U18 Div 2 Championships

[Mug Punter]

Thanks for putting up those links AG. Really encouraging signs from the youngsters.

At this stage - very early I know - it looks as if we have a very talented group. I wonder how many we'll have access to when the draft rolls around.

You'd be hoping we have a few more than what we had last year, Davis to Adelaide from what I recall, there must have been something we didn't like about that kid seeing we drafted Hiscox in 2014....

It's a tough process though and I wouldn't take too much notice of this form as the real scrutiny will come against the big boys in Div 1, very easy to be a flat track bully in Div 2. You'd think that any kids missing the Allies squad will really be struggling to get drafted so the rest of this series is quite important to these young lads.

You'd think of the top squad of 25 for the Allies that there'd be approx. 5 each from the academies and 2-3 each from Tassie and NT though Tassie may demand more.

That Squad of 25 then gets thrown into the mix with four other talented sides in Div 1 for a pool of 125 players, of which approximately half should get drafted.

So if you do the math 2-3 draftees this year would be a good result for the Swans Academy. Bell and Hardman seem to be the most likely talked about this year (Blakey looming as a top 10 pick in 2018) and in terms of the overage players Brown and the MP favourite Liam Maze seem the most likely. None of these kids is shooting the lights out like Heeney or Mills did, the lack of squealing from south of the border is deafening, so you'd think whoever we decide to go for we should be able to accommodate easily within the points system.

Question for Barracuda, are we able to take overage players to the Div 1 titles or is that just a concession for the Div 2 series to assist the NDS programmes?

[barracuda]

You'd be hoping we have a few more than what we had last year, Davis to Adelaide from what I recall, there must have been something we didn't like about that kid seeing we drafted Hiscox in 2014....

It's a tough process though and I wouldn't take too much notice of this form as the real scrutiny will come against the big boys in Div 1, very easy to be a flat track bully in Div 2. You'd think that any kids missing the Allies squad will really be struggling to get drafted so the rest of this series is quite important to these young lads.

You'd think of the top squad of 25 for the Allies that there'd be approx. 5 each from the academies and 2-3 each from Tassie and NT though Tassie may demand more.

That Squad of 25 then gets thrown into the mix with four other talented sides in Div 1 for a pool of 125 players, of which approximately half should get drafted.

So if you do the math 2-3 draftees this year would be a good result for the Swans Academy. Bell and Hardman seem to be the most likely talked about this year (Blakey looming as a top 10 pick in 2018) and in terms of the overage players Brown and the MP favourite Liam Maze seem the most likely. None of these kids is shooting the lights out like Heeney or Mills did, the lack of squealing from south of the border is deafening, so you'd think whoever we decide to go for we should be able to accommodate easily within the points system.

Question for Barracuda, are we able to take overage players to the Div 1 titles or is that just a concession for the Div 2 series to assist the NDS programmes?

Hi MP,

The Allies will have some over age players. Ben Davis played last year as an over age player, which led to him getting drafted. The swans lost their academy rights to Davis as he forgot to register for the draft. Also I can understand why the swans overlooked him, as there were better players on offer and there is a question mark over his body (he is currently injury listed at the crows again with a foot problem). Also I think the no dickhead policy may have applied at the swans. As a long time crows supporter I must say I was disappointed when they drafted Davis.

One thing I will say about the swans their drafting is very solid. Will Haywards performance, and the potential he showed, in what was probably his third ever senior game was remarkable. The swans have separated their recruitment capability (most of which is in Melbourne) from the academy. Whilst it frustrates the academy who are heavily invested in the success of the boys the separation makes sense. Whilst Bell or Hardman might be draftable for the swans future needs they may not suit. Accordingly they need to keep looking at the entire pool.

[bloodspirit]

As a long time crows supporter I must say I was disappointed when they drafted Davis.

Thanks again for your excellent posts on this thread, Barra. Just curious, are you primarily a Crows or Swans supporter these days? Are the Swans your second team? Or are you simply (I won't say "just") a Crows fan with an interest in the Swans Academy because your boy is a part of it?

[barracuda]

Thanks again for your excellent posts on this thread, Barra. Just curious, are you primarily a Crows or Swans supporter these days? Are the Swans your second team? Or are you simply (I won't say "just") a Crows fan with an interest in the Swans Academy because your boy is a part of it?

Good question! I grew up in Adelaide and played juniors for North Adelaide. I am a crows member and strongly believe you never change your alliances. Having said that, and having lived in Sydney for 25 years I am also a swans member and they are a very close second. My son and I usually travel to see the crows/swans games which I hate because it is like watching your two children fighting!

[S.S. Bleeder]

Hi MP,

The Allies will have some over age players. Ben Davis played last year as an over age player, which led to him getting drafted. The swans lost their academy rights to Davis as he forgot to register for the draft. Also I can understand why the swans overlooked him, as there were better players on offer and there is a question mark over his body (he is currently injury listed at the crows again with a foot problem). Also I think the no dickhead policy may have applied at the swans. As a long time crows supporter I must say I was disappointed when they drafted Davis.

