Expectations for 2021 season

[Blood Fever]

Yep. And he is well behind Rowie at the moment. By a long way. Sorry TheBloods. The coaches (and I) know who is currently more valuable to the side. Let's hope he starts to show why he was picked at #5. Whereas Chad Warner was #39. Caleb Serong at #8.

Still physically immature like McVeigh was
And had an interrupted pre season..Patience required. Showed last year he belonged.

[TheBloods]

It seems that you are besotted with one individual in this team game or maybe 2 and have very little patience for certain individuals in our team. Dare I say that you don’t seem to understand that certain superstars (mind you they are no one at present and they should be working as hard as anyone In the team) who have been given responsibilities that you think they need to do and they are doing go missing in games when it’s too tough for them to do anything other than the one trick they have.

I haven’t looked at this but maybe you can put CHAD in numbers?
How many breaks does Chad make per game? How many do players in his category of midfielders make ? What are the other attributes that players in his category need to have eg How many clearances ? How many tackles ? How many one percenters? How many inside 50s ? How many turnovers ?
What is his trajectory compared to his compatriots at the same age? Let’s compare him to Zak Butters for eg at the same age. Zak was doing the same before he got injured. Breaking lines and kicking in forward 50. How does he compare to Zak?

I don’t want to listen to your subjective feel before you put some numbers forward and if you don’t have any or think that you know better just because you can pay a few dollars to go to SCG - atleast I will know where you stand with regards to your knowledge in this matter.

I am sure they (chad RB JMAC) are all very good players. For every Bontempelli there is a liberatore. I am sure some people will like certain players more than others. But remember that denigrating a player just because you don’t like them and the number of times you do it is absolute trolling !

Ok well you asked for numbers so if your interested you can read the below or if you have already made up your mind that im wrong then dont bother

RB is not in the top 5 for contested possessions for his age group - ahead of him are Serong, Anderson, Butters, Green and Walsh

He is 10th for clearances - ahead of him are CHAD, Smith, Collier-Dawkins, Butters, Bytel, Serong, Green, Anderson and Walsh

He is 10th for inside 50s - ahead of him are Schoenberg, Rozee, Perkins, Thomas, Serong, Gulden, CHAD, Lukosius and Walsh

He is 12th for disposals - ahead of him are Quaynor, Lukosius, Duursma, Sholl, Green, Serong, Butters, Ash, Anderson, Smith and Walsh

He is 13th for score involvements - ahead of him are CHAD, Serong, Woodcock, Green, Ben King, Max King, Pickett, Gulden, Butters, Smith, Weightman and Walsh

Stats arent everything but because of his limited ability Rowbottom needs to be accumulating and doing everything by quantity to make up for what he lacks in quality.

E.g. he is not top 5 barely top 10 in any desirable category you could rate a player of his age yet he is top 5 in two very undesirable categories for his age - Clangers (5th) and Turnovers (5th)

Numbers back up the eye test which shows he is a mid who doesnt get anywhere near enough of it which is why he tackles so much, and when he does get it hes either not making much happen with his disposals or hes plain turning it over. I talk about it so much because it is frustrating and a point of concern that we are giving games and making list decisions and team tactics around a player who does not belong in this role. I am accused of hating him but on the contrary i think the way he is tracking he will be off the list by the time his next contract is up in 3 years . That would be a shame to see of someone who seems like a great kid and who has strengths that could be better utilised elsewhere. Lockdown defender or pressure fwd and id be confident in him being a fine player for this club , could play 300 games and that is what i WANT. Why is it so hard to accept i rate him as a player just dont think hes a midfielders A-hole

[TheBloods]

I see i am beat. No one agrees with me and the only poster who at least has the courtesy to give the benefit of the doubt instead of taking swipes then gets accused of being a troll too . I am not out to cause conflict so i will zip it on Rowbottom. Really do wish the best for him and have only expressed my views maybe repetitively out of genuine concern for him and the team. I wont mention him again but let it be known where i stand on him and where i think he should be playing ! Save me having to say it every time i talk about changes ! Apologies to anyone offended

