Trade Whispers / Rumours and Confirmations

[desredandwhite]

We did the same thing after 2005 - Schneider and Dempster basically donated to St Kilda. Fringe players are the first to go when we have a cap squeeze.

Is Mumford worth more? Sure he is. But he wanted to go, we couldn't match the money, and he could have walked to the PSD. Getting pick 35 isn't great, but it's better than nothing.

If you look at it over the last two years as: IN: Tippett and Franklin. OUT: Mumford, Everitt, Armstrong, White, then it probably looks just fine.

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We did the same thing after 2005 - Schneider and Dempster basically donated to St Kilda. Fringe players are the first to go when we have a cap squeeze.

Is Mumford worth more? Sure he is. But he wanted to go, we couldn't match the money, and he could have walked to the PSD. Getting pick 35 isn't great, but it's better than nothing.

If you look at it over the last two years as: IN: Tippett and Franklin. OUT: Mumford, Everitt, Armstrong, White, then it probably looks just fine.

[ugg]

I actually think we're very lucky to get pick 35, I believe looking at the draft order it's a pick that GWS will not be using and that's why they're willing to let it go. I'm not saying that's Mumford's intrinsic worth, but that's not usually how trades play out.

[wolftone57]

So far there is nothing looking as a PSD prospect for GWS, so taking Mummy with PSD pick 1 would not have cost them anything. Although it does open the door to lose Everitt in the PSD. Hopefully, we would have taken that into consideration before doing the deal with GWS. Perhaps we are willing to lose both for pick 39.

What goes around comes around. Now Mummy will be telling the kids at GWS what a great club the Swans are to play for; when some of their high draft picks can't get a game, they'll be looking our way.

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It's not a matter of player quality in that range, but rather, from a practical standpoint (list size and rookie upgrade considerations) we can't use them all.

We have picks 14, 31 & 35 Ludwig. I should think we would be using them all if they are our first three picks even if two are in the thirties. The AFL might be waiting until the end of the trade period to fix the Buddy compensation. In other words just waiting to see what our best draft picks are.

[Ajn]

Happy with the in's and not complaining about Franklin (yes Jewels I'm talking to you) just stating the impact of a big recruit has a bearing on depth.

Just was hoping to get some better picks to stock up on talent, but happy to back the recruiting team in.
Our 2nd and 3rd round picks have been the best in the comp, if anything have struggled on 1st round picks...

[Ludwig]

We have picks 14, 31 & 35 Ludwig. I should think we would be using them all if they are our first three picks even if two are in the thirties. The AFL might be waiting until the end of the trade period to fix the Buddy compensation. In other words just waiting to see what our best draft picks are.

I was anticipating at least another pick for White and Armstrong, probably around #45. And then, who knows what will happen with Dre.

I agree that we look to be using our first 3 picks, but then what value is there from what we get for White and perhaps Everitt?

This is why I said we should package up a few picks to get higher in the draft.

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I actually think we're very lucky to get pick 35, I believe looking at the draft order it's a pick that GWS will not be using and that's why they're willing to let it go. I'm not saying that's Mumford's intrinsic worth, but that's not usually how trades play out.

I agree with you on this. We tend to get players on the cheap and lose them the same way, so it all evens out. Actually, we seem to come out well ahead with this strategy over the long run.

[DK_]

I'm pretty sure that if Buddy wasn't a free agent and we traded Hawthorn those players for him, it'd be high fives all round in the Swans camp and the Melbourne media would be awash with conspiracy theories about what really happened. (Some variation of AFL brokered it no doubt).

The fact of the matter is that, even without Franklin, with the exception of Mumford all of those players would struggle to break into our 22 and are better off career-wise with another club where they'll get a run and an opportunity to develop at AFL level. White and Everitt will play every week where they're going and that's what they need to keep their career going. For the Swans, list-wise, they're at an age where, if they're not in the starting 22, they need to be moved on to make room for the next generation.

