2021 trading, drafting and list management: players and personnel

[Markwebbos]

So, two things:

- If young Dylan Stephens was tempted to leave because of limited opportunities to date (leaving aside, his own down year led to omissions - and I say that as a fan), what the chance he sees Dawson's departure as opening up a wing slot he could seize? I'd love to keep him, as reckon his upside is significant.

- A lot of the media speculation suggests Port is ahead of Adelaide in the race for Dawson, because they're in a window. I get Adelaide itself is a way off finals, let alone a flag . . . but are we so sure Port are in a window?? I get they have some good young players like Georgiades, Bergman and the three 2018 draft picks. But, I'm not sure they're not like Geelong, with a tranche of older players (Gray, Boak, Dixon, Jonas, Motlop, Lycett) who could easily drop off the cliff the next couple of years. Sure, Dawson replaces some of that. Port also had an average record against the elite sides this year. Don't get me wrong, they've got enough quality to make the eight in the next few years, but a real flag level list . . . I'm unconvinced. And our job from here as a club is to get the two Adelaide teams into Jordan's head as options, start the bidding war and extract a maximum dividend.

I agree that Port's relationship with "the window" may be more tenuous than it looks, given the age of some of their players. And JD is a Crows supporter.

Why not send him to Adelaide for pick 23 plus a player ... how about Fogarty or McAsey

[Molly dooker]

Not a stupid question at all. My understanding is that the two Clubs can informally agree to the trade deal beforehand but all of the paperwork can only be lodged once the trade period officially begins. I would be surprised if the Dawson deal is resolved quickly.

Thank you.

[liz]

I agree that Port's relationship with "the window" may be more tenuous than it looks, given the age of some of their players. And JD is a Crows supporter.

Why not send him to Adelaide for pick 23 plus a player ... how about Fogarty or McAsey

If the Swans insisted on Fogarty plus a (non-first round) draft pick, I suspect the Crows wouldn't be able to say yes fast enough. He's a very one dimensional player, and one they've given limited opportunities to.

I have less of an opinion on McAsey's playing ability, but I suspect he'll try to relocate to Melbourne as fast as he credibly can. I know he extended his initial period with the Crows, but I don't reckon he'll stay there long term.

I'm finding it hard to get excited about this year's draft, particularly the top end. I suspect there will be the usual number of long term players emerge from the draft overall, but the interruptions that these young men have endured to their under-age footy must have hampered their development, and this also presents greater than normal challenges to recruiters in determining their AFL potential. I reckon you're as likely to find the eventual best players with a second or third round pick as you are an early pick, with the possible exception of the top 3 (two of whom are father-son tied).

[i'm-uninformed2]

If the Swans insisted on Fogarty plus a (non-first round) draft pick, I suspect the Crows wouldn't be able to say yes fast enough. He's a very one dimensional player, and one they've given limited opportunities to.

I have less of an opinion on McAsey's playing ability, but I suspect he'll try to relocate to Melbourne as fast as he credibly can. I know he extended his initial period with the Crows, but I don't reckon he'll stay there long term.

I'm finding it hard to get excited about this year's draft, particularly the top end. I suspect there will be the usual number of long term players emerge from the draft overall, but the interruptions that these young men have endured to their under-age footy must have hampered their development, and this also presents greater than normal challenges to recruiters in determining their AFL potential. I reckon you're as likely to find the eventual best players with a second or third round pick as you are an early pick, with the possible exception of the top 3 (two of whom are father-son tied).

Hard agree to this. It looks, in part because the bulk of players bar the big three, are all mids and similar, and part because they lost a lot of ground over the past two years due to COVID.

I'd be big on us stacking three picks in the 12-30 range, and going for need - which is KPPs, and that range seems to be where a lot of the KPP draft talent seems to be predicted to fall. There seems to be half a dozen KPPs in that range on most draft boards. I'm clueless as to exactly the right ones, but Kinnear and Co can sort that out.

[Agent 86]

Say JD does land at Port, who'll be the most nervous amongst their current crop about being forgotten on match days?

[COB]

I'd prefer us to take a punt on the young one (Hayes is it?) then Ladhams. A member of my extended family broadly follows Port (he watches a lot AFL broadly as was very late to the game - but if he had a 'team' it would be Port), and his view is similar on Ladhams.

I agree MCS. I think Ladhams more of a second ruck/forward of which we have plenty. Hayes if any good would take over from Hickey in a year or two and provide as hard to see Naismith returning.

[Bloods05]

I think this is a more likely outcome than receiving a first round pick this year. Adelaide won't want to give up pick 4, and as I think Port will be reluctant to give up this years 1st rounder either, given they then would have nothing until the 60s in what has been said is a very shallow draft. Depends if they get currency from other potential trades.

Would not necessarily be a bad outcome for us - we could seek to on-trade it if we wanted to look to move up this year, or keep it knowing it would leave us with a good starting hand for next year's draft, knowing we do have some potential academy and F/S prospects to come over the next couple of years.

Who are the F/S prospects?