[bloodspirit]

I see i am beat. No one agrees with me and the only poster who at least has the courtesy to give the benefit of the doubt instead of taking swipes then gets accused of being a troll too . I am not out to cause conflict so i will zip it on Rowbottom. Really do wish the best for him and have only expressed my views maybe repetitively out of genuine concern for him and the team. I wont mention him again but let it be known where i stand on him and where i think he should be playing ! Save me having to say it every time i talk about changes ! Apologies to anyone offended

I think you can rest easy on this count. And given you have made your points forcefully and well, I think you are wise and perhaps even magnanimous to lay the topic to rest and let it play out. (I'll understand if you bring it up again in three years if he is delisted. ;-) )

[Bangalore Swans]

Ok well you asked for numbers so if your interested you can read the below or if you have already made up your mind that im wrong then dont bother

RB is not in the top 5 for contested possessions for his age group - ahead of him are Serong, Anderson, Butters, Green and Walsh

He is 10th for clearances - ahead of him are CHAD, Smith, Collier-Dawkins, Butters, Bytel, Serong, Green, Anderson and Walsh

He is 10th for inside 50s - ahead of him are Schoenberg, Rozee, Perkins, Thomas, Serong, Gulden, CHAD, Lukosius and Walsh

He is 12th for disposals - ahead of him are Quaynor, Lukosius, Duursma, Sholl, Green, Serong, Butters, Ash, Anderson, Smith and Walsh

He is 13th for score involvements - ahead of him are CHAD, Serong, Woodcock, Green, Ben King, Max King, Pickett, Gulden, Butters, Smith, Weightman and Walsh

Stats arent everything but because of his limited ability Rowbottom needs to be accumulating and doing everything by quantity to make up for what he lacks in quality.

E.g. he is not top 5 barely top 10 in any desirable category you could rate a player of his age yet he is top 5 in two very undesirable categories for his age - Clangers (5th) and Turnovers (5th)

Numbers back up the eye test which shows he is a mid who doesnt get anywhere near enough of it which is why he tackles so much, and when he does get it hes either not making much happen with his disposals or hes plain turning it over. I talk about it so much because it is frustrating and a point of concern that we are giving games and making list decisions and team tactics around a player who does not belong in this role. I am accused of hating him but on the contrary i think the way he is tracking he will be off the list by the time his next contract is up in 3 years . That would be a shame to see of someone who seems like a great kid and who has strengths that could be better utilised elsewhere. Lockdown defender or pressure fwd and id be confident in him being a fine player for this club , could play 300 games and that is what i WANT. Why is it so hard to accept i rate him as a player just dont think hes a midfielders A-hole

This is the sort of post that demonstrates your value to the Red and White community.

Your have your position and you present the arguments to back up your opinion.

Your also have the raw data to demonstrate the production of Chad.

Differing opinions are the gift of free democracy and I for one will defend this gift.

My wife and I often vote for different candidates at elections and she has different political views than me. Hallelujah.

[TheBloods]

This is the sort of post that demonstrates your value to the Red and White community.

Your have your position and you present the arguments to back up your opinion.

Your also have the raw data to demonstrate the production of Chad.

Differing opinions are the gift of free democracy and I for one will defend this gift.

My wife and I often vote for different candidates at elections and she has different political views than me. Hallelujah.

Everyone is different im not judging but i dont know how you managed that but im impressed

I met my late wife at a uni sit in in 1976 , 40 odd years later we were together at the Domain in the climate strikes

I would not be able to share my bed with someone who did not share my values but kudos to you for doing so !

[Bangalore Swans]

Everyone is different im not judging but i dont know how you managed that but im impressed

I met my late wife at a uni sit in in 1976 , 40 odd years later we were together at the Domain in the climate strikes

I would not be able to share my bed with someone who did not share my values but kudos to you for doing so !

Out of interest, at what point did you go all in on Chad? A mate of mine who watched some Swans training sessions in the pre-season said “look out for Chad”. He said that in the pre-season that Chad was smashing in physically and could have an exciting season.

