2018 trading, drafting and list management: players and personnel

[Ludwig]

I feel that we need to target some big bodied inside midfielders. We have some great young outside type midfielders, but we need a couple a real 'bull' who can crash and bash for long periods of game time. We need to prepare for when Kennedy retires, Hannebery is struggling with OP and I don't feel Parker has the body type to cope with this for long periods. Either

Why don't we target this kid Jordan Dawson?

Anyway, we have Tom Papley, who unlike Parker, has the body type (and demeanor) begging for a good pounding.


At this point in the season, I don't see us targeting any specific type of player, as we have good depth in all types. It's always nice to get those medium sized players with pace like Rampe and Rohan, if one is available.

I liked the little that we saw of Foote this year before his injury and think he's far from a certain delisting. I actually think he has more upside than Robinson and Marsh.

I'm not sure what to make of Rose. He's having a pretty good season and deserves another shot at senior footy.

I would be looking to trade Newman as things stand now. I like his game, but I think he will find it hard to make the senior side in coming years. I prefer to Fox instead if I had to make a choice.

The most likely senior list outs for me this year (and it's early days) are Robinson, Marsh, Newman, Tippett and Naismith, who could perhaps get a rookie contract, but certainly not a senior list contract given that he's unlikely to play senior footy next season and his long term future is unclear.

[Mark26]

Why don't we target this kid Jordan Dawson?

Anyway, we have Tom Papley, who unlike Parker, has the body type (and demeanor) begging for a good pounding.

Agreed on Dawson. The lad just needs to get a few games together in the seconds and then given a real opportunity in the senior team.

[Markwebbos]

Afl.com.au?s guide to what we would look for and be prepared to give up in a hypothetical mid-season trade.

Mid-year trade table: Who your club should target - AFL.com.au

They?ve suggested we chase Darcy Moore, Mitch McGovern and Jayden Hunt and look to trade Aliir, Nic Newman and Dean Towers.

Last two probably correct. I think we have plenty of outside speed. Could do with explosive speed, good users by foot, and another ruckman.

3 names mentioned in the article are Tom Nicholls, Marc Pittonet and Brayden Preuss.

[707]

I doubt we'll bring in any players, too many knocking down the door in the NEAFL and bringing in players costs dollars, home grown players are always cheaper so you can fit more top liners in you squad than if you buy them in.

I don't see any glaring holes in our list, seems well balanced. There will be some progression in players like Ronke who will end up an explosive midfielder, just has all the moves and footy smarts. Dawson is our next midfield bull. Can't see a place for the expensive in salary and trade Moore, want him to stay at the Pies.

Just see if we can get some pick upgrades with moving fringe players, as shown by the Murray trade, our fringe players have trade currency. Or how about some shenanigans trading our first for a couple further out but worth more points. Gold Coast have a stack of picks in the 20/30s that would suit our purpose trading them our first. Then go to the draft, get Blakey and best available at our next picks. Late pick or draft a development ruckman to slot in behind Darcy Cameron.

[707]

So if McCartin keeps improving as he is, could we trade Reid?

McCartin, regardless of how he's looking, is just a kid, will not really start to influence games for another couple of years, just does cameos and they don't win you flags. Reid when fit really impacts games, he's mature and one of the best pack marks in the AFL, McCartin looks promising but can't do what Reid does.

[stevoswan]

Reid when fit really impacts games, he's mature and one of the best pack marks in the AFL, McCartin looks promising but can't do what Reid does.

.....yet.

[stevoswan]

A reasonable assessment of our season so far......afl.com.au's 'mid season report card' of our team.

This Swan needs to get back to his best - AFL.com.au ......that Swans being Hanners.

[Markwebbos]

I doubt we'll bring in any players, too many knocking down the door in the NEAFL and bringing in players costs dollars, home grown players are always cheaper so you can fit more top liners in you squad than if you buy them in.

I don't see any glaring holes in our list, seems well balanced. There will be some progression in players like Ronke who will end up an explosive midfielder, just has all the moves and footy smarts. Dawson is our next midfield bull. Can't see a place for the expensive in salary and trade Moore, want him to stay at the Pies.

