2018 trading, drafting and list management: players and personnel

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  • liz
    Veteran
    Site Admin
    • Jan 2003
    • 16736

    Originally posted by ernie koala
    Love this idea.

    That would allow us to pick up Blakey and another draftie late 1st round.... like Liam Stocker...Who IMO, a big bodied inside mid, would be a fantastic pick up for us
    There is merit in that suggestion. I've just looked at the situation of all clubs in the draft and the Pies do look like they might need points. They're not going to move until they know they don't need pick 18 to trade for someone but after that, they might be interested in generating more points.

    If our situation doesn't change between now and the draft, as I see it picks 26 and 33 essentially give us Blakey. There could be some shifting up or down of a few spots depending on where he's bid at, but that value's pretty trivial.


    That means we take picks 38, 39 and 40 into the draft. Those picks are pretty much at the end of the second/very start of the third round, which are still pretty valuable picks.

    Assuming we don't have to carry Tippett on the list next year and we stay with a list size of 38, we have three spots to fill. That's effectively just one "live" pick, taking out Blakey and Ronke. But that could increase depending on the futures of Newman, Marsh, Maibaum and Robinson. Rose too - has it been explicitly stated that he's re-signed or has that just been inferred from the club's comments about his NEAFL grand final? So there's a lot yet to happen in terms of list finalisation for next year.

    There's also the option of increasing the senior list to 39 or 40. The benefits of carrying a smaller senior list and larger rookie list have diminished somewhat. Salary cap is still a factor, as is one-year contract status of rookies vs two years minimum for drafted players. But the list flexibility reasons are less than they used to be before rookies had to wait for someone to be injured before they could play. If the club has unbudgeted salary cap space for next season, it could choose to draft an extra player in the ND (ie get earlier access to the options). The fact there are very likely to be three retirements at the end of 2019 might factor in too - that makes it easier to reduce the list size back down to 38 for 2020 if needed, without delisting players they'd rather keep.

    Comment

    • liz
      Veteran
      Site Admin
      • Jan 2003
      • 16736

      Originally posted by TheMase
      Thanks for the considered thoughts Liz!

      Enjoy your very reasonable posts both here and on the other footy site when you post there
      I've actually only just understood the thrust of what you were suggesting in my haste to point out a couple of minor issues around the edges.

      If we find a club willing to trade a late first or early second round pick for some or all of our picks around the 40 mark and we do it before Nick Blakey is drafted, we use that pick to draft Blakely. But if we wait until after Blakey is drafted, we get to use lower picks and get the full value of that new pick we've brought in.

      I must admit I hadn't realised that implication of live pick trading until just now.

      West Coast are a team currently sitting on two picks in the early 20s, but with a gap until pick 61 and apparently with six list spots to fill (though that presumably assumes a full list of 40 - it could be as few as four spots to fill). Their situation could yet change before the draft if they find a way to get the Kelly deal done but, if not, they could be a club that would rather have two picks at the end of the second or start of the third, in return for one of those early 20s picks. I guess it depends on how they see the contours of talent in the draft. They also have an NGA player in Cameron, so their strategy may depend on where they see him being bid upon.

      Comment

      • TheMase
        Senior Player
        • Jan 2003
        • 1207

        2018 trading, drafting and list management: players and personnel

        Originally posted by liz
        I've actually only just understood the thrust of what you were suggesting in my haste to point out a couple of minor issues around the edges.

        If we find a club willing to trade a late first or early second round pick for some or all of our picks around the 40 mark and we do it before Nick Blakey is drafted, we use that pick to draft Blakely. But if we wait until after Blakey is drafted, we get to use lower picks and get the full value of that new pick we've brought in.

        I must admit I hadn't realised that implication of live pick trading until just now.
        Exactly! We would need to do it after the Blakey selection and in effect we would get two first round selections.

        Where I am unsure as to how, when and who live picks can be transacted with.

        Ie. can you trade selections at any time, with any team?

        If so it is a viable option for both parties and other teams may be similar as you point out.

