2017 trading, drafting, list management

[royboy42]

man why are the Swans not active in this trade period, they should be trading away Tippett, Reid, Jones

If you're serious with this post, why?

[AnnieH]

Straight off the bat I'm thinking Jesse White...You never know what another club may think will make them better.

Didn't happen for Jessie, did it?

[ugg]

Watts's manager Paul Connors rules out a move to the Swans

Chase for Watts down to two

Connors said Sydney?s bursting salary cap and list vacancies were factors ruling out the Swans from luring the 196cm forward.

[bloodspirit]

We don't need to pull any other strings moving people to rookie lists, already have four vacancies plus two we choose not to fill for cap reasons.

38 minus BJ, Leonardis, Talia, Laidler = 34 = Melican = 35. Can have up to 40 on the senior list. I reiterate that our third pick at 51/52 is highly speculative.

You can't delist contracted players like Rose, Tippett etc without them agreeing and I can't see that happening. We have enough vacant positions.

Just the points I wanted to make.

While I otherwise broadly agree with liz and Ludwig too.

However don't agree with Ludwig's assessment of our bottom 3, particularly not with Murray being in it. Ronke was injured most of the year and so is hard to assess from outside the club. Pink is very young and raw so probably bottom 3 now but with potential. AJ is also returning from injury so very hard to assess but based only on his on field performance this year I'd have him bottom 3. It remains to be seen whether he can turn this around.

Personally I'm not a big fan of Foote at AFL level. He's useful depth and great at NEAFL but I would like to keep Murray because I think he can be better than Foote. I think (and hope) Foote is going to be left behind by all the other talent coming. Even Ronke has promise to be a similar but better player.

COR is similar to Murray although I think Murray performed better this year. Hopefully the return of Tadgh to coach NEAFL is going to be a massive boon for COR and his development will be boosted, even if only from a morale point of view because Shawry is going to be a hard act to follow.

Not objectively bottom 3 but I have gone off Rose this year. Looking like players like Florent and Dawson might jump him in the queue (as Hayward already has) when a vacancy comes available unless he has a massive off season and pre season. Fisher could overtake Rose too if he continues developing well, although these guys are not goal kickers in the same mould as Rose.

[Scottee]

I don't think delisting contracted players is expressly prohibited in the CBA, but perhaps it's part of a standard player contract or even some specific contracts. I know contracted players have to be paid out their contracts if they are delisted. There was the Joel Patful delisting and redrafting as a rookie which was connected to contractual considerations.

I agree with 707 that pick 51 is not of much value and can be used for a player upgrade if needed.

Thinking about our current list, I would place Murray in the bottom 3 players, along with Ronke and Pink. It's going to be hard to keep these kind of players if another club is willing to give them immediate senior playing opportunities and a better contract.

Murray sounds like a good fit for Gold Coast, considering that they are losing a similar player in Adam Saad. If Stewie Dew rates him, GC would be in the drivers seat if they want him. Murray can turn down our contract, delist himself and go into the PSD where GC have a pick before Collingwood.

Couldn't disagree more with your assessment of Murray and Pink. They are at the top of my list of rookies with potential along with Fisher.Pink is the youngest and physically the most immature on the list. Will come back sigificantly bigger stronger and better next year.

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[troyjones2525]

Watts's manager Paul Connors rules out a move to the Swans

Chase for Watts down to two

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I honesty feel we will regret him moving on to a premiership rival. He has all the tools we need as another versatile forward half player.

Looks like we'll be a 1 trick pony again in 2018...

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[moocher]

I'm wondering where our improvement is going to come from in 2018. We had a dream run with injuries after the first 6 weeks of the season but fell again badly in the finals.
Some of the younger players like Heeney, Mills, Florent and Hayward may improve but it is hard to see Buddy, JPK, Parker,McVeigh, Jack, Grundy, Smith or even Rampe improving much.
I'd just like to see us add a player or two who has good foot skills to reduce our turnovers. A bit more speed on the outside would also be welcome.
Watts may have been such a player given the Swans record of turning players...we'll never know.

[Ludwig]

Couldn't disagree more with your assessment of Murray and Pink. They are at the top of my list of rookies with potential along with Fisher.Pink is the youngest and physically the most immature on the list. Will come back sigificantly bigger stronger and better next year.

I am not negative on any of our rookies, but someone has to be at the bottom. We are only talking about 6 players anyway, as I think we would have to rank players like Foote and Rose higher than Murray because they perform well in the NEAFL and have some AFL experience. I rate COR and Fisher the highest because I feel they have the most AFL ready game. Fox has played AFL and did okay, so I have to rate him a bit higher too. That just leaves Murray, Ronke and Pink. I like them all, but the ones who were lower a couple of weeks back have been delisted.

I honesty feel we will regret him moving on to a premiership rival. He has all the tools we need as another versatile forward half player.

Looks like we'll be a 1 trick pony again in 2018...

And what trick would that be? I think the equation is simple on Watts. If Tippett stays we can't afford Watts. We don't have to debate this further because it's a non-starter.

I'm wondering where our improvement is going to come from in 2018. We had a dream run with injuries after the first 6 weeks of the season but fell again badly in the finals.
Some of the younger players like Heeney, Mills, Florent and Hayward may improve but it is hard to see Buddy, JPK, Parker,McVeigh, Jack, Grundy, Smith or even Rampe improving much.
I'd just like to see us add a player or two who has good foot skills to reduce our turnovers. A bit more speed on the outside would also be welcome.
Watts may have been such a player given the Swans record of turning players...we'll never know.