Also like your views on J-Mac. He owns his wing and supports brilliantly in defence and attack. Composed ball user as well.

[TheBloods]

Out of interest, at what point did you go all in on Chad? A mate of mine who watched some Swans training sessions in the pre-season said “look out for Chad”. He said that in the pre-season that Chad was smashing in physically and could have an exciting season.

Also like your views on J-Mac. He owns his wing and supports brilliantly in defence and attack. Composed ball user as well.

Not that early . You have said i saw Chad's potential before others but i watched the same preseason hitouts everyone else did . I caught some glimpses of him at training in the 19/20 preseason and he tackled like a maniac but didnt see enough of him to know if he would be the player he has become . That scratch match against GWS in Feb he showed all the right signs , quick as lightning cuts teams open with his sprinting, never goes backwards, uses it well, wants every ball to be his . No pressure on the kid but he was superstar material from day dot this yr and hasn't looked backwards

Still have vivid memories of Voss and Lappin carving us up back at the start of the century , couple of star mids .. they were the All Australian centreman and wingman three years running from 01-03, excellent partnership , dont wanna curse it but i think we could be looking at something similar here with Chad and Jmac They think the same way and play the same way though different builds and different roles of course

[Blood Fever]

Not that early . You have said i saw Chad's potential before others but i watched the same preseason hitouts everyone else did . I caught some glimpses of him at training in the 19/20 preseason and he tackled like a maniac but didnt see enough of him to know if he would be the player he has become . That scratch match against GWS in Feb he showed all the right signs , quick as lightning cuts teams open with his sprinting, never goes backwards, uses it well, wants every ball to be his . No pressure on the kid but he was superstar material from day dot this yr and hasn't looked backwards

Still have vivid memories of Voss and Lappin carving us up back at the start of the century , couple of star mids .. they were the All Australian centreman and wingman three years running from 01-03, excellent partnership , dont wanna curse it but i think we could be looking at something similar here with Chad and Jmac They think the same way and play the same way though different builds and different roles of course

Theatre of the absurd

[TheBloods]

Theatre of the absurd

You can doubt it if you like doesnt make a difference to me , they need to work hard if they want to get to that level but they have all the right tools to work with so im buying stocks !

[SwanSand]

Ok well you asked for numbers so if your interested you can read the below or if you have already made up your mind that im wrong then dont bother

RB is not in the top 5 for contested possessions for his age group - ahead of him are Serong, Anderson, Butters, Green and Walsh

He is 10th for clearances - ahead of him are CHAD, Smith, Collier-Dawkins, Butters, Bytel, Serong, Green, Anderson and Walsh

He is 10th for inside 50s - ahead of him are Schoenberg, Rozee, Perkins, Thomas, Serong, Gulden, CHAD, Lukosius and Walsh

He is 12th for disposals - ahead of him are Quaynor, Lukosius, Duursma, Sholl, Green, Serong, Butters, Ash, Anderson, Smith and Walsh

He is 13th for score involvements - ahead of him are CHAD, Serong, Woodcock, Green, Ben King, Max King, Pickett, Gulden, Butters, Smith, Weightman and Walsh

Stats arent everything but because of his limited ability Rowbottom needs to be accumulating and doing everything by quantity to make up for what he lacks in quality.

E.g. he is not top 5 barely top 10 in any desirable category you could rate a player of his age yet he is top 5 in two very undesirable categories for his age - Clangers (5th) and Turnovers (5th)

Numbers back up the eye test which shows he is a mid who doesnt get anywhere near enough of it which is why he tackles so much, and when he does get it hes either not making much happen with his disposals or hes plain turning it over. I talk about it so much because it is frustrating and a point of concern that we are giving games and making list decisions and team tactics around a player who does not belong in this role. I am accused of hating him but on the contrary i think the way he is tracking he will be off the list by the time his next contract is up in 3 years . That would be a shame to see of someone who seems like a great kid and who has strengths that could be better utilised elsewhere. Lockdown defender or pressure fwd and id be confident in him being a fine player for this club , could play 300 games and that is what i WANT. Why is it so hard to accept i rate him as a player just dont think hes a midfielders A-hole

The question was about Chad but anyways you found another reason to talk about Rowbottom. That’s fine.
Thanks for the homework by the way.