One thing I will say about the swans their drafting is very solid. Will Haywards performance, and the potential he showed, in what was probably his third ever senior game was remarkable. The swans have separated their recruitment capability (most of which is in Melbourne) from the academy. Whilst it frustrates the academy who are heavily invested in the success of the boys the separation makes sense. Whilst Bell or Hardman might be draftable for the swans future needs they may not suit. Accordingly they need to keep looking at the entire pool.

Not sure if you would know the answer to this barracuda; if the academy and recruitment departments are independent then what is the decision process on who to recruit? Are both departments given 50% weighting by Kinnear Beatson? I wonder if this is being introduced so that we don't over pay for someone like Hiscox again? We should never overpay for any academy player IMO.

[Mug Punter]

Not sure if you would know the answer to this barracuda; if the academy and recruitment departments are independent then what is the decision process on who to recruit? Are both departments given 50% weighting by Kinnear Beatson? I wonder if this is being introduced so that we don't over pay for someone like Hiscox again? We should never overpay for any academy player IMO.

Interesting question and I look forward to Barracuda's response.

Keeping them independent makes sense in that it will avoid any overt politics and favouritism towards academy kids because we should take a hardheaded approach to our recruitment and still recruit on merit.

Having said that I cannot possibly believe that all things being equal that we wouldn't plump for an academy kid. For equal football ability the other areas in recruitment should be totally "de-risked" in selecting an academy player in that we intimately know their strengths and weaknesses from a personal level and whether they are a risky or safe bet from that perspective.

[liz]

Search through the video archives on the Swans' website (if such an archive exists) and you will find an interview with Beatson where he addresses this question. It probably dates from around last year's draft (though it could be the prior year). Essentially he says that, while the recruiting team is supportive of the academy, they evaluate academy prospects using the same criteria as any other potential draftee.

One benefit to the club is that they have far more information about academy graduates than other players in the pool, and than other clubs have about those players, especially around the intangible "character" traits.

[barracuda]

My understanding is that the relationship is as stated by Liz. Recruiting can make or break a club and so the academy kids are treated no differently from the hundreds of other prospects. They do however get further development via the nds program. Overall the situation places enormous pressure on the academy staff to find and deliver the best talent. There is no free ride and any academy kid drafted has genuinely earnt the spot. This is a good thing.

[Mug Punter]

My understanding is that the relationship is as stated by Liz. Recruiting can make or break a club and so the academy kids are treated no differently from the hundreds of other prospects. They do however get further development via the nds program. Overall the situation places enormous pressure on the academy staff to find and deliver the best talent. There is no free ride and any academy kid drafted has genuinely earnt the spot. This is a good thing.

I think we've got it right and that clearly a lot of thought has gone into the model. The ability for the Academy to instil the required behaviours is enormous in terms of the recruitment process, there's just shouldn't be any nasty surprises with Academy kids. If they Swans don't know what they are getting after 7 or 8 years then they'll never know.

By all means we take an objective approach but surely all things being equal an academy kid will be selected over an interstate kid, it just stands to reason.

[Mug Punter]

Thanks for all your info Barra

Has the Wright kid from North Shore chosen to follow the TAC Cup path or was he overlooked/injured?

[barracuda]

Wright went to Melbourne after being let go from the academy. He was listed in the 70 player oakliegh squad. He has not been selected to play for them yet.

[Mug Punter]

Wright went to Melbourne after being let go from the academy. He was listed in the 70 player oakliegh squad. He has not been selected to play for them yet.

Being let go would have been a huge shock to the Wright clan who get treated and act as minted AFL royalty on the upper North Shore.

No great loss I suspect, I know he is only a kid but I thought the way him and his North Shore colleagues acted throughout the 2016 U19 finals series showed a complete lack of sportsmanship and class....

[Pmcc2911]

So now it is the whole finals series MP, last year you just complained about the GF and I think the prevailing view on Red and White at the time was it takes two to tango.

Also re Noah Wright you don't know him from a bar of soap, easy to bag him hiding behind the keyboard.
He wasn't "let go" from the academy, Oakleigh came knocking on the door looking to recruit him and in conjunction with the academy brains trust it was felt he should have a crack down there.

[Mug Punter]

So now it is the whole finals series MP, last year you just complained about the GF and I think the prevailing view on Red and White at the time was it takes two to tango.

Also re Noah Wright you don't know him from a bar of soap, easy to bag him hiding behind the keyboard.
He wasn't "let go" from the academy, Oakleigh came knocking on the door looking to recruit him and in conjunction with the academy brains trust it was felt he should have a crack down there.

Fair enough, my bad for raising it again but I stand by what I said in that it was a very poor look for the game. I don't think the Swans would have been impressed by it at all either, it was neither tough or hard. And I don't agree with the two to tango argument either but let's just not go there as this is an U18 championships thread first and foremost

Good luck to the lad, I have no gripe with him personally but I doubt he'll be the cocky big man on campus down in Melbourne which will probably do him good. Will be interesting to see how many games he gets as his tyres were getting pumped up quite big here in Sydney hence my interest.

[barracuda]

I don't know Noah, but last season I watched an under 19s game between manly and north shore. By the third quarter north shore was more than 15 goals up on a minimum numbers Manly team. A 16 year old manly player was standing 150m from the play when Mitchell wright came up behind him and punched him hard in the kidney. The kid had to be carried off and actually quit footy that day. I know the swans were made aware of this obvious flaw of character.