Mumford is a shame, he was a great player and very important to us over the last couple of years. There's no overstating how hard it will be to replace the capability he provided. But Pyke has done well during the periods where Mumford was injured and if any club could swap Mumford for Franklin, there'd be little doubt about which way they'd go.

[lwjoyner]

rolled over again, don't know what was wrong with their pick 21 or 22 they got from Demons. Our recruiting is good in one way but poor when dealing with something out in the open. Why do we roll over. We will do the same with pies.

[lwjoyner]

Our negotiators are weak when it comes to letting people go to other clubs, 2 p/ship ruckmen in a couple of years at least we go (I think a 1st rnd) but pick 35 that is disgraceful. I know he could go in PSD but we should have hung on for 21 or 22 which they got from Demons. I bet Pies do a better deal for Shaw. Pathetic.

[Ludwig]

Happy with the in's and not complaining about Franklin (yes Jewels I'm talking to you) just stating the impact of a big recruit has a bearing on depth.

Just was hoping to get some better picks to stock up on talent, but happy to back the recruiting team in.
Our 2nd and 3rd round picks have been the best in the comp, if anything have struggled on 1st round picks...

There is a misconception about what constitutes depth.

For example, if you took the best 22 from both the Swans and Hawthorn and that became your squad of 44 players, you would have players like Rohan, Reid and Gunston playing all year in the reserves. At the end of the year they would rightfully asked to be traded.

You can't have too many players in their prime not playing senior footy.

What constitutes depth is to have a good list of development players that are capable of stepping in if a senior player is injured. Players like Lamb, Cunningham and BJ fall into this category.

Also, players that are over 30 that are still capable, but are competing with younger players to make the best 22. Perhaps Shaw and LRT will fall into this category. Geelong let go a few in this category to make room for younger players.

Players like Mummy, White and Everitt are not really depth players because they are capable of senior selection in most sides, just not the Swans. It's not fair to hold back their careers to play reserves footy at the Swans, or in the case of Mummy, get a contract of a lifetime.

Tony Armstrong is what you would call a depth player: He's capable of playing senior footy, but when he does play in the seniors we can't wait for him to go back to the reserves.

If you look at our list and count the numbers, you'll see that we actually have a lot of depth in the team even without these players.

[CureTheSane]

rolled over again, don't know what was wrong with their pick 21 or 22 they got from Demons. Our recruiting is good in one way but poor when dealing with something out in the open. Why do we roll over. We will do the same with pies.

From what I've read here recently, the answer to your question is because
1. Swans management are top blokes/girls
2. We got Buddy cheap and therefore shouldn't worry too much about other trades - just be happy with the overall picture
3. We don't want to 'rock the Melbourne boat' in being greedy

[ugg]

Shaw is contracted.

[Ludwig]

I think we should hand over our first round pick and Jesse White to Adelaide, just for the sake of fairness. It was pathetic how we rolled them over.

[magic.merkin]

Our negotiators are weak when it comes to letting people go to other clubs, 2 p/ship ruckmen in a couple of years at least we go (I think a 1st rnd) but pick 35 that is disgraceful. I know he could go in PSD but we should have hung on for 21 or 22 which they got from Demons. I bet Pies do a better deal for Shaw. Pathetic.

Shaw was contracted, they had bargaining power.

Mummy is out of contract, and GWS has first pick of the PSD if we decline the trade and force him to the PSD.

No idea what other outcome you think they could have forced by just saying no?

we had no hand.

[magic.merkin]

But it will be interesting when Jetts, Hannas, Reid, Parker, Johnno & Smithy all come out of contract. There is the solid depth of a premiership team, take that out and you become ordinary with a few mega stars.

this is around the time our 3 dual premiership players retire freeing up cash in the middle period of tippets contract $ declining and buddy's increasing.

All good in the hood.

[lwjoyner]

I guess you can see I am 'Pi" off as a swan supporter. I liked the Buddy get when it happened but I am not so sure now. We tend to roll over too much don't rock the boat attitude. Again I reiterate a p/ship ruckman for 35 which will end up 40 or so. You watch Eddie everywhere wont roll over.