I am sure if you had a bit of humility that you would have looked at your own numbers that you have provided and realised that RB seems to be quite a good player and certainly not the one you are making out to be hopeless ! He sits in good company with those names and certainly looking like a player who would do well going forward.

He is number 6 in contested possesions, probably number one for tackling, and sits well in all other categories where a lot of the players in the list are either front half players or back half players where their teams are struggling or they are absolutely top 10 picks who you would expect to do well.

And I am also sure the difference between where he is with regards to his numbers and where he needs to get to to be top 5 in all categories is probably not huge.

Hopefully with his body developing more he will stand in the middle of the ground and be a fine player in all the things the coaches want him to develop in.

Chad is doing extremely well and we have done well to recruit him at a lower pick. But just like he dropped to his pick because he was not burning the house down at 16-18 years of age to be top 10 pick every player develop at different rates. Eg If Josh Kennedy was an elite player at a younger age Hawthorn would not have let him go.

[TheBloods]

The question was about Chad but anyways you found another reason to talk about Rowbottom. That’s fine.
Thanks for the homework by the way.

I am sure if you had a bit of humility that you would have looked at your own numbers that you have provided and realised that RB seems to be quite a good player and certainly not the one you are making out to be hopeless ! He sits in good company with those names and certainly looking like a player who would do well going forward.

He is number 6 in contested possesions, probably number one for tackling, and sits well in all other categories where a lot of the players in the list are either front half players or back half players where their teams are struggling or they are absolutely top 10 picks who you would expect to do well.

And I am also sure the difference between where he is with regards to his numbers and where he needs to get to to be top 5 in all categories is probably not huge.

Hopefully with his body developing more he will stand in the middle of the ground and be a fine player in all the things the coaches want him to develop in.

Chad is doing extremely well and we have done well to recruit him at a lower pick. But just like he dropped to his pick because he was not burning the house down at 16-18 years of age to be top 10 pick every player develop at different rates. Eg If Josh Kennedy was an elite player at a younger age Hawthorn would not have let him go.

See above if you wanna know what i think of Chad

[Roadrunner]

I see i am beat. No one agrees with me and the only poster who at least has the courtesy to give the benefit of the doubt instead of taking swipes then gets accused of being a troll too . I am not out to cause conflict so i will zip it on Rowbottom. Really do wish the best for him and have only expressed my views maybe repetitively out of genuine concern for him and the team. I wont mention him again but let it be known where i stand on him and where i think he should be playing ! Save me having to say it every time i talk about changes ! Apologies to anyone offended

Happy to hear that TB! it is up to the coaches to pick the role and the correct position for each player and this applies to Rowbottom, obviously. Your figures show that he is there or thereabouts, but who do you suggest take his place in midfield, given we are resting our newest recruits? And if Horse were inclined to move him to defence, which few of us would agree with, just whose place would he take? If you say Lloyd’s, where would you move him?

Lloyd is needed in our fragile backline at present, so in effect you are suggesting that RB be consigned to the two’s!

[TheBloods]

Happy to hear that TB! it is up to the coaches to pick the role and the correct position for each player and this applies to Rowbottom, obviously. Your figures show that he is there or thereabouts, but who do you suggest take his place in midfield, given we are resting our newest recruits? And if Horse were inclined to move him to defence, which few of us would agree with, just whose place would he take? If you say Lloyd’s, where would you move him?

Lloyd is needed in our fragile backline at present, so in effect you are suggesting that RB be consigned to the two’s!

Straight swap with Hewett

[Roadrunner]

Straight swap with Hewett

No- Hewett is needed as a tagger/ or midfield in rotation. Has been poor as a defender, though versatile enough to rotate occasionally. Too good to be left out of the team at this stage. We have Dawson on the other flank, so please try again.