We did very well after round 6, so not much improvement is needed. The team with the best list didn't win the GF. There were other factors that got them over the line.

I think it is the Coaching Panel thread where I make 4 points were we can improve, which involve making a few positional changes and playing a more offensive game style. We have a good young list and we need to do a few things better with it.

Would getting a Tom Rockcliff at 650k a season help our club, for example? I think not. Clubs chasing those players at that kind of wage are making moves of desperation. We don't have to do that.

[troyjones2525]

I am not negative on any of our rookies, but someone has to be at the bottom. We are only talking about 6 players anyway, as I think we would have to rank players like Foote and Rose higher than Murray because they perform well in the NEAFL and have some AFL experience. I rate COR and Fisher the highest because I feel they have the most AFL ready game. Fox has played AFL and did okay, so I have to rate him a bit higher too. That just leaves Murray, Ronke and Pink. I like them all, but the ones who were lower a couple of weeks back have been delisted.

And what trick would that be? I think the equation is simple on Watts. If Tippett stays we can't afford Watts. We don't have to debate this further because it's a non-starter.

We did very well after round 6, so not much improvement is needed. The team with the best list didn't win the GF. There were other factors that got them over the line.

I think it is the Coaching Panel thread where I make 4 points were we can improve, which involve making a few positional changes and playing a more offensive game style. We have a good young list and we need to do a few things better with it.

Would getting a Tom Rockcliff at 650k a season help our club, for example? I think not. Clubs chasing those players at that kind of wage are making moves of desperation. We don't have to do that.

I think we've all been guilty of saying the swans have a plan A and if that doesn't work then we are stuffed!

It usually consists of Buddy playing well up forward + a couple of others.

Watts would have provided another quality option if that failed... but as you have stated, we will never know...

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[dejavoodoo44]

Watts's manager Paul Connors rules out a move to the Swans

Chase for Watts down to two

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I'll cope.

[Cainit]

Our improvement will be as follows

Tippet hopefully fit all year and becomes a weapon when resting in the forward line

Sinclair to develop into a 40 goal forward

Dawson to become a regular in the best 22

Haywood, Melican and Florent to go to the next level

Reid to be a regular in defence

Cameron to develop into a forward also get 30-40 goals

Buddy moves to the wing

And lastly Towers never plays again for the Swans

[liz]

I think our age profile gives reasonable cause for optimism on where improvement can come from:

Heeney, Mills, Jones, Hewett, Naismith, Papley for starters. All have played a fair amount of senior footy now (ie just over the 50 games mark or approaching it). They've all shown improvement from their debuts to where they are now and I am confident they've all got a fair amount of improvement left in them. The gradient of their improvement might slow but I reckon we can reasonably think that they are all far from the finished product.

Then we have the next tier - Melican, Hayward, Florent, Aliir - who have played less senior footy but looked reasonably good at times. They all look like they have the raw attributes to be long term senior players, injury permitting.

So even if our current crop of senior players fail to improve at all, there is still plenty of scope for improvement before we factor in brand new Blood.

Sure, we do have to allow for those senior players eventually dropping off. McVeigh is probably coming into his final year. Jack and Grundy are the next two in line for retirement, though they're barely 30 and plenty of players nowadays keep playing very good footy approaching their mid-30s. Buddy will possibly drop off at some point. Who knows. Given he's the reigning Coleman medallist and came in the top 5 in the Brownlow, there are no immediate signs of it happening. Similarly, I can't see any sign of Kennedy slowing down (figuratively, given he's not quick!), while Rampe, Hanners and Parker are still at ages where we can reasonably expect plenty more top notch footy.

The whole list might go pear-shaped within a season or two, but only the most pessimistic would find definite signs that it's going to happen.

Most of the clubs who seem active in attracting new players this off-season are also set to lose some, Port and Geelong in particular (though it's not evident any one is actually going to pick Geelong, other than Gary Ablett). GWS continue to lose depth. West Coast don't seem as if they'll be replacing their main contested ball winners from last year, while their most important player by far (JJK) is only 6 months younger than Buddy. If we have to start worrying about when Buddy will fall off a cliff, they face the same issue. Adelaide aren't getting noticeably strong, with the loss of Lever and maybe Cameron, with only Motlop a possible in.

Essendon do seem to be attracting a few that want to go there but I'm not convinced they are addressing their most pressing needs. They could well have the deepest forward line talent next year (Hooker, Daniher, Fantasia, Smith, Stringer, Green, Stewart) but still have no-one to actually win the ball in the first place and kick it to them.

Melbourne's defence was pretty good last year. Lever may improve it slightly but I don't think that will necessarily help them make the leap (though I do think they're a very good chance to play finals next year), while the Saints have lost Riewoldt and Montagna, don't look like replacing them, and have a worthy list completely lacking in star quality.

[dimelb]

We don't need much improvement to advance our position. The most pressing need is to stay fit e.g. if that clumsy oaf Goddard hadn't corked Buddy's right thigh we would've at least finished higher and maybe gone all the way.

So it is our duty as fans to cross fingers and hope that the medical staff will excel and the players will stay in one piece. The task of trading and finding new players is trivial compared with maintaining the fitness of our present players. In other words the window is wide open and if we can avoid injuries we are a very good chance of going three steps further than we did this year.

[RogueSwan]

... Adelaide aren't getting noticeably strong, with the loss of Lever and maybe Cameron, with only Motlop a possible in....

I think we would have all been thinking the same thing after Dangerfield left

[gumby_bolts]

Watts's manager Paul Connors rules out a move to the Swans

Chase for Watts down to two

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Salary cap? Kinda curious how Geelong will fit him in with Ablett coming back.