[Ludwig]

Why not send him to Adelaide for pick 23 plus a player ... how about Fogarty or McAsey

I think both Fogarty and McAsey have been disappointing. In any case, I don't think Adelaide will part with either since they've gutted out their backline and forward line. McAsey hasn't been able to break into the side this year and just signed a new contract to 2023, but remains a long term flight risk to Victoria. Fogarty has a terminal lazy streak. I can't see us getting any players from Adelaide. I'd be looking at their 2nd rounder this year and something next year.

There have been several sources saying that PA's pick 16 + Hayes might be a go. I don't think PA are that happy with their ruck situation, even though they've got 3 capable of playing at AFL level. The feeling is that none are close to the top echelon they need to compete for a premiership. I think pick 16 + Hayes is a good deal for us. We may do a pick swap into 2022 as Port would probably like a 2nd rounder this year.

It's often hard to get players in this kind of trade. It just becomes too complicated, especially if a player is contracted. That's why most of these trades end up for draft picks only.

[Auntie.Gerald]

Is there a defender come forward opportunity ie like a Barry Hall or reverse Heath Grundy CHF who became a strong defender?

Or a Tom McDonald from backline to a forward and this season has kicked more goals than Sam Reids last 3 seasons?

Having another traded in tall defender that can contribute in the backline and certainly help our 2022 but we may see him as a key forward of the future as above etc?

For me Lizard will help out Rampe, Melican, Tom when needed but another key tall traded in who can impact 2022 will be critical while we are in a 2022 window with Bud, Kennedy, Rampe, Parker etc

[mcs]

If the Swans insisted on Fogarty plus a (non-first round) draft pick, I suspect the Crows wouldn't be able to say yes fast enough. He's a very one dimensional player, and one they've given limited opportunities to.

I have less of an opinion on McAsey's playing ability, but I suspect he'll try to relocate to Melbourne as fast as he credibly can. I know he extended his initial period with the Crows, but I don't reckon he'll stay there long term.

I'm finding it hard to get excited about this year's draft, particularly the top end. I suspect there will be the usual number of long term players emerge from the draft overall, but the interruptions that these young men have endured to their under-age footy must have hampered their development, and this also presents greater than normal challenges to recruiters in determining their AFL potential. I reckon you're as likely to find the eventual best players with a second or third round pick as you are an early pick, with the possible exception of the top 3 (two of whom are father-son tied).

Some very astute points as always Liz. It does seem to be a difficult draft year to pick, and hence it would not surprise me at all if we do manage to prise a 1st rd draft pick out, it'll be one for next year rather than this year. I'd be suprised if we take more than the minimum 3 from the draft (which I think many clubs may do similar), and stock up a bit for next year, to give some flexibility around options for the 2022 draft. If it was Adelaide, extracting one of their 2nd round picks alongside next years first (maybe with some pick swapping etc as needed to balance it) could be a pretty decent outcome. If we could have 3 picks in the nominal first 30 odd this year, then we could have some room for further on trading to try and get up the order a bit this year with our 1st pick, or be able to say 'we will take 3 in the first two rounds and leave it at that' and give ourselves a bit more draft ammunition for next year, when all things going well hopefully the draft group will have had a more normal end to their junior footy.

I could see a similar situation with port (next year's first rounder), but with some player as part of the equation instead (given they hold no picks till the 60s after their first pick this year).

[mcs]

Who are the F/S prospects?

Leo Barry's kid (2023) is said to be tracking along pretty well, and I thought there was another one potentially on the horizon too? But happy to be corrected if I've got wires crossed.

I won't attempt to answer the Academy one - as there are much better informed people on here, but my understanding was there were a couple of pretty decent prospects for season 2022.

[Ludwig]

Someone named Heeney2Franklin on Big Footy is plagiarizing my work. He's just cutting and pasting parts of my comments without attribution.

I'm not a member of Big Footy, so can't comment on there about it. But I wouldn't mind if some duel members would call him out on it.

Sounds like a job for Bangalore Swans to call out unethical practices.

[barry]

Regarding draft order, port Adelaide officially finished 3rd, so pick 16.
We finished 7th, pick 12.
Adelaide finished 15th, pick 4.

Discos and any other academy picks will push these out a bit.

[liz]

Someone named Heeney2Franklin on Big Footy is plagiarizing my work. He's just cutting and pasting parts of my comments without attribution.

I'm not a member of Big Footy, so can't comment on there about it. But I wouldn't mind if some duel members would call him out on it.

Sounds like a job for Bangalore Swans to call out unethical practices.

It's not the first time that has happened. Someone was regularly cutting and pasting pre-season training reports written by one of our members 20 or so months ago. Very poor form, as it would be if anyone cut and paste material from BF and posted it on here. Even without attribution, I think it's pretty poor form, as it means comments are read out of context of the discussion that they were contributed to. Pasting a link to the discussion on the other forum is OK, if someone thinks it might be of interest.

[Agent 86]

Someone named Heeney2Franklin on Big Footy is plagiarizing my work. He's just cutting and pasting parts of my comments without attribution.

I'm not a member of Big Footy, so can't comment on there about it. But I wouldn't mind if some duel members would call him out on it.

Sounds like a job for Bangalore Swans to call out unethical practices.

Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery… but cmon BS!