know
what they heard or how they interpreted what they heard.
Senior coaches should know they hold a lot of influence over players careers. It makes
sense that they will use this influence, but once they get into father figure territory they
should tread very carefully. Because they aren’t the players father, they are not part of
the players family.

[Maltopia]

I just don’t think this thing is going to be as simple as “he said v he said”. The role of the
senior coach goes beyond just football. In some respects they can become almost like
father figures to young players sometimes. Especially when there is an absence of them
in the players lives. And as such the coaches will get involved and offer advice in aspects
of the players lives outside of footy.
I’m sure Clarko or Fagan didn’t tell Young Player A to tell his partner to have a termination
and offer to drive her down to the clinic. But they might have have said, “Hey mate, your
game is really starting to gel right now and over the next period it’s very important
you focus 100% on footy without distractions and be the very best player you can be”.
And absolutely I can see how Young Player A might have read this advice in the way
they have stated. We can just take Young Player A at their word. Only they know
what they heard or how they interpreted what they heard.

How can you be sure Clarke didn’t as alleged, lean over and tell the player he was better off not having the baby?

When the Essendon injection scandal broke, many found it incredulous that the coaches etc would engage in injecting players with substances that they ultimately didn’t know where banned peptides.

Gil has said the report contains similar allegations (of isolating players from their family) from the other 18 players.

That is a lot of people with similar stories suggesting their might be fire after all the smoke.

[KTigers]

I'm sure there will be some fire there. But what I'm saying is the coaches may have been playing with some matches that they should
have left in the cupboard. They like to think their matches are safe but they aren't really. This country has a very long history of white
fellas telling black fellas how to live their lives and then expressing a lot of surprise when their advice is not appreciated. And so now
we are hearing about how Clarko is "deeply offended" and that Fagan has assembled his "legal team". Things are going well.

[707]

The Newbold stuff is damning for him and his excuse pathetic.

"The response, even though it was marked as being sent from my iphone, wasn't written or seen by me and wasn't from my phone."

Oh please.

Same excuse as Federal MP Craig Thompson!

[Maltopia]

Paragraph from Fox Sports article today, which claims a former COACH has also expressed concerns (but not about the specific allegations by the three families that have had their stories reported on so far).

“The Herald Sun on Tuesday reported that the Hawks’ review of its handling of Indigenous players revealed an unnamed Hawks coach accused former Hawthorn player development manager Jason Burt, Clarkson, Fagan and former football boss Mark Evans of operating the football department “like The Russian Mafia”.

https://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/hawthorn-email-bombshell-rocks-afl-as-racism-scandal-widens-following-external-review/news-story/100b6b8e20baba65c39a8ec415737b4f