        Pies were my target as they have two players likely to be bid on between 10-30.

        Comment

        • sprite
          Regular in the Side
          • Jan 2003
          • 813

          I have a feeling ( nothing to support it) that we may get involved with Hawthorn and Port to get the Wingard trade done. Maybe shuffling a few picks around and player our way. Probably wrong but just a hunch.

          Strategists start your thinking!
          sprite

          Comment

          • KSAS
            Senior Player
            • Mar 2018
            • 1767

            Originally posted by liz
            True, but we've barely traded any players in, whether by choice or because we haven't been able to persuade the target players that they want to join. So there's no evidence of a policy of not trading future picks for players.
            Good points Liz. The trade ban & keeping picks to draft academy players come to mind.

            Comment

            • liz
              Veteran
              Site Admin
              • Jan 2003
              • 16736

              Originally posted by KSAS
              Good points Liz. The trade ban & keeping picks to draft academy players come to mind.
              I don't think the trade ban had much effect as future pick trading didn't come in until after the ban had expired. I think a full salary cap (prior to this year) and an inability to persuade targets that they want to make the move north (this year) are more likely reasons.

              Comment

              • AB Swannie
                Senior Player
                • Mar 2017
                • 1579

                Originally posted by TheMase
                Exactly! We would need to do it after the Blakey selection and in effect we would get two first round selections.

                Where I am unsure as to how, when and who live picks can be transacted with.

                Ie. can you trade selections at any time, with any team?

                If so it is a viable option for both parties and other teams may be similar as you point out.

                Pies were my target as they have two players likely to be bid on between 10-30.
                I suspect that other clubs will be able to offer more points than us with pick up 18 probably moved in the next 3 days rather than on draft night.

                Comment

                • Markwebbos
                  Veterans List
                  • Jul 2016
                  • 7186

                  If the Swans has too many 2018 draft picks would they not try and swap for 2019 picks?

                  Comment

                  • TheMase
                    Senior Player
                    • Jan 2003
                    • 1207

                    Originally posted by AB Swannie
                    I suspect that other clubs will be able to offer more points than us with pick up 18 probably moved in the next 3 days rather than on draft night.
                    You’re almost certainly right.

                    Be nice if we were able to pull it off though.

                    Comment

                    • Ludwig
                      Veterans List
                      • Apr 2007
                      • 9359

                      Comment

                      • AB Swannie
                        Senior Player
                        • Mar 2017
                        • 1579

                        Personally, I can't wait for Wednesday night to come and this trade period to be over.

                        Comment

                        • Auntie.Gerald
                          Veterans List
                          • Oct 2009
                          • 6474

                          Exhausted ????
                          "be tough, only when it gets tough"

                          Comment

                          • royboy42
                            Senior Player
                            • Apr 2006
                            • 2076

                            Originally posted by lwjoyner
                            we need an explanation for giving sts 28 for hanners. hanners for 39 was bad enough but give them 28 now that Langdon is coming was the worst decision our power brokers have made for ages. To get May will cost us as much as Hanners thought we wanted cap pressure off.
                            Run that one by us again, lwj.

                            Comment

                            • barry
                              Veterans List
                              • Jan 2003
                              • 8499

                              We simply need to trade out that pick 26 to anyone who will give us something for it before Wednesday. In order of preference;
                              A) a medium-tall defender
                              B) pick 26 next year
                              C) best available player any position.

                              As mentioned by everyone else it's a wastes pick to take Blakey.

                              Comment

                              • Markwebbos
                                Veterans List
                                • Jul 2016
                                • 7186

                                Originally posted by barry
                                We simply need to trade out that pick 26 to anyone who will give us something for it before Wednesday. In order of preference;
                                A) a medium-tall defender
                                B) pick 26 next year
                                C) best available player any position.

                                As mentioned by everyone else it's a wastes pick to take Blakey.
                                D) Dylan Shiel
                                E) Lachie Neale
                                F) Tom Scully
                                G) Jeremy Finlayson

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