Just see if we can get some pick upgrades with moving fringe players, as shown by the Murray trade, our fringe players have trade currency. Or how about some shenanigans trading our first for a couple further out but worth more points. Gold Coast have a stack of picks in the 20/30s that would suit our purpose trading them our first. Then go to the draft, get Blakey and best available at our next picks. Late pick or draft a development ruckman to slot in behind Darcy Cameron.

Am I the only one who thinks we need another GOOD ruckman?

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A reasonable assessment of our season so far......afl.com.au's 'mid season report card' of our team.

This Swan needs to get back to his best - AFL.com.au ......that Swans being Hanners.

Aarrghh its video. With Matt Thompson. Does anyone listen to the disdain for him on the AFL Exchange podcast?

[mattybloods]

Yes I think we would only pick up a ruckman in the draft. When Naismith is back fit we'll have him, Sinclair and Cameron. Although Cameron is untried at senior level he looks to be ready, last thing we need is another ahead of him (unless one is traded out)

[bloodspirit]

I'm lukewarm on the idea of recruiting another ruck. Horse likes rucks but we have moved to playing one rather than two rucks which means we don't need anywhere so many of them. And we still have a number of them. There's Sinclair, there's Naismith (assuming he is going to recover from his injury which I am expecting he will) and there's Cameron. Although Cameron is untried at senior level, they are all legitimate senior options. Beyond that we have Amartey who is a bit undersized but very athletic and who may yet grow a little more. He's a project, but then so will be a ruck we pick up in the draft. I wouldn't quite suggest that Pink would be a candidate to one day ruck at senior level, but stranger things have happened. Anyway, yes, maybe another ruck for depth in the draft or else another journey man but not a high priority from my point of view (provided Naismith is on track to make a full recovery). I'm not sure why Preuss would come to us unless we indicated he was going to be playing seniors. He's not going to tip out Sinclair and so that would require us to revert to playing two rucks which seems unnecessary given that we are going well playing only one.

Subject to what is happening with Naismith's injury, I'm confident we will give him another contract, whether as a rookie or senior. We've invested too much in him, and he hasn't disappointed, not to. Why is it being said he won't play next year? I thought he was out for this season only? Is it just because typical recovery times from ACLs are over a year and he will need time to get match fit again? When will he be able to resume training? Is there a chance he'll be able to do the pre-season?

I think that if we are looking anywhere apart from the draft, possibly the targeting of KPDs is a story with legs. I believe the club did confirm they had made inquiries about Darcy Moore. Jeremy McGovern would be great but probably too expensive. We might have to de-list Reg to make room, which would be pretty rough! I trust our list managers but don't see why we can't stick with what we've got. Maybe get another promising KPD at the draft.

The other area that was until recently a strength of ours but which now perhaps needs bolstering, is inside midfielders. Hanners isn't in great form and is not strictly an inside mid anyway, JPK is getting on, we traded Titch, and most of the excellent young talent are more outside prospects like Jones, Hayward, Stoddart, and Ling (although who knows with Ronke, Florent, Papley). Probably we'd go to the draft but Will Brodie was a name being thrown around as a trade target (here: Mid-year trade table: Who your club should target - AFL.com.au) who isn't getting games at Gold Coast (only 2 this year so far) and he's a promising inside mid. Given our excellent track record in developing youth I think we'd be a pretty appealing destination for him. On the other hand he is Victorian and might want to go 'home' rather than stay interstate, especially if it doesn't work out at the Suns - but he's only just Victorian because he grew up in Shep, in the border region. He was very highly rated as a junior (touted as #1 pick at some stages) and is a big boy (JPK size - not Cripps/Bont size). Given he hasn't been going well enough to get a game at the Suns - the SUNS!!! - you'd think they couldn't ask more than a second rounder for him even though he's still only 19 years old and was a top 10 pick less than 2 years ago. Scrimshaw is another top 10 pick from the same draft languishing playing reserves footy at the Suns (no games this year so far). Then again they may not be getting games for a good reason that might tell against recruiting them but I'll leave it to Kin and co to figure that out. Maybe the main problem is that both of these players have another 2 years on their contracts after this season and so it may not be realistic to winkle them out of the Gold Coast. The Suns would surely be better off keeping them than taking a 2nd round pick so why would they do the trade?

[Ludwig]

Good comprehensive post bloodspirit.

We find ourselves in a pretty good space atm. We are building a large stable of key position players, in fact it looks to be more of a problem of what to do with them rather than wondering if we have enough. Besides the ones already on board, we have Blakey coming in this year's draft and the very promising Josh Raynor next year. All the KPPs on our list appear likely AFL level players with the possible exception of Toby Pink, who is worth developing based on last year's performance as well as his ability to play in the ruck (which he did regularly as a junior).

With the high value placed on intercept defenders, Aliir will certainly get multi-year offers in excess of $3,000,000. We should be able to keep him so long as he's a regular in the side. Because of our depth, we could cover his loss if he goes, but it would be a big loss nonetheless. He could be the difference between winning and losing a premiership, as he probably was in 2016 (although Matt Stevic probably would have given the Bulldogs another 10 free kicks to offset his influence).

We are unlikely to play 2 ruckmen anytime soon given the depth of our list, although Cameron and Amartey could earn a forward spot on merit alone. You can only ask a player to spend his career in the reserves for so long. Darcy Cameron is nearing that point where he will have to get some senior game time. Amartey looks quite capable of making it as a mobile ruckman. He competes effectively against taller ruckmen. I don't think we should expect Sam Naismith to play senior footy next season. It took 18 months for Natanui to come back and even more for Ceglar. I would offer him a spot on the rookie list and see what happens next year.

Although Hanners is in a slump now, it seems to be injury related and expect he will get back to his best at some time in the future. If not this year, then next. He's only 27 and should be at the peak of his powers. Just looks what Macca is doing after most of us wrote him off.

The way the list is evolving we might see more of Buddy in the midfield next year, or even this year if we still want to keep McCartin in the side when Reid returns. Buddy would be awesome in the midfield when we still have 2 tall targets in the forward line. In any case, we are likely to see some bigger bodies in the midfield in coming years. Our tall forwards are all athletic and quite capable of playing on a wing. Nick Blakey thinks he's a midfielder.

The club seems to be moving away from having the big midfield 'accumulator' in favour of rotating more players through the midfield. I think this is the way to go, giving your best players more rest time on field so they can find another gear in the 4th quarter if needed. JPK and Parker are also very good forwards, so we don't lose much having them up forward when we have plenty of other players to cover for them.

I think we will continue to build through the draft. Given we have Blakely and Raynor nearly on the books already, we would do well to target tall midfielder/utility types, Elliot Yeo being a prototype of this kind of player.

[bloodspirit]

we would do well to target tall midfielder/utility types, Elliot Yeo being a prototype of this kind of player.

Scrimshaw is such a player.

Mostly in agreement with your thinking. Perhaps not with: "Aliir will certainly get multi-year offers in excess of $3,000,000". I think this is a slim possibility at best. Would be great for Aliir though!

[Ludwig]

Scrimshaw is such a player.

Mostly in agreement with your thinking. Perhaps not with: "Aliir will certainly get multi-year offers in excess of $3,000,000". I think this is a slim possibility at best. Would be great for Aliir though!

Scrimshaw was a player in the Swans' draft window at the time. I haven't followed him since, but I think he's been injured a lot of the past 2 seasons. I hate raiding the Suns; they're such a sad case.

As for Aliir, I can see him being offered 3 mil for 5 or 6 years. It's about half of Jeremy McGovern, but I think Aliir is more than half the player value. There's less risk than people think with Aliir. It's just whether he can reduce his error rate, which I find no worse than say Zak Jones at the same number of senior games. If you draw the same projection line with Aliir, he could be All Australian in a couple of years. The most negativity about Aliir comes from RWO. Outsider of here, everyone think he's a star.

[707]

Aliir did little wrong last Friday night and a whole lot right!

Can't see where Moore fits for us, we have a lot of KP players at both ends and there's a limit to how many you can play.

Don't think we've got any holes, let's just draft best available to see if we can build an overall upgrade.

Like your work Bloodspirit and Ludwig.

[Markwebbos]

If Macca really does retire this year, like he promised, then we?ll need to recruit someone with elite pointing skills to replace him. Hoping they?ll test for that at